yet ANOTHER shooting rampage!
- Thread starter Jffal
- Start date
What are the current rights for those
with diagnosed mental illness regarding
legal ownership of firearms? Are such
patient records still so confidential
that an individual could deny on paper he
or she had such a condition or even was
insitutionalized and that person's word
would be accepted?
Also, what happens if a citizen who
legally owned a firearm developed a
diagnosable mental illness that affected
judgement and whatnot (not a behavior
quirk or eccentricity but fullblown out
psychological problems)? Should any
legislative entity be trusted with this
information and be expected to handle the
matter in a responsible fashion...or are
we allowing Big Bro to probe deeper into
our lives at the expense of enforcing the
law against a minority of individuals?
Jeff
Portrait of a loner emerges _Police in
Pittsburgh say no one who knew the
suspect saw a rampage coming.
http://www.phillynews.com/inquirer/2000/A
pr/30/front_page/PSHOOT30.htm
April 30, 2000
Portrait of a loner emerges
Police in Pittsburgh say no one who knew
the suspect saw a rampage coming.
By Leonard N. Fleming
and Barbara Boyer
INQUIRER STAFF WRITERS
PITTSBURGH - As police continued their
investigation yesterday of an immigration
lawyer they say fatally shot five people
- including three immigrants - a picture
of a wealthy young man who became an
alienated recluse began to emerge.
Authorities said there may be further
clues to the apparent hate-crime in a
two-page note found in the Mount Lebanon
home where Richard S. Baumhammers, 34,
lived with his prosperous and successful
parents. Investigators declined to say
what was in the note, which they believe
Baumhammers typed.
Baumhammers was arrested Friday afternoon
after allegedly killing a Jewish woman
who was a next-door neighbor; an Indian
man shot at an Indian grocery; two Asian
men shot at a Chinese restaurant; and an
African American man shot at a karate
school.
Another man of Indian descent was shot in
the neck and critically injured.
Twice Baumhammers stopped to fire rounds
at two synagogues, one filled with
children in day care in a back room. He
also spray-painted the word Jew and two
swastikas on the synagogue wall.
When Baumhammers was arrested, police
said his Jeep was littered with spent
shells, the .357 Magnum used in the
shootings, and a suspected incendiary
device.
Baumhammers himself is the son of Latvian
immigrants. His parents were so
successful in their new country that they
reared their son in affluence and
privilege in a Pittsburgh suburb of
judges and doctors and business leaders.
Baumhammers' parents, both dentists, were
described as "pillars of the community"
by the husband of the next-door neighbor
Baumhammers allegedly killed.
Andrejs Baumhammers once served as
chairman of the School of Dental Medicine
at the University of Pittsburgh. Inese
Baumhammers also taught dentistry at the
school.
They emigrated from Latvia in the late
1940s and early 1950s.
At Baumhammers' home, lawyer William
Difenderfer answered the door yesterday
morning, saying he could not discuss the
case, his client or, the family.
"They're devastated as to what happened
and they are extremely sympathetic to the
victims and their families," Difenderfer
said. "Right now, we're trying to piece
things together."
Friday's 72-minute rampage across a
20-mile stretch of southwestern
Pennsylvania happened just two months
after another deadly shooting outbreak in
the Pittsburgh suburbs. On March 1,
Ronald Taylor, who is black, allegedly
killed three white men and wounded two
others in working-class Wilkinsburg.
"I've been around a long time and it just
amazes me," said Officer Ray Kaskie, a
34-year veteran of the police force in
Scott Township, where Baumhammers is
accused of shooting at the Beth El
Congregation synagogue and painting
swastikas on the walls.
"I don't think it's racial tension. I
think it's just those who have hate in
them," Kaskie said.
But no one who knew him thought
Baumhammers had this in him.
According to police, neighbors, high
school classmates and other family
acquaintances, Baumhammers grew up
enjoying privileges that were expected to
make him successful in life.
He graduated from Mount Lebanon High
School in 1984, got his undergraduate
degree from Kent State University, and
went on to graduate from Cumberland Law
School in Birmingham, Ala.
While there, he spent a semester at the
University of Heidelberg in Germany.
After law school, Baumhammers earned a
master's degree in transnational business
practice from the University of the
Pacific McGeorge School of Law in
Sacramento, Calif.
Moving to Atlanta, Baumhammers passed the
Georgia bar exam in 1993 and became a
member of the Georgia Bar Association. In
the mid-1990s, he lived in an upscale
neighborhood about 10 miles north of the
city.
His career slowed in the late 1990s when
he moved back to Pittsburgh and listed
himself as the Baumhammers Law Firm,
using his parents' address. He later let
his bar association membership in
Allegheny County lapse.
Few knew him as a friend. He did,
however, spend time in a computer chat
room on America Online, using the name
Rbaumhamme and gabbing with a 15-year-old
girl and her 21-year-old sister.
In an American Online profile,
Baumhammers said he had lived in Riga,
Latvia, and Pittsburgh. His interests
included "international travel, sports,
fine wine and other things!" and he
listed "international attorney at law" as
his occupation. He included a personal
note at the bottom of the profile that
said: "And this too shall pass."
After moving back in with his parents, he
did so little professionally and
personally that some neighbors didn't
even know he was back and couldn't say
when he had returned.
In trying to find out about him, "we
asked for friends. We got none," said an
Allegheny County Police homicide
detective who requested anonymity. "He
was a person who just did things alone."
Arthur W. Walker, 64, vaguely recalled
coaching Baumhammers when he played
football at Mount Lebanon High School in
1983. He quit after three weeks, Walker
said.
After consulting with other coaches from
that period, Walker recalled that
Baumhammers had not associated with his
teammates, one of whom was Brian
Williams, who went on to play center for
the New York Giants.
"He was either alone or with a small
group of friends," Walker said.
Walker said that coaches had seen
Baumhammers as a lineman; he wanted to be
a punter. It wasn't working, so
Baumhammers bowed out.
"I don't remember why. He just left,"
Walker said. "I assume he wasn't doing
too well as a punter."
After he was arrested, Baumhammers
swaggered and grinned as he was led away
in handcuffs. So incensed were people by
photos and TV footage showing him
smirking that police, fearing he would be
shot himself, made him wear a bulletproof
vest.
As police continued their investigation
and residents filled talk-radio airwaves
with demands for Baumhammers' execution,
the sites where the slayings occurred
became shrines. People left bouquets of
flowers, sympathy cards and teddy bears.
Her eyes filled with tears, Roseanne
Pitocco knelt in silence and left flowers
in front of the India Grocers store. An
avid fan of Indian films, she said she
had been seeking advice from the Indian
man killed about the best movies to rent.
"I just felt I had to do something," she
said. "He's just a really nice guy."
Pitocco said it was a "sad statement"
about society that something such as this
had happened.
"I think more people care than don't,"
she said. Referring to Baumhammers, she
added: "He's not the norm. Thank God for
that."
At the upscale Ya Fei Chinese Cuisine,
parents brought their children to peek
inside the closed store or to lay a
wreath of flowers in front.
Alex Celento, 8, in his game-day soccer
attire, walked slowly up to the door to
pray for the two victims while his
mother, Kim, and brother Andrew, 4,
watched from the car.
"I would say that I hope those people had
nice lives and get safely to heaven,"
Alex said.
His mother said that was where Alex and
his grandmother would come to shop. When
he saw it on the news, she said, he just
had to see it.
"It's very sad to have to explain this to
all the kids," Kim Celento said.
Leonard N. Fleming's e-mail address is
lfleming@phillynews.com
with diagnosed mental illness regarding
legal ownership of firearms? Are such
patient records still so confidential
that an individual could deny on paper he
or she had such a condition or even was
insitutionalized and that person's word
would be accepted?
Also, what happens if a citizen who
legally owned a firearm developed a
diagnosable mental illness that affected
judgement and whatnot (not a behavior
quirk or eccentricity but fullblown out
psychological problems)? Should any
legislative entity be trusted with this
information and be expected to handle the
matter in a responsible fashion...or are
we allowing Big Bro to probe deeper into
our lives at the expense of enforcing the
law against a minority of individuals?
Jeff
Portrait of a loner emerges _Police in
Pittsburgh say no one who knew the
suspect saw a rampage coming.
http://www.phillynews.com/inquirer/2000/A
pr/30/front_page/PSHOOT30.htm
April 30, 2000
Portrait of a loner emerges
Police in Pittsburgh say no one who knew
the suspect saw a rampage coming.
By Leonard N. Fleming
and Barbara Boyer
INQUIRER STAFF WRITERS
PITTSBURGH - As police continued their
investigation yesterday of an immigration
lawyer they say fatally shot five people
- including three immigrants - a picture
of a wealthy young man who became an
alienated recluse began to emerge.
Authorities said there may be further
clues to the apparent hate-crime in a
two-page note found in the Mount Lebanon
home where Richard S. Baumhammers, 34,
lived with his prosperous and successful
parents. Investigators declined to say
what was in the note, which they believe
Baumhammers typed.
Baumhammers was arrested Friday afternoon
after allegedly killing a Jewish woman
who was a next-door neighbor; an Indian
man shot at an Indian grocery; two Asian
men shot at a Chinese restaurant; and an
African American man shot at a karate
school.
Another man of Indian descent was shot in
the neck and critically injured.
Twice Baumhammers stopped to fire rounds
at two synagogues, one filled with
children in day care in a back room. He
also spray-painted the word Jew and two
swastikas on the synagogue wall.
When Baumhammers was arrested, police
said his Jeep was littered with spent
shells, the .357 Magnum used in the
shootings, and a suspected incendiary
device.
Baumhammers himself is the son of Latvian
immigrants. His parents were so
successful in their new country that they
reared their son in affluence and
privilege in a Pittsburgh suburb of
judges and doctors and business leaders.
Baumhammers' parents, both dentists, were
described as "pillars of the community"
by the husband of the next-door neighbor
Baumhammers allegedly killed.
Andrejs Baumhammers once served as
chairman of the School of Dental Medicine
at the University of Pittsburgh. Inese
Baumhammers also taught dentistry at the
school.
They emigrated from Latvia in the late
1940s and early 1950s.
At Baumhammers' home, lawyer William
Difenderfer answered the door yesterday
morning, saying he could not discuss the
case, his client or, the family.
"They're devastated as to what happened
and they are extremely sympathetic to the
victims and their families," Difenderfer
said. "Right now, we're trying to piece
things together."
Friday's 72-minute rampage across a
20-mile stretch of southwestern
Pennsylvania happened just two months
after another deadly shooting outbreak in
the Pittsburgh suburbs. On March 1,
Ronald Taylor, who is black, allegedly
killed three white men and wounded two
others in working-class Wilkinsburg.
"I've been around a long time and it just
amazes me," said Officer Ray Kaskie, a
34-year veteran of the police force in
Scott Township, where Baumhammers is
accused of shooting at the Beth El
Congregation synagogue and painting
swastikas on the walls.
"I don't think it's racial tension. I
think it's just those who have hate in
them," Kaskie said.
But no one who knew him thought
Baumhammers had this in him.
According to police, neighbors, high
school classmates and other family
acquaintances, Baumhammers grew up
enjoying privileges that were expected to
make him successful in life.
He graduated from Mount Lebanon High
School in 1984, got his undergraduate
degree from Kent State University, and
went on to graduate from Cumberland Law
School in Birmingham, Ala.
While there, he spent a semester at the
University of Heidelberg in Germany.
After law school, Baumhammers earned a
master's degree in transnational business
practice from the University of the
Pacific McGeorge School of Law in
Sacramento, Calif.
Moving to Atlanta, Baumhammers passed the
Georgia bar exam in 1993 and became a
member of the Georgia Bar Association. In
the mid-1990s, he lived in an upscale
neighborhood about 10 miles north of the
city.
His career slowed in the late 1990s when
he moved back to Pittsburgh and listed
himself as the Baumhammers Law Firm,
using his parents' address. He later let
his bar association membership in
Allegheny County lapse.
Few knew him as a friend. He did,
however, spend time in a computer chat
room on America Online, using the name
Rbaumhamme and gabbing with a 15-year-old
girl and her 21-year-old sister.
In an American Online profile,
Baumhammers said he had lived in Riga,
Latvia, and Pittsburgh. His interests
included "international travel, sports,
fine wine and other things!" and he
listed "international attorney at law" as
his occupation. He included a personal
note at the bottom of the profile that
said: "And this too shall pass."
After moving back in with his parents, he
did so little professionally and
personally that some neighbors didn't
even know he was back and couldn't say
when he had returned.
In trying to find out about him, "we
asked for friends. We got none," said an
Allegheny County Police homicide
detective who requested anonymity. "He
was a person who just did things alone."
Arthur W. Walker, 64, vaguely recalled
coaching Baumhammers when he played
football at Mount Lebanon High School in
1983. He quit after three weeks, Walker
said.
After consulting with other coaches from
that period, Walker recalled that
Baumhammers had not associated with his
teammates, one of whom was Brian
Williams, who went on to play center for
the New York Giants.
"He was either alone or with a small
group of friends," Walker said.
Walker said that coaches had seen
Baumhammers as a lineman; he wanted to be
a punter. It wasn't working, so
Baumhammers bowed out.
"I don't remember why. He just left,"
Walker said. "I assume he wasn't doing
too well as a punter."
After he was arrested, Baumhammers
swaggered and grinned as he was led away
in handcuffs. So incensed were people by
photos and TV footage showing him
smirking that police, fearing he would be
shot himself, made him wear a bulletproof
vest.
As police continued their investigation
and residents filled talk-radio airwaves
with demands for Baumhammers' execution,
the sites where the slayings occurred
became shrines. People left bouquets of
flowers, sympathy cards and teddy bears.
Her eyes filled with tears, Roseanne
Pitocco knelt in silence and left flowers
in front of the India Grocers store. An
avid fan of Indian films, she said she
had been seeking advice from the Indian
man killed about the best movies to rent.
"I just felt I had to do something," she
said. "He's just a really nice guy."
Pitocco said it was a "sad statement"
about society that something such as this
had happened.
"I think more people care than don't,"
she said. Referring to Baumhammers, she
added: "He's not the norm. Thank God for
that."
At the upscale Ya Fei Chinese Cuisine,
parents brought their children to peek
inside the closed store or to lay a
wreath of flowers in front.
Alex Celento, 8, in his game-day soccer
attire, walked slowly up to the door to
pray for the two victims while his
mother, Kim, and brother Andrew, 4,
watched from the car.
"I would say that I hope those people had
nice lives and get safely to heaven,"
Alex said.
His mother said that was where Alex and
his grandmother would come to shop. When
he saw it on the news, she said, he just
had to see it.
"It's very sad to have to explain this to
all the kids," Kim Celento said.
Leonard N. Fleming's e-mail address is
lfleming@phillynews.com
Jeff Thomas
New member
There will always be murderous, evil people in the world. And, some of them will become politicians.
That is why we have the RKBA. Human nature (unfortunately, in this respect) tends to be pretty consistent over time.
To be frank, I agree with Glenn re: the conspiracy talk. Possible? Perhaps. But way out there, in my opinion. I think the better explanation is that there is either no increase in such crimes, or maybe, maybe a small increase. The truth is that there has been a massive increase in press coverage. And, as a population grows, the raw number of unusual and catastrophic events grows - look at it from a statistical standpoint. A 'free' media bent on destroying civil rights sensationalizes such events, and voila ... less freedom.
Regards from AZ
That is why we have the RKBA. Human nature (unfortunately, in this respect) tends to be pretty consistent over time.
To be frank, I agree with Glenn re: the conspiracy talk. Possible? Perhaps. But way out there, in my opinion. I think the better explanation is that there is either no increase in such crimes, or maybe, maybe a small increase. The truth is that there has been a massive increase in press coverage. And, as a population grows, the raw number of unusual and catastrophic events grows - look at it from a statistical standpoint. A 'free' media bent on destroying civil rights sensationalizes such events, and voila ... less freedom.
Regards from AZ
Glenn,
We agree that illegal violence of all kinds has many causes. Such violence is
perpetrated by individuals and groups - groups such as street gangs, hate
groups such as the KKK, and government-controlled groups such as BATF,
FBI, INS, DEA, Border Patrol, etc.
We agree that to accuse the government of *instigating* shooting rampages
by civilians is unrealistic and degrades our effectiveness. But let’s not forget
the government you support so strongly plans and carries out “rampages” as
well. Ref Waco, Ruby Ridge, and God only knows how many instances of
excessive force by various government agencies.
Is there a conspiracy? You betcha!
The conspiracy is not in the *creation* of the civilian rampages but in the
*reporting* and *use* of those rampages to serve the government goal of
civilian disarmament.
- Look how the government uses rampages to support gun control but totally
ignores (or refutes) civilian use of firearms to prevent or stop criminal
activity.
- Look at the news media and it’s policy of “If it bleeds, it leads!”
So you see, Glenn, there is a conspiracy. And some folks are unwitting
supporters of the conspiracy to make us all properly subservient to the
elitists who would rule us. Therefore, the “conspiracy” includes the
brain-washing idea that we must continue to support those who want us
disarmed; that we must “gain by losing” and compromising away our Rights
as we have done since Prohibition.
Another (largely unwitting) conspiracy is the desire to deprive nutsos and
bigots of the Right to express themselves. Let me suggest to you that as
much as you and I abhor the racist trash we see at gun shows, we must
*not* be swept up in any “conspiracy” to undermine our First Amendment.
If you don’t like the stuff you see on TV, turn off the TV. If you don’t like
what you see at gun shows, walk past them, stop and argue with them,
ignore them, or simply avoid gun shows. But as soon as you decide whose
views can be expressed, you have joined the government “conspiracy” on the
“slippery slope”.
Most of all, Glenn, I vehemently disagree with your statement, “The RKBA -
the Rx for bigots.”
RKBA is the Rx for freedom!
Like any prescription, it can be abused. How about indicating a bit more
exactly those whom who you consider unworthy of the protection of our
Constitution and Bill of Rights. Your label of “RKBA folk” fits too many fine
people too well for me to accept your additional caveats of “nutso” and
“racist”.
------------------
Either you believe in the Second Amendment or you don't.
Stick it to 'em! RKBA!
We agree that illegal violence of all kinds has many causes. Such violence is
perpetrated by individuals and groups - groups such as street gangs, hate
groups such as the KKK, and government-controlled groups such as BATF,
FBI, INS, DEA, Border Patrol, etc.
We agree that to accuse the government of *instigating* shooting rampages
by civilians is unrealistic and degrades our effectiveness. But let’s not forget
the government you support so strongly plans and carries out “rampages” as
well. Ref Waco, Ruby Ridge, and God only knows how many instances of
excessive force by various government agencies.
Is there a conspiracy? You betcha!
The conspiracy is not in the *creation* of the civilian rampages but in the
*reporting* and *use* of those rampages to serve the government goal of
civilian disarmament.
- Look how the government uses rampages to support gun control but totally
ignores (or refutes) civilian use of firearms to prevent or stop criminal
activity.
- Look at the news media and it’s policy of “If it bleeds, it leads!”
So you see, Glenn, there is a conspiracy. And some folks are unwitting
supporters of the conspiracy to make us all properly subservient to the
elitists who would rule us. Therefore, the “conspiracy” includes the
brain-washing idea that we must continue to support those who want us
disarmed; that we must “gain by losing” and compromising away our Rights
as we have done since Prohibition.
Another (largely unwitting) conspiracy is the desire to deprive nutsos and
bigots of the Right to express themselves. Let me suggest to you that as
much as you and I abhor the racist trash we see at gun shows, we must
*not* be swept up in any “conspiracy” to undermine our First Amendment.
If you don’t like the stuff you see on TV, turn off the TV. If you don’t like
what you see at gun shows, walk past them, stop and argue with them,
ignore them, or simply avoid gun shows. But as soon as you decide whose
views can be expressed, you have joined the government “conspiracy” on the
“slippery slope”.
Most of all, Glenn, I vehemently disagree with your statement, “The RKBA -
the Rx for bigots.”
RKBA is the Rx for freedom!
Like any prescription, it can be abused. How about indicating a bit more
exactly those whom who you consider unworthy of the protection of our
Constitution and Bill of Rights. Your label of “RKBA folk” fits too many fine
people too well for me to accept your additional caveats of “nutso” and
“racist”.
------------------
Either you believe in the Second Amendment or you don't.
Stick it to 'em! RKBA!
Dennis and Glenn, I agree with you 100% on the media overhyping these shootings. And I would ask you both to look at my topic "Should we go after NBC" under Legal/Political. I'm looking for some feedback and additions/subtractions before trying to take this show on the road.
Thanks,
Dick
Thanks,
Dick
Glenn E. Meyer
New member
Dennis, Dennis - before you shoot you should know your target and respond to the point.
You are talking about things, I never said.
Where did it say that I support the government so strongly? Your emotional response without really thinking doesn't make sense.
I was directly saying that those who suggested that this shooting was actually instigated by the government and not as it now seems the product of some mentally ill-racist are mistaken. And I will say it again - you can off into conspiracy land if you wish but you do a disservice to the RKBA by such meanderings.
As far as my last line - tough. The NRA
supported and helped black Americans in their fight against racists. Did you forget it?
The RKBA is a cure for such folks. I say it proudly. So if you disagree with it, you ignore reality.
Free speech is one of our greatest freedoms.
But, I say to you that people who have to sell materials suggesting the death of those they disagree are not worthy supporters of the RKBA.
Nor did I characterize all RKBA folks as bigots - learn how to read.
I said:
One glaring weakness of the RKBA folk is too go off into nutso land and see conspiracies.
This dude will turn out to have problems and they will be related to some focus on racial
issues.
I was right on this guy or do you think he was a agent of Reno?
If one studies persuasion and group attitudes, you would know that a stupid argument poisons the well for later rational arguments.
If someone says to me, given the loon, why should we have guns?
One answer: Yep, he must be an agent of Reno, thus, it wasn't our (RKBA folk) fault.
or:
This man was mentally ill. Folks need the right to have guns to protect themselves from such crazed bigots.
Who has the most persuasive argument?
You don't!
If you think I'm part of a conspiracy or ready to slide down the slippery slope, I will tell you that unthinking responses will eventually lead to draconian laws and all guns being confiscated. You have to think outside of the box or you are going to be sitting there with your guns buried in PVC.
You are talking about things, I never said.
Where did it say that I support the government so strongly? Your emotional response without really thinking doesn't make sense.
I was directly saying that those who suggested that this shooting was actually instigated by the government and not as it now seems the product of some mentally ill-racist are mistaken. And I will say it again - you can off into conspiracy land if you wish but you do a disservice to the RKBA by such meanderings.
As far as my last line - tough. The NRA
supported and helped black Americans in their fight against racists. Did you forget it?
The RKBA is a cure for such folks. I say it proudly. So if you disagree with it, you ignore reality.
Free speech is one of our greatest freedoms.
But, I say to you that people who have to sell materials suggesting the death of those they disagree are not worthy supporters of the RKBA.
Nor did I characterize all RKBA folks as bigots - learn how to read.
I said:
One glaring weakness of the RKBA folk is too go off into nutso land and see conspiracies.
This dude will turn out to have problems and they will be related to some focus on racial
issues.
I was right on this guy or do you think he was a agent of Reno?
If one studies persuasion and group attitudes, you would know that a stupid argument poisons the well for later rational arguments.
If someone says to me, given the loon, why should we have guns?
One answer: Yep, he must be an agent of Reno, thus, it wasn't our (RKBA folk) fault.
or:
This man was mentally ill. Folks need the right to have guns to protect themselves from such crazed bigots.
Who has the most persuasive argument?
You don't!
If you think I'm part of a conspiracy or ready to slide down the slippery slope, I will tell you that unthinking responses will eventually lead to draconian laws and all guns being confiscated. You have to think outside of the box or you are going to be sitting there with your guns buried in PVC.
Read my post, Glenn.
You'll have to do better than that.
Your past support of our present government is confirmed in many threads.
I *agreed* the shootings were not a conspiracy. Neither my opinions nor my posts justify your misperceptions.
[This message has been edited by Dennis (edited May 01, 2000).]
You'll have to do better than that.
Your past support of our present government is confirmed in many threads.
I *agreed* the shootings were not a conspiracy. Neither my opinions nor my posts justify your misperceptions.
[This message has been edited by Dennis (edited May 01, 2000).]
Good Evening Everyone-
Dennis, you've succinctly captured the essence of the point I was trying to make. You've definitely painted the picture of what I was trying to illustrate about the current administration. While I don't think they instigate these heinous crimes, I have the sad, sinking feeling they are secretly "appreciative" when they occur. The media is certainly only too eager to spread the morbid news....
Glenn, I've re-read your statement of "RKBA, the Rx for Bigots" posted earlier. It clearly makes sense if analogous to "Aspirin, the Rx for Headaches." It's easy to see how the word for can slant how this statement reads....it's not as if we want the RKBA to benefit the bigots of the world. Are we in agreement on that one?
Regards to all,
~ Blue Jays ~
[This message has been edited by Blue Jays (edited May 02, 2000).]
Dennis, you've succinctly captured the essence of the point I was trying to make. You've definitely painted the picture of what I was trying to illustrate about the current administration. While I don't think they instigate these heinous crimes, I have the sad, sinking feeling they are secretly "appreciative" when they occur. The media is certainly only too eager to spread the morbid news....
Glenn, I've re-read your statement of "RKBA, the Rx for Bigots" posted earlier. It clearly makes sense if analogous to "Aspirin, the Rx for Headaches." It's easy to see how the word for can slant how this statement reads....it's not as if we want the RKBA to benefit the bigots of the world. Are we in agreement on that one?
Regards to all,
~ Blue Jays ~
[This message has been edited by Blue Jays (edited May 02, 2000).]
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freedomlover
Guest
The RKBA--Rx for bigots?? Sorry Glenn, you really lost me there. Whose side are you on? Your comments seem quite ambiguous, to say the very least...
Like others have said, either you believe in the Second Amendment or you don't!
freedomlover
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Sic semper tyrannis
Like others have said, either you believe in the Second Amendment or you don't!
freedomlover
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Sic semper tyrannis