.327 Federal Club thread
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Creek Henry
New member
In order to put my father's old 7.65 Argentine Mauser back in to service I got a chamber insert for it in 32H&R and I reloaded some rounds with 95gr pills that more than duplicate the 32mag's performance (from a 26" barrel though). That round is a thumper. To say it isn't effective is just plain wrong. But, its potential is being limited by it being loaded into mostly short barreled guns.
With the muzzle blast/flash of the .327 out of a snubby, he's more likely to have his clothing catch fire with the shorter barrel than the longer one ......
....Colorado Redneck is using H110 for his handloads- I've seen the two foot flame my 6" barrelled .357 makes with H110 loads ...... FLAME ON!
"Your Honor, I aks'd th' Defendant for some spare change, and he shot me six times and SET ME AFIRE!!!!!!!!!!!!111111111!"
;/
Billy Shears
New member
Two foot flames! 
Hmmm, tell me more about the fire breathing properties of H110. I have 500 Hornady 100 grain XTPs, a big pile of fully prepped brass and a pound of H110. And I have the whole weekend dedicated to assembling them all together, but I've never used this powder before. This sounds like it will be interesting.
Hmmm, tell me more about the fire breathing properties of H110. I have 500 Hornady 100 grain XTPs, a big pile of fully prepped brass and a pound of H110. And I have the whole weekend dedicated to assembling them all together, but I've never used this powder before. This sounds like it will be interesting.
Even out of a 6" .357 Revolver, it puts on a pretty impressive Sturm-und-Drang show....... at an IDPA mini-match, I was one of the later entrants, and the first target in the scenario was very close- the string started with the weak hand on the target, and at the "beep", the shooter was to push off the target while stepping back, drawing from and putting two rounds into the target ....... so there were 40+ holes in the middle of this cardboard target, all covered with pasters ..... the middle of the "0 down" zone was pretty much held together with pasters........ the lighting was dimmed (part of the scenario) ....... At the "beep", I pushed off, stepped back, drew to retention, BLAM! BLAM! ...... the muzzle flash was dazzling but the cloud of scorched pasters and cardboard drifting down around and behind the target was just as disconcerting ...... when they scored the target, they deciced to just assme "0 down", as there was a hole in the center big enough to put your hand through,surounded with powder burns, and some of the pasters covering bullet holes around it were blown off......
I'd like to see a pic of a max load of H110 out of a snub in dim light........
Colorado Redneck
New member
H110 out of 327 SP101
One evening at our indoor range I shot 50 rounds of 327 Fed Mag 100 gr xtp over 12.7 gr of H110. The lighting is not really bright in this indoor range anyway, and that evening it seemed a bit less well lit---maybe it was the lane I was in....whatever. Anyway, the fire coming out in front of the cylinder gap was very impressive, and the muzzle flash was lighting up the lane really good. That would be impressive to see in the dark if there was a gun fight in a parking lot or something.
Hope I never get that opportunity.
One evening at our indoor range I shot 50 rounds of 327 Fed Mag 100 gr xtp over 12.7 gr of H110. The lighting is not really bright in this indoor range anyway, and that evening it seemed a bit less well lit---maybe it was the lane I was in....whatever. Anyway, the fire coming out in front of the cylinder gap was very impressive, and the muzzle flash was lighting up the lane really good. That would be impressive to see in the dark if there was a gun fight in a parking lot or something.
Hope I never get that opportunity.Billy Shears
New member
Just got back from test firing my new H110 loads. I used 100 grain Hornady XTPs.
Good shooting. The load I used wasn't nearly as sinus-clearing as the 100 grain American Eagle factory stuff, thank goodness, but far more snappy than my plated bullet plinking rounds I load with Unique. It felt and sounded powerful. I didn't have a chrono with me and the wind was blowing like crazy, but at 7 yards standing and firing double action I was able to put them one after another into 1.5" groups. I'll never win any competitions shooting like this, but it's a good result for me and I don't flinch with the .327 like I tend to do with the .357 after a few cylinders of hot stuff.
Next week I hope to try some milk jug and wet phone book tests with several different loads to satisfy my curiosity.
I've been up and down on the .327 for about three years now, but have finally come to the conclusion that I really like it. It may not be the final word on handgun cartridges, but so what. It does what it was designed to do and does it well in my opinion. Some like it, some don't. Each to his own. It works for me so I'm going to stick with it. Honestly, I wasn't pleased with the .327 SP101 I owned a while back, but I'm really happy with the .327 GP100. The extra inch of barrel makes a big difference...to me. Maybe not to others. That's fine. I enjoy shooting this revolver and I seem to do it well, by my standards.
This whole week I've been firing the .327 GP-100 side by side with the .357 GP-100 I've owned since back in the 80s. I like them both, but that extra round makes a difference in my mind, especially when it's a round of significant power.
Anyway, just a quick trip report.
Now if Ruger would just get off their duffs and bring out the .327 Single Six all would be right with the world.
Carry on.
Good shooting. The load I used wasn't nearly as sinus-clearing as the 100 grain American Eagle factory stuff, thank goodness, but far more snappy than my plated bullet plinking rounds I load with Unique. It felt and sounded powerful. I didn't have a chrono with me and the wind was blowing like crazy, but at 7 yards standing and firing double action I was able to put them one after another into 1.5" groups. I'll never win any competitions shooting like this, but it's a good result for me and I don't flinch with the .327 like I tend to do with the .357 after a few cylinders of hot stuff.
Next week I hope to try some milk jug and wet phone book tests with several different loads to satisfy my curiosity.
I've been up and down on the .327 for about three years now, but have finally come to the conclusion that I really like it. It may not be the final word on handgun cartridges, but so what. It does what it was designed to do and does it well in my opinion. Some like it, some don't. Each to his own. It works for me so I'm going to stick with it. Honestly, I wasn't pleased with the .327 SP101 I owned a while back, but I'm really happy with the .327 GP100. The extra inch of barrel makes a big difference...to me. Maybe not to others. That's fine. I enjoy shooting this revolver and I seem to do it well, by my standards.
This whole week I've been firing the .327 GP-100 side by side with the .357 GP-100 I've owned since back in the 80s. I like them both, but that extra round makes a difference in my mind, especially when it's a round of significant power.
Anyway, just a quick trip report.
Now if Ruger would just get off their duffs and bring out the .327 Single Six all would be right with the world.
Carry on.
alaskabushman
New member
I have always been intrigued by the .327, I would love to shoot one someday. I think it could be very useful for a broad range of uses despite what a lot of folks say. If I ever actually see one in a gun shop I'd be very tempted to pick it up.
Win1886 - Since the .327 was designed around a 3" platform, I think a .327 K-frame based on the old S&W Model 65 would be quite the carry gun. Especially if they could slide a 7th shot into the cylinder.
In the longer barrel, I imagined a new Model 16 using the partial underlug featured on earlier magnums. That'd make it look like a Model 19 with a 5-inch barrel. That'd be sweet. Make it available in a 4 and 5 inch lightweight M&P version for hikers and campers.
Slip the .327 into an L-frame with a 4-5" round barrel, fixed sights, retro half-moon front sight and a partial "magnum" underlug (7 maybe 8 shots) and you'd have a new model we might call the Outdoorswoman.
In the longer barrel, I imagined a new Model 16 using the partial underlug featured on earlier magnums. That'd make it look like a Model 19 with a 5-inch barrel. That'd be sweet. Make it available in a 4 and 5 inch lightweight M&P version for hikers and campers.
Slip the .327 into an L-frame with a 4-5" round barrel, fixed sights, retro half-moon front sight and a partial "magnum" underlug (7 maybe 8 shots) and you'd have a new model we might call the Outdoorswoman.
Where does the belief that the .327 was designed around a 3" platform come from? It seems to me that it was designed around the .32 H&R Mag with a goal of .357 Mag performance without exceeding .44 Mag pressures. I have found those criteria mentioned in articles. It then seems that gun manufacturers chose the platforms to offer it in.
From Ruger & Federal, actually.
Just before they released the .327 cartridge, Federal produced a short video for the cartridge and the Ruger SP-101. At the time, the (prototype) Ruger was the only revolver chambered for the round. In the video, they said the .327 was specifically developed for the 3-inch Ruger as an all-around carry gun.
The goal, according to Federal was to produce a round with the energy of the .357 Magnum with less recoil, to give an effective self-defense option to those who were unable to handle the often vicious recoil of a .357 in a small gun.
The video made it quite clear that all of the R&D for the round was done using the 3-inch SP-101 revolver. The selection and blending of powders, flash suppressants, etc were all done using a 3-inch barrel as the "standard length" for cartridge development.
Cosmodragoon
New member
BillCA wrote:
I've heard about this but I haven't seen the video. Did they choose the 3" target first and work towards it? If they optimized the cartridge for performance at three inches, it doesn't necessarily follow that three inches will be optimal for what they produced. For instance, it looks like the jump to four inches picks up almost 150fps. It should also stabilize shooting. Muzzle flash is a common complaint with the .327 and the porting of those short barrels makes it worse. It seems like bumping up to four inches could really do a lot to improve performance.
Sure, an extra inch can decrease concealability but is it enough to matter? I guess we should also consider the jump from shorter snubs to 3" if concealability is that important. Another question is if I need to go that small, do I really want flashy .327 for the job? I feel like there is a curve for comfort and effective power relative to purpose and size. In a defensive pocket revolver, I like .32 H&R. For medium regular carry, I would love a 4" SP101 in .327. For heavier carry, I like a 5" .357. Needs beyond that start getting out of the realm of "regular carry".
I've heard about this but I haven't seen the video. Did they choose the 3" target first and work towards it? If they optimized the cartridge for performance at three inches, it doesn't necessarily follow that three inches will be optimal for what they produced. For instance, it looks like the jump to four inches picks up almost 150fps. It should also stabilize shooting. Muzzle flash is a common complaint with the .327 and the porting of those short barrels makes it worse. It seems like bumping up to four inches could really do a lot to improve performance.
Sure, an extra inch can decrease concealability but is it enough to matter? I guess we should also consider the jump from shorter snubs to 3" if concealability is that important. Another question is if I need to go that small, do I really want flashy .327 for the job? I feel like there is a curve for comfort and effective power relative to purpose and size. In a defensive pocket revolver, I like .32 H&R. For medium regular carry, I would love a 4" SP101 in .327. For heavier carry, I like a 5" .357. Needs beyond that start getting out of the realm of "regular carry".
Cosmodragoon,
I wish I could find the original video. I'll have to search the other computer to see if maybe I was able to capture it. IIRC the goal was to produce a cartridge in .32 caliber (i.e. using existing bullet stocks) that was nearly as powerful as the .357 Magnum with less recoil and less of the nasty snot-loosening blast and concussion of the .357 Mag suitable for use in a personal defense revolver.
So going into the project, they knew it would have to produce high velocities out of a short-barreled revolver. They made it sound as though Ruger helped by providing the 3-inch SP-101 (3-1/16" nominal) which was chosen for it's solid construction. Whether that was done as a custom build or they provided an SP-101 in .32 H&R for Federal to ream out, I don't know.
Again, from memory; The Federal team experimented with some customized blended powders and found that they could push .32 caliber pill up to 1400 fps while keeping chamber pressures within reasonable limits. Apparently this was an issue early on with some powders used in test rigs. Some of their conventional powders produced pressure readings considered to high for practical use.
More work was done for accuracy and then again to add flash suppressants. The final product met their goals of producing true magnum performance from a snub gun while keeping recoil manageable for those who are intimidated by the .357 Magnum.
The round is "optimized" for the 3" barrel as it needs that length to build up enough steam to produce the 400-500 ft-lbs energy range from a short 3-inch launcher.
Opinion: Given the pressure limitations -- see reference list below -- the .327 Federal performs as well or better than the .357 Magnum from a short barrel. This satisfies the goal of making a small carry/protection gun with less recoil. And the "bonus" of a sixth round in the "J-frame" sized package. It's not perfectly optimized, of course, because there is some powder that burns outside the muzzle. Capture this powder in a longer barrel and it gives you some excellent ballistic results for a small cartridge.
SAAMI Cartridge Max Pressure Specs
9mm Luger.......... 35,000
9mm Luger +P....... 38,500
32 S&W Long.........15,000
32 H&R Mag......... 21,000 cup
357 Magnum......... 35,000
357 Maximum........ 40,000
10 mm.............. 37,500
41 Magnum.......... 36,000
44 Magnum.......... 36,000
Specifications are in PSI except as noted.
I wish I could find the original video. I'll have to search the other computer to see if maybe I was able to capture it. IIRC the goal was to produce a cartridge in .32 caliber (i.e. using existing bullet stocks) that was nearly as powerful as the .357 Magnum with less recoil and less of the nasty snot-loosening blast and concussion of the .357 Mag suitable for use in a personal defense revolver.
So going into the project, they knew it would have to produce high velocities out of a short-barreled revolver. They made it sound as though Ruger helped by providing the 3-inch SP-101 (3-1/16" nominal) which was chosen for it's solid construction. Whether that was done as a custom build or they provided an SP-101 in .32 H&R for Federal to ream out, I don't know.
Again, from memory; The Federal team experimented with some customized blended powders and found that they could push .32 caliber pill up to 1400 fps while keeping chamber pressures within reasonable limits. Apparently this was an issue early on with some powders used in test rigs. Some of their conventional powders produced pressure readings considered to high for practical use.
More work was done for accuracy and then again to add flash suppressants. The final product met their goals of producing true magnum performance from a snub gun while keeping recoil manageable for those who are intimidated by the .357 Magnum.
The round is "optimized" for the 3" barrel as it needs that length to build up enough steam to produce the 400-500 ft-lbs energy range from a short 3-inch launcher.
Opinion: Given the pressure limitations -- see reference list below -- the .327 Federal performs as well or better than the .357 Magnum from a short barrel. This satisfies the goal of making a small carry/protection gun with less recoil. And the "bonus" of a sixth round in the "J-frame" sized package. It's not perfectly optimized, of course, because there is some powder that burns outside the muzzle. Capture this powder in a longer barrel and it gives you some excellent ballistic results for a small cartridge.
SAAMI Cartridge Max Pressure Specs
9mm Luger.......... 35,000
9mm Luger +P....... 38,500
32 S&W Long.........15,000
32 H&R Mag......... 21,000 cup
357 Magnum......... 35,000
357 Maximum........ 40,000
10 mm.............. 37,500
41 Magnum.......... 36,000
44 Magnum.......... 36,000
Specifications are in PSI except as noted.
So basically, when you say the cartridge was developed for a 3" barrel you mean Federal's factory ammo's powder charge was optimized for the 3" barrel? I can dink around with handloads for any particular gun chambered in a particular cartridge and say I've developed the cartridge for a particular barrel length? Wow! That somehow makes me feel very powerful. 
My 327 cartridges were developed for a 2" barrel.
My 327 cartridges were developed for a 2" barrel.
BillCA, excellent post. It seems as though it is missing a very small but very relevant nugget in that SAAMI Max pressure for the .327 Federal is set at 45,000 PSI.
It's noticeable. It's why ATK/Federal factory loads and factory offered primed brass is built with the CCI-400 Small Rifle primer.
It's higher pressure than any "typical" handgun round in the modern day, mainstream chamberings. (not that .327 Federal is necessarily "mainstream", but excepting monsters such as the .460 Magnum and various niche & competition-oriented boutique calibers)
I've found that my brass simply isn't going to last as long as .357 Magnum brass, likely due to the pressure. A longitudinal case split is a more than casual occurrence.
It's noticeable. It's why ATK/Federal factory loads and factory offered primed brass is built with the CCI-400 Small Rifle primer.
It's higher pressure than any "typical" handgun round in the modern day, mainstream chamberings. (not that .327 Federal is necessarily "mainstream", but excepting monsters such as the .460 Magnum and various niche & competition-oriented boutique calibers)
I've found that my brass simply isn't going to last as long as .357 Magnum brass, likely due to the pressure. A longitudinal case split is a more than casual occurrence.
full case load
New member
Sevens, Excepting the variables of load, at how many loadings do you see the split?
Cesure,
I'm not sure if you're being facetious, smarmy or insulting.
Sevens,
Thanks for the added data elements. The laptop I'm on doesn't have all the .327 info I've previously downloaded and I forgot what the pressure spec was.
I've not taken the time to look for loading data on the .327, however I suspect that reloaded ammo will have a considerably more noticeable muzzle flash than factory. That's given Federal's statements about adding flash suppressants after establishing their mixture of powders.
I'm not sure if you're being facetious, smarmy or insulting.
Sevens,
Thanks for the added data elements. The laptop I'm on doesn't have all the .327 info I've previously downloaded and I forgot what the pressure spec was.
I've not taken the time to look for loading data on the .327, however I suspect that reloaded ammo will have a considerably more noticeable muzzle flash than factory. That's given Federal's statements about adding flash suppressants after establishing their mixture of powders.