1.5 seconds from draw to fire thread

My draw time depends on whether I'm sitting or standing. From a standing position, I can draw in about 1 second - on average. From a sitting position it will be about 4 seconds, because I pocket carry. Either I must stand up or wriggle it out of my pocket.

First, the average human can't sprint 100 yards at 17 or even 15 mph. Maybe 12-13mph.

Second, potential assailants aren't likely to sprint at you - that would be too easy to defend against and that kind of thing would draw too much attention. They will likely distract you, or target those who are distracted.

Third, if you ever have to use your gun, you are not necessarily going to have to "fast-draw" to ward off an unsuspecting attack. You will probably get a "hinkey" feeling about something or someone and get your hand on your gun while still concealed. For example, if I have to pull into a gas station late at night to pump gas (which happens frequently), I'll have one hand on the pump and my other hand on my gun in my pocket. I'll also have my cell phone nearby and will be constantly looking around. Another "trick" I use in this situation is I always clean my windows & check my tires - lets me quickly move around my car if someone approaches me - I don't just sit there looking to talk to strangers.
 
Im kind of curious how some of these times were achieved.
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When I talk about the .5 second area I'm talking about drawing my 642 from my pocket and getting the first shot off.

I use a shot timer, and start with my hand in my pocket pretty much gripping the revolver. BUT, that's how I walk around, with my hands in my pocket.

In another topic I posted some random pictures of me standing around, wearing my "air force gloves".

When I shoot competition, Steel Challenge, ICORE, USPSA, etc, I start from the surrender position. But to be honest, in competition I really don't know the time of the first shot because I haven't checked. The time is based on the time to complete the stage. I'll have to work on that, check it out.

Sure, like anything else it takes practice. I have blue guns (plastic training non guns), a J Frame, a K Frame (ICORE revolver) and a Beretta, (the last two is what I normally shoot in competition) and I do set around practicing my draw, or in the case of the J Frame, getting it out of my pocket in weird positions, setting on the couch, at the table, in the truck, or just walking around.

I'm old (64) if I can do it anyone can. I will confess in competition, I don't do that well but its the "reloading" the pistol or revolver that gets me. I do have to work on that part. I really like revolvers and I simple can't compete in many of those matches with a "6" shot revolver against a 14-18 round magazine.............but its what I like to shoot, and I shoot for fun.

It's like the Tourist asking the Cab Driver "How do you get to Carnegie Hall"...."Practice man, practice".
 
CaptainObvious, I can't tell you where you are going wrong. I can tell you that at my previous IDPA club, most of us could do the following:

1) face 180 away from the targets;
2) at the buzzer, turn and draw (only bring the muzzle up when facing the targets) IE About Face and draw;
3) shoot double taps to center mass on three targets

And the typical times were 3-4 seconds, including the turn, the draw, and the three double-taps.

If it takes 1.5 seconds for a prepared shooter to draw and double tap a target he is already facing, something is off.
 
Just to give perspective, I'm not a pro shooter, but I dabble in USPSA Production Division. From a start position of facing away from the targets, hands by head, turn, draw, shoot 3 targets (modified El Preaidente with a no shoot overlap) with double taps freestyle, reload, shoot same 3 targets with double taps strong hand only, I can get it done in just under 6 seconds. That's drawing from a Bladetech DOH holster. I'm not the fastest (I'm working on it though), but that shows you what the average guy can do.
 
Let me clarify. This is a video demonstrating exactly what I consider a good draw and fire.

http://youtu.be/BKcHsLUhNTQ?t=5m20s

#1. Timing is done with a reputable purpose-made shot timer. The shot-timer is set to a random interval.

#2. Firearm is holstered open carry.

#3. A target is set a reasonable distance away. We could debate the distance and size of the target.

#4. You have to hit the target for it to count.

#5. Hands are not on the holstered firearm. Lets say to your sides.

This guy made it in about 1.5 seconds. So, using this method, how can you get it down to under 1 second?
 
I don't get to practice from a holster, so FWIW. In your scenario, which as I understand it is an attacker rushing from ~30ft. The video is not exactly a good comparison, hitting a target at a distance would be different from hitting someone who is now standing right in front of you.

IMO a better comparison would be setting a target at maybe a 1-3 yards as that would approximate the distance of the rushing attacker after reacting and drawing. I'm pretty sure most of the guys and gals here who get to practice this kind of stuff would make good hits at that range under the same constraints. I'd also guess aimed fire might go out the door in favor of point shooting in the scenario and at a much shorter range than ~30ft.
 
CaptainObvious

I'd recommend you take in and observe a Steel Challenge, or other action pistol match. I think you'd be supprised.

The video you showed was simular to a steel match, normaly you shoot five 8-12 inch plates, the 5th being a stop plate, from the holster and surrender position. Plates are normally 30 feet.

That's much different then drawing and hitting a bandit target at 3 yards or so.
 
To draw and fire an aimed shot at 30 feet in 1.5 seconds is not bad. Like kraig indicates, where draw speed actually counts is up close and personal. If it comes to that you have already failed and are trying to play catch up with an aggressor. Part of our qualification (USBP) was 3 shots in 2 seconds at 3 yards. From my level 3 retention holster I routinely did it at 1 second or less.
 
1.5 sec is a LONG TIME. My fastest draw and fire (FBI "Q" head shot at 3 yards) is 0.86 from t-shirt concealment out of an open top kydex holster. That was draw, press out, and fire at near full extention. And I wouldn't consider myself a super fast "quickdraw" guy.

Heck, Dave Sevigny holds the record on the Pistol-Training.com FAST drill with 2 head shots (3x5 box), a reload, and 4 shots into a 8" circle at 7 yards in 3.64 seconds. He could probably draw and dump a magazine in 1.5 seconds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qU3jceN4JAc

Another one... Todd Green from concealment on a reduced size target at 20 yards in 1.45

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BaCIsjs2Wlc&feature=related

Granted, these are world class shooters, but I don't consider to be a 1.5 hit on target anywhere within 10 yards to be "fast".
 
In Steel Challenge matches, I often see shooters on the “Smoke & Hope” stage draw and miss the 1st target (18X24” at 9 yds) in under a second. The shooters who get hits are usually running around 1 – 1.5 seconds. There are faster shooters, but they’re usually shooting “Open” guns from competition holsters. The ones shooting in USPSA or IDPA classes are doing well to beat 1.5 sec. I’m not talking about the local champs, I’m talking about the above-average, serious amateur.

On the stages where the 1st target is smaller and further away, times increase dramatically. Add in having to draw from a concealment holster during a surprise attack, and all bets are off.
 
So here's another chance to plug the concept of learning some basic hand to hand skills, specifically skills at evading and/or redirecting a physical attack, in order to gain space and time to draw and shoot.

The difference between a trained person and the typical person is that if one charges a well-trained person, the well-trained person should get out of the way virtually as a matter of conditioned reflex.
 
In a real situation you can start the timer with my hand already on the grip. I don't walk around in condition white and there's no such thing as a fair fight to the death... Don't blink or you'll miss it.
 
I am 62. Standing at 5 yards on snow and ice, hands at my sides and wearing a 1911 OWB under an unzipped heavy winter coat, I can get two aimed A-zones in 1.6 seconds using a random delay on my timer.

My thought is that situational awareness is of somewhat more value to me than speed.

Cooper wrote that no draw is as fast as the one that's unexpected, so I use Gomer Pyle as my role model: "Surprise, surprise, surprise!" I've only had to draw a concealed firearm once for real. They were surprised.
 
This is a really great training tool to use to time yourself on draw, presentation and dry fire at home utilizing your computer monitor. As always, make sure your gun is unloaded and cleared before doing this unless you just enjoy buying monitors. I use the small targets as they pop up in random areas so you don't get conditioned to just aiming for the center. The various targets are on the right side and they have a variety of delay and visibility options to choose from.

http://www.personaldefensetraining.com/pages/DryfireDrills
 
On Shooting USA's Impossible Shots, Jerry Miculek drew from the buzzer, transitioned his revolver from his strong to his weak hand and fired two shots left-handed on a silhouette target. Elapsed time from the buzzer to the second shot was 0.98 seconds.
 
Ready, set, go!

Rapid motor skills can be obtained. With training, you can perform neat tricks.

Just make sure that in real life you pick the correct scenario for your skill. So if a baddy gets the drop on you because you're holding a greasy Burger King food tray contemplating a Mr. Pibb, kindly ask him for a duel where your fast draw is sure to bring you victory!
 
Here's the thing, my fat butt can cross a substantial distance and knock someone out before they can get to and use their CCW weapon. That is why it is so critical for you to understand the dynamics of a use of force situation. Most people stand there flat footed drawing their weapon, simply a deer in the headlights.

You have to be able to move, get out of his line of power. Get something between you that he has to go around. The ability to use physical force, to keep your area clear, to use his force against him is absolutely critical.

Then there is nothing more than eye contact. I don't know how many times I've had inmates slip up on me, and I'm thinking to do no good, only to back down when I looked at them. Criminals can do blitz attacks, but mostly they are sneaky. Simply knowing that they have lost the element of surprise is enough to deter them. Being lost in your thoughts, or walking around looking at the ground is like a sheep feeding on grass.

But, watch the level of eye contact as a simple look taken too long can be interpenetrated as a challenge.
 
I wanted to wait until I got to the range to post anything here.

I can draw from concealment and fire in about a second. The .357 is a tad faster, the .45 slower. Even better, I did some drills I hadn't done for a few year, and did a sidestep while I was drawing, and that worked out well. I put the first shot from both exactly where I wanted them consistently.

To me, you only need to look at 10 yard splits to understand this thread. If a pro football player can do a 1.5 sec split (stop to first 10 yards of a 40) it is not unreasonable in my mind to think that you could see someone on the street capable of that or something close to it. I would hope that it wouldn't ever get that close.
 
From Captain Obvious: This guy made it in about 1.5 seconds. So, using this method, how can you get it down to under 1 second?
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Practice. With a timer.

One of the secrets to learning something is knowing that it can be done. The US guarded the secret of the atomic bomb in WW ll -- al long as our enemies thought it was impossible, their efforts to create one were less intense.

The fellow in your example video is slow by today's competition standards. Pick better examples, and try to emulate them.
 
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