#1 Buck for HD

Back while the earth was still cooling and dinosaurs were nibbling on the tropical rain forests everywhere, I took my first hunter safety course. The instructor suggested that #1 buck was the way to go for deer, because of adequate pellet size and higher pellet count per shell.

I tried it. Never could get it to pattern worth a darn.

More than four decades later, I'm still looking for a shotgun/barrel that will pattern #1 buck worth a darn.

Meanwhile Federal LE127 00 does exactly what I want it to do pattern wise.

There's still a stack of #1 buck from a big-box outdoor store ammo clearance sale a few years back waiting in a .50 cal ammo can marked MISC BUCK, in case a shotgun that will pattern it well ever turns up. And I'm still checking every 12 ga. that comes in the door with it. Still no joy on getting any kind of decent pattern with #1 buck, though.

lpl
 
Wakeman's write-up was why I started touting #1 buck, but it's so damn hard to find locally, you practically have to order it. So normally, I use 00, which Wakeman considers second best.
 
From COUNTZERO:
In addition, number 1 buck is less likely to over-penetrate and exit an attacker's body."

HOGDOGS:
"If he is bleeding out front and rear than he will bleed out twice as quick, thus depriving the brain of the required oxygen quicker thus leaving my family free from the threat all the quicker."

Brent
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I disagree. Once a vital organ is hit (heart, lungs, liver, pancreas...) it is going to leak blood into the chest/abdominal cavity depriving the brain/heart of oxygenated blood just as fast regardless of entrance or exit holes to the body. If you poke a hole in a water balloon (vital organ) that is in a bucket full of water it is going to leak out (bleed) into the bucket of water (abdominal or thoracic cavity) just as fast as if you poke a hole in the water balloon and the bucket of water (skin- or entrance/exit hole/wound). It's a good thought, just not physiologically correct, which is why #1 buck still has the edge as far as wound channels go. 00 is way easier to find though
 
Blakester, I am fairly convinced that the "thang" people have with 00 Buck is exactly that for quite some time it was pretty much the ONLY thing you'd find.

People generally seem to be in one of two camps regardless: sand-sized shot dove-loads are the same as a slug at the end of a hallway or 00 Buckshot is the smallest effective pellet and had better be backed up with alternating slugs in the magazine tube.

"Birdshot is for birds" cries one group. "Buckshot is for bucks" should yell the other. Sounds silly? But buckshot was for hunting BUCKS and Black Bear. Is 3-1/2" 000 Buckshot even better? Some of you are saying "ayup, sure 'tis" when of course it isn't. Regardless, that isn't what was on the shelves -- 2-3/4" 00 Buck was.

It was bigger than BB shot (which is what I bought to celebrate the Rodney King verdict -- probably got the last of it), and there was nothing much in between. Once in a while, ONCE in a while, you'd find 00 in boxes of 25, probably at a gun show. That was when we shopped for ammo in a brick and mortar store. When we could pick the stuff up off of a shelf. When it was almost always in stock and you weren't limited to how many boxes you bought. When a kid dropping out of high-school didn't ask you if it was for a pistol or a rifle. When you weren't asked for proof you were over 18.

Now the internet. More choice. More competition. And lots of access to data and distilled information by analytical folk that has to be ignored to keep to them thar old wives tales...
 
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I use slugs for HD.

Slugs out of my Remington 1100 will not penetrate the walls of my brick house.

Don't ask me how I know this.

Your mileage may definitely vary...
 
OP asked about home defense. In most rooms of my house the pellets will still remain an almost solid column of lead less than an inch in diameter. Birdshot, 4B, 1B, OOB probably won't make much difference indoors but I'm going with OOB because overpenetration is not an issue and a shot out or thru either door isn't out of the question.
If I lived in an appartment I'd lean towards #9 birdshot. In my little spot on the prairie it's OOB with two slugs on the buttstock. YMMV
 
`for you 20 gaugers

·number 2 buck is available, but you will progably have to go online to find it. It shoots very smothly in my semi-auto and doesn`t kick to bad in my pump.
20 gauge also has some devastating slug rounds. They are the pricey sabot types, but you are not going to shoot many for HD.
 
Because of age (61), surgeries, (total shoulder replacement), and infirmities (arthritis) I can no longer manage the heavy recoil of a 12ga. My wife (62) never could handle a 12ga; but continues to upland hunt with a 20ga. At present we have three shotguns available for home defense......
• 16ga SxS loaded with Federal® 2¾" #1 Buckshot (#F164-1B)
• 20ga SxS loaded with Remington® 2¾" #3 Buckshot(#SP-20-3BK)
• 20ga pump loaded with Federal® 2¾" #2 Buckshot (#F207-2B)
 
The idea really isn't about over-penetration, it's about creating he most perforations of vital tissue - Sixteen holes to a depth of 14"

Which is more than a slug - (1 hole not counting the wad), 8 wound channels for #000 Buck, 9 to 12 for #00 Buck...
 
Correct answer: because #0 Buck (.32 caliber) at 45 yards arguably all the way down to #2 Shot (.15 caliber) at less than 15 yards is actually more effective -- higher liklihood of hits, and more of them, with required penetration.

I KNOW it is just easier to say "umm, 00 Buck" than understand power, range, penetration, wound channels and stopping capability.
 
This sounds a bit like 9mm vs .40 vs .45. :D

As many others have stated, I'm a big fan of the Federal FliteControl 00 Buck ammo. I love the predictability and control it gives me. I like the reduced recoil load a bit more for follow-up shots.

I've been patterning it out of my defensive shotguns for some time now and have been nothing but impressed.
 
The Firearms Tactical Institute reports:

"Number 1 buck is the smallest diameter shot that reliably and consistently penetrates more than 12 inches of standard ordnance gelatin when fired at typical shotgun engagement distances.
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I think I've seen some gelatin tests that show penetration of lead BB out to 14 - maybe he means all of the pellets don't make it 14" #4 Buck seems to go 14" Here are the jello tests:

http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=109958
 
Range, fellas, range. Sheesh. Those gelatin shots are great but were taken at a range of 3 yards for the light pellets and 5 yards for the bigger Buckshot. Do you guys think about what the operating range of a shotgun is? Again, not knowing, you'd have to conclude you'd want #1 or 0 Buckshot.

That is unless you are after a buck or bear...
 
lead head said:
Peter Hathaway Capstick was writing about this back in the 70's for Guns & Ammo. I believe his book, Last Horizons is the one with great info regarding buckshot. #1 buck is the way to go.
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IIRC, Capstick swore by #1 buckshot for hunting leopards in rough brush
My big gripe with #1 buck is recoil.


Dave McC said:
#1 buck seems to be where the lines cross on the graph for pellet size and quantity. I've yet to find a load, however, that patterns as tightly as my pet 00 rounds. If and when I find one, I may switch. Meanwhile, I'll continue with "Old" Estate 00 R/R.....
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Estate RR 00 buck threw magnificent paterns from my IC 870 Express! Then one day it disappeared from the Natchez catalog.. :(
 
COuntZerO

"I think I've seen some gelatin tests that show penetration of lead BB out to 14 - maybe he means all of the pellets don't make it 14" #4 Buck seems to go 14" Here are the jello tests:

http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=109958 "

You need to look at the calibration BB on those tests. It should penetrate 3.34 inches. You'll see the BB in these blocks is anywhere from 4.5 to 6 inches. This is a sign they used the blocks at too warm a temperature or they are not a 10 percent mix. You can easily deduct 20% at minimum from these penetration numbers. Some cases it's much more.
 
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