.308 Home Defense?

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For inside home defense, nothing will beat a cut down 870 or 1100. Just keep it legal. Next would probably be a semi auto in 40 S&W. For inside rifle or close quarters outside the M1 Carbine is ideal. Any one of these will provide good stopping power without excessive penetration.
 
From Eppie:
Home defense=12 gauge for any engagement at 50 yards or less
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In most cases for HD I would guess that shot would be a good choice. In your case (50 yards), are you using slugs? If so, wouldn't that be excessive penetration for room to room?
 
No slugs, too much penetration. 00 buck shot, will fling any intruder across the room like a rag doll. Instant death. Anybody behind him would likely get knocked down as well.

A .308 (my favorite rifle caliber) has too much penetration, even if it's an hollow point, will go through an intruder and sheetrock like... well ...a bullet.
 
No slugs, too much penetration. 00 buck shot, will fling any intruder across the room like a rag doll. Instant death. Anybody behind him would likely get knocked down as well.
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There is so much wrong about this statement that it isn't even funny.... It is funny though that even after saying how it will "fling any intruder across the room" you go on to say this:

A .308 (my favorite rifle caliber) has too much penetration, even if it's an hollow point, will go through an intruder and sheetrock like... well ...a bullet.
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So, a 12 ga will send someone flying across a room, but it is actually the .308 that has too much penetration?....

And again. You don't have the correct concept of bullet choice nor the understanding that not all hollow points are the same. A fast, light, varmint type round out of a .308 will actually penetrate less than 00 buck out of a 12 ga.


*And neither are guaranteed to be "instant death"
 
Allaroundhunter, you are correct there is no guarantee of instant death, but I think we can all agree that it would be better to hit an intruder with 15 pellets (51 grains each) simulteneously then one bullet (150 grains).

I'm not going to argue with you about your tests and your results. I can get scientific and disect your tests, but the bottom line is: 15 simulteneous holes are better than 1, in the world I live in.

Thanks for the link Grumpa72
 
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Allaroundhunter, you are correct there is no guarantee of instant death, but I think we can all agree that it would be better to hit an intruder with 15 pellets (51 grains each) simulteneously than one bullet (150 grains).
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No, we really can't. If you think that a v-max round stays in one piece upon contact with flesh then you are very wrong. That v-max round can fragment into more than 15 pieces and the energy transfer will cause hydrostatic shock.

And then since the OP wanted to limit over-penetration as best as possible, again, the .308 is a better choice than a 12 ga (especially a 3" magnum round).

**I would also not use a 3" magnum round of 00 buckshot for home defense. I would use your standard 2 3/4" shell with 8 pellets.
 
I am not going to call another person a "fool" without actually meeting them and talking firsthand.

I would also not consider this arguing per se, it is more of just me explaining to you how your points are invalid. I will inform people when they are being fed false information that could lead to a poor decision, or a decision made for the wrong reasons. If that makes me a "fool" to you, then there is nothing that I can do about that.

Opening by saying "instant death" does not lend itself to good information in any following post.
 
No slugs, too much penetration. 00 buck shot, will fling any intruder across the room like a rag doll. Instant death. Anybody behind him would likely get knocked down as well.
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Sometimes we unintentionally reveal our complete lack of experience and understanding of ballistics without intending to do so.

That is really bad on several levels.
 
I have more confidence and practice with it than my 870 and I would like to start using it for home defense.
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Practice more with your 870!

If you have others that live in your home with you use bird shot. Bird shot at close range will do serious damage to us weak humans and won't go through your walls on to the neighbors house..

Shotgun does = great home defense gun!
 
You can argue ballistics all day but when in a HD and time is everything which would you want to use one .308 or one 12 gauge (15 pellets)?

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Eppie, do you understand where your argument is flawed?

If you did we could move past this whole 15 pellets vs. 1 projectile and flinging people across the room business...

I will take the 12 ga, but that is because my only .308 is a Remington 700.

If in the OPs situation, I would take the .308 with (get this) varmint rounds. (not soft point hunting rounds)

There are viable reasons for taking a 12 ga over .308, but when the OP wants to limit over penetration, what you are recommending is not one of those reasons.
 
I gotta agree with allaroundhunter. I don't think 12 gauge is the "fling you across the room" death ray that some people (like Eppie) purport it to be. It's a devastating round, but a vmax .308 is going to hold its own, with less concern of overpenetration, far more ammo capacity, a semi auto action and with similar to less noise (and with a suppressor, far less noise than an 18" shotgun with 00 buck)

.308 seems practical to me for home defense
 
This statement:
Eppie said:
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00 buck shot, will fling any intruder across the room like a rag doll
...
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pretty well kills any hope for this one:
Eppie said:
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I can get scientific and disect your tests
...
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and spreads a pretty thick layer of irony over this one:
Eppie said:
...
"Never argue with a fool, people might not know the difference."
...
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You don't want .308 anything if ...

1. You have family members in the house
2. Kids...see 1
3. Neighbors any where close.

I can guarantee that any house built in the last 10 years or so .308 will fully penetrate. At least to the point of being very very unwise.

There are far better loading.

Think about what the police use for drug raids. They have the same concerns you have or should have. Killing innocent folks and over penetration. What do they use ?
 
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