Winchester “White Box” 9mm 115gr JHP in Clear Ballistics gel.

5

5pins

New member
How many have speculated about the performance of the bargain brand ammo out there? I know I have. There have been times in the past that I carried such ammo for one reason or another and info on their performance was mostly nonexistent. Well, I had the opportunity to try some Winchester 115gr JHP’s in Clear Ballistics gel. Hopefully, this will be helpful for individuals who, for whatever reason, choose to use or must use this type of ammo. Guns used are a Sig P229 with a 3.9-inch barrel and a Beretta Nano with a three-inch barrel. Two blocks of 16 inch Clear Ballistics gel shot a distance of 10 feet. Two rounds into the bare gel, two through heavy clothing, and two into the bare gel with the short barrel Nano.



Round one from the Sig P229 into bare gel penetrated to 11.5 inches and expanded to .59 inches. Some of the jacket pedals came off between the eight and nine-inch mark and the bullet weighed 113gr. The crony didn’t pick up the velocity. Round two had a velocity of 1108 fps and also penetrated to 11.5 inches and expanded to .61 inches. This bullet didn’t lose any jacket material.



Round one in heavy clothing impacted at 1127 fps and penetrated to 13.75 inches with an expanded diameter of .53 inches. The second round had a velocity of 1126, penetrated to 13.5 inches and expanded to .52 inches.



The first round out of the 3 inch Nano had a velocity of 1078 fps and penetrated to 12.5 inches and expanded to .54 inches. Round two had a velocity of 1064fps, went 11.75 inches and expanded to .56 inches.

 
Thanks for the results. From what little I've used of it, it's not the worst out there you can use. But I do think it's best to limit it to the times you can't find anything better right at the moment.
 
5pins, thank you for another great test. Always look forward to your posts on these! Curious if you have already done it or, are planning to test 115gr Speer Gold Dot along with some of the Hornady 124gr XTP? Thanks again!
 
Cyanide971 said:
5pins, thank you for another great test. Always look forward to your posts on these! Curious if you have already done it or, are planning to test 115gr Speer Gold Dot along with some of the Hornady 124gr XTP? Thanks again!
Click to expand...

I have tested the 124gr +P and 147gr Gold Dots and the 124gr +P XTP but not the 115gr Gold Dots.

https://generalcartridge.wordpress.com/2017/04/02/american-gunner-9mm-124gr-p-xtp-in-clear-ballistics-gel/

https://generalcartridge.wordpress.com/2017/04/02/speer-124gr-p-gdhp-in-clear-ballistics-gel/

https://generalcartridge.wordpress.com/2017/03/30/speer-9mm-147gr-gold-dot-in-clear-ballistics-gel/
 
This is the weirdest stuff. Regular WWB over the years has been hit or miss in terms of quality and as of late seems to be in one of its valleys of quality.

That being said the WWB HP offerings have always punched above their weight.
 
whitebox

One of the issues sometimes overlooked in whitebox/price point ammo is powder. As these gel test show, expansion (in this instance anyhow) is probable. But one way to cut costs on such ammo is the powder, ie the treatments, antiflash, maybe burn rate, who knows what else, that the powders receive.

We used to shoot a fair amount of white box ammo in training, and any
shooting that was done in low light, the white box stuff always had more flash than premium duty ammo.
 
I tend to be a "believer" in "ball" ammo.
BALL ammo is guaranteed to punch CLEAN THROUGH a human sized person, and a full, through and through shot beats a lame-O expanding round that failed every day of the week.
 
Kilibreaux said:
I tend to be a "believer" in "ball" ammo.
BALL ammo is guaranteed to punch CLEAN THROUGH a human sized person, and a full, through and through shot beats a lame-O expanding round that failed every day of the week.
Click to expand...
If that were true, I'm sure many more law enforcement agencies would be using cheap ball ammo instead of more expensive JHP.
 
I don't want to be the guy in court defending my usage of ball ammo, thanks but I'll pass. That "lame-o" expansion does more damage and all but guarantees nobody behind the target is going to get free air conditioning on a hot day so long as you do your part and don't miss. HP isn't perfect, which is why companies have made moves towards solid copper with different bullet designs, but it's sure as crap better than ball ammo.
 
I tend to be a "believer" in "ball" ammo.
BALL ammo is guaranteed to punch CLEAN THROUGH a human sized person, and a full, through and through shot beats a lame-O expanding round that failed every day of the week.
Click to expand...
Now THAT'S funny stuff right there!
Clean through, and through. With minimal energy transfer, and damage!
How do those "lame-O" expanding rounds fail? Ah, when, and more importantly if they fail it is because they fail to expand. Then what would you have? Doesn't take a genius. You have something that acts like a full metal jacket bullet. Clean through, and through.
So, when a modern designed and constructed hollow point bullet works properly. Which modern, well designed, and constructed bullets do, you have more tissue damage, a larger wound, and a larger diameter projectile that increases to some extent the possibility of damaging the spine for an instant incapacitation. If on the rare chance that a modern HP does not expand what do you have? A fmj.
 
and all but guarantees nobody behind the target is going to get free air conditioning on a hot day so long as you do your part and don't miss.
Click to expand...
I'm not going into this in depth, but I don't believe this is correct. I believe it is fairly common for JHP to pass through a medium build person lightly clothed with enough energy to injure anyone behind them.
 
FMJ

Seems like I recall that NYPD did in fact issue 115 FMJ when they first went to the 9mm autopistol. Seems like I recall that the results were about what you'd expect, failures to stop, pass thrus, and excessive ricochet. Expanding ammo is in use now, but that is what NYPD started with ( I think), and it wasn't all that long ago.

Certainly lack of penetration is a valid concern in SD/LE shootings. The FBI Miami incident comes to mind, but there was a lot of issues in play in that tragedy. There's a compelling video of a lecture given to EMS personnel on Youtube regarding wounds and lack of penetration, though the title of same escapes me just now. One of the staffers listed an article written by Tom GIVENS, that runs a well thought of shooting school in Memphis, that is worth a read as well.

I've seen 9mm FMJ (115 & 124) punch through a variety of materials that stopped .45 ball cold. I state that only to support the comment that the stuff is indeed is very penetrative.
 
I like the best feeding and penetrating ammo in my defense guns....hence I carry ball in all of them. Maybe right, maybe wrong...but to each his own.
 
Thanks for the test. I will not pay a dollar or more for a round of ammo. I use the Remington 115gr hollow point and have total faith in it. As much faith as you can put in a bullet anyway.

Maybe Winchester made the bullets shown in the loaded rounds but they sure look like Hornady XTPs to me. those are excellent bullets too.

And if someone wants to carry full metal jacket I have no problems with it. I have been know to carry hot loaded 158gr SWC hard cast lead bullets in my snubby 38s.
 
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