FrankenMauser
New member
You're taking that statement out of context. That was for arentol, and his incorrect assumptions.
Why the Ruger "Poor Boy's Trigger Job" is a stupid idea...
- Thread starter FrankenMauser
- Start date
Sgt.Fathead
Moderator
I think outside of actual manufacturing defects wherein there's a recall, or in a case of a defect that shows the poor design of an arm and the shooting community's lack of support for it, what we have here and oftentimes do is another Ford vs. Chevy or Coke vs. Pepsi debate. In our demographic it's the Mossberg 500 vs. Rem 870s and AR vs. AK, etc.
So this method has worked very well for some and not so well for others. I've taken a Dremel to the trigger face of a couple Ruger DA revolvers and replaced factory springs with aftermarkets. I've refinished the stocks on a NM Super Blackhawk, worked the finish on others with Flitz.
I guess my meandering point is, some people are more competent than others with making mechanical modifications to their firearms. It worked for Quinn and many others, but not the original poster. I agree that this does not make the method wrong.
So this method has worked very well for some and not so well for others. I've taken a Dremel to the trigger face of a couple Ruger DA revolvers and replaced factory springs with aftermarkets. I've refinished the stocks on a NM Super Blackhawk, worked the finish on others with Flitz.
I guess my meandering point is, some people are more competent than others with making mechanical modifications to their firearms. It worked for Quinn and many others, but not the original poster. I agree that this does not make the method wrong.
Actually, I'm a bit confused, now...
FrankenMauser, I've read a lot of your posts, and I consider you informed and competent (based on what you've written, which is all we all have to go on with all of us here on the web), but I'm a bit confused, now.
I've used this trick for decades, and have around a dozen Ruger SA's, and on every one of them, it has always changed the trigger pull, and has never given any problems.
So, now I'm wondering...why didn't it do the same for you? Maybe there is something else going on with your Super B?
Could there be some other thing that, added to the drop leg created your problem? Maybe something you didn't see because it was "obvious" the drop leg was the cause?
I've never had any problems with any of mine, and others say the same, so I have to wonder, why did yours lock up?
I'd really like to know.
FrankenMauser, I've read a lot of your posts, and I consider you informed and competent (based on what you've written, which is all we all have to go on with all of us here on the web), but I'm a bit confused, now.
I've used this trick for decades, and have around a dozen Ruger SA's, and on every one of them, it has always changed the trigger pull, and has never given any problems.
So, now I'm wondering...why didn't it do the same for you? Maybe there is something else going on with your Super B?
Could there be some other thing that, added to the drop leg created your problem? Maybe something you didn't see because it was "obvious" the drop leg was the cause?
I've never had any problems with any of mine, and others say the same, so I have to wonder, why did yours lock up?
I'd really like to know.
Franken, "Much needed" implies it should have been done sooner. If that isn't really what you meant then you shouldn't have phrased it that way.
You admit you took the whole gun apart, a process that can potentially result in something like a spring being just a teeny bit out of spec or in spec, but not exactly as from the factory, which wouldn't be harmful at all unless you were trying a hack like this... And now something that works for lots of other people doesn't work for you.
My point is made, thank you.
I am not saying you did anything wrong. And I am not saying you are wrong about this poor boy trigger job having the potential to cause failures. It certainly seems likely it would cause this issue in some Rugers. I am merely saying that when you make multiple changes at once to a complex system it becomes extremely difficult to be 100% certain what is the true cause of future problems without a detailed inspection by a professional, and sometimes not even then. For me at least you have cast your own shadow of doubt over your statements about this hack by doing it immediately after tearing the gun apart.
As to my understanding of trigger jobs, just this past Friday I took my Rossi 92 from an ~10lb trigger pull to ~4lbs. It isn't exactly the same process as what you did, but believe me, I know what it is to do a trigger job.
You admit you took the whole gun apart, a process that can potentially result in something like a spring being just a teeny bit out of spec or in spec, but not exactly as from the factory, which wouldn't be harmful at all unless you were trying a hack like this... And now something that works for lots of other people doesn't work for you.
My point is made, thank you.
I am not saying you did anything wrong. And I am not saying you are wrong about this poor boy trigger job having the potential to cause failures. It certainly seems likely it would cause this issue in some Rugers. I am merely saying that when you make multiple changes at once to a complex system it becomes extremely difficult to be 100% certain what is the true cause of future problems without a detailed inspection by a professional, and sometimes not even then. For me at least you have cast your own shadow of doubt over your statements about this hack by doing it immediately after tearing the gun apart.
As to my understanding of trigger jobs, just this past Friday I took my Rossi 92 from an ~10lb trigger pull to ~4lbs. It isn't exactly the same process as what you did, but believe me, I know what it is to do a trigger job.
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458winshooter
New member
Poor boys trigger job
I think tempers are starting to flair up a bit so may I make this observation.I have a 7 1/2 in SBH in stainless.I bought it used so I don't know if the springs have been changed out or not.I can say there is no creep in the trigger what so ever.I called Ruger shortly after I bought it and they informed me that it was produced in 1999.This post got me to thinking so I got the old girl out and decided to try for myself.Let me also say that I to have put a pacmar grip on mine because the square trigger guard was too painful to deal with.
With the spring off I cannot see how it could get mired in the coils of the other spring they are to close.I tried it first with one side off then replaced it and took off the otherside.No way mine will do it.I dry fired it several times but couldn't duplicate the OP's failure.
I just got out my Wheeler trigger pull gauge and tested it both ways and with both sides like before.I gauged it in two places,at the very bottom of the trigger against the triggerguard and halfway up.There is only about 1 pound difference between having it on and off.I myself can't really tell but the gauge says there is.This may not settle anything but I wanted to share it with you because I had seen the article and was interested in it myself.
I think tempers are starting to flair up a bit so may I make this observation.I have a 7 1/2 in SBH in stainless.I bought it used so I don't know if the springs have been changed out or not.I can say there is no creep in the trigger what so ever.I called Ruger shortly after I bought it and they informed me that it was produced in 1999.This post got me to thinking so I got the old girl out and decided to try for myself.Let me also say that I to have put a pacmar grip on mine because the square trigger guard was too painful to deal with.
With the spring off I cannot see how it could get mired in the coils of the other spring they are to close.I tried it first with one side off then replaced it and took off the otherside.No way mine will do it.I dry fired it several times but couldn't duplicate the OP's failure.
I just got out my Wheeler trigger pull gauge and tested it both ways and with both sides like before.I gauged it in two places,at the very bottom of the trigger against the triggerguard and halfway up.There is only about 1 pound difference between having it on and off.I myself can't really tell but the gauge says there is.This may not settle anything but I wanted to share it with you because I had seen the article and was interested in it myself.
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458winshooter
New member
Poor boys trigger job
I think tempers are starting to flair up a bit so may I make this observation.I have a 7 1/2 in SBH in stainless.I bought it used so I don't know if the springs have been changed out or not.I can say there is no creep in the trigger what so ever.I called Ruger shortly after I bought it and they informed me that it was produced in 1999.This post got me to thinking so I got the old girl out and decided to try for myself.Let me also say that I to have put a pacmar grip on mine because the square trigger guard was too painful to deal with.
With the spring off I cannot see how it could get mired in the coils of the other spring they are to close.I tried it first with one side off then replaced it and took off the otherside.No way mine will do it.I dry fired it several times but couldn't duplicate the OP's failure.
I just got out my Wheeler trigger pull gauge and tested it both ways and with both sides like before.I tried it in two places,at the very bottom of the trigger against the triggerguard and halfway up.There is only about 1 pound difference between having it on and off.I myself can't really tell but the gauge says there is.This may not settle anything but I wanted to share it with you because I had seen the article and was interested in it myself.
I think tempers are starting to flair up a bit so may I make this observation.I have a 7 1/2 in SBH in stainless.I bought it used so I don't know if the springs have been changed out or not.I can say there is no creep in the trigger what so ever.I called Ruger shortly after I bought it and they informed me that it was produced in 1999.This post got me to thinking so I got the old girl out and decided to try for myself.Let me also say that I to have put a pacmar grip on mine because the square trigger guard was too painful to deal with.
With the spring off I cannot see how it could get mired in the coils of the other spring they are to close.I tried it first with one side off then replaced it and took off the otherside.No way mine will do it.I dry fired it several times but couldn't duplicate the OP's failure.
I just got out my Wheeler trigger pull gauge and tested it both ways and with both sides like before.I tried it in two places,at the very bottom of the trigger against the triggerguard and halfway up.There is only about 1 pound difference between having it on and off.I myself can't really tell but the gauge says there is.This may not settle anything but I wanted to share it with you because I had seen the article and was interested in it myself.
FrankenMauser
New member
I'm sure there is no easy answer to that question, for many reasons. The first of which, is: It's a Ruger. You never know what type of fitting, filing, polishing, and finishing you may (or may not) see when you open one up. The saying "no two firearms are alike" should be taken quite seriously, when dealing with Rugers.
As I pointed out in a previous post, the main spring can shift on the hammer strut. In my SBH, it shifted to the right to cause the binding. That, alone, shouldn't be capable of locking the action up. But, if my hammer strut is also bent slightly, that would seal the deal. I, apparently, was a little too excited about finally getting a photo of the protruding spring; and didn't inspect the strut thoroughly.
So, I should have been more clear about the potential cause(s), reasoning, and perhaps been a little nicer with the label ("stupid idea"). For that, I apologize.
But... I still maintain that it isn't a good idea. It's like disconnecting the brake line to the rear axle of your truck, because "the front end does 90% of the braking, anyway..."
Thanks for the explanation. I got my first Blackhawk in 83, and my most recent Vaqueros this year, a new Vaqero last year, and while I did slick up the insides of my first one, other than the drop spring leg, I haven't bothered with the insides of any of the others. They all work well enough for me, currently. Maybe I'm just getting mellow in my old age....
I don't agree with that analogy, but I'll gladly accept your opinion that you don't think its a good idea. I think its harmless, based on my experience, but we can agree to disagree about this, I think.
I don't agree with that analogy, but I'll gladly accept your opinion that you don't think its a good idea. I think its harmless, based on my experience, but we can agree to disagree about this, I think.
rockyrider
Inactive
Poor man's trigger job.
I have to admit, that since I tried one half of the poor mans trigger job, {just releasing one spring}, It has improved the accuracy of a new Blackhawk .45Colt. In fact I like this new gun so much, it could just be one of my favorites.
BTW, the new trigger pull is 2.25 lbs.
I have to admit, that since I tried one half of the poor mans trigger job, {just releasing one spring}, It has improved the accuracy of a new Blackhawk .45Colt. In fact I like this new gun so much, it could just be one of my favorites.
BTW, the new trigger pull is 2.25 lbs.
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Driftwood Johnson
New member
Howdy
Put me down as one who does not favor the 'poor boy's trigger job', as far as moving one leg of the trigger spring off the stud. Just never liked the idea of unbalancing the spring that way. I have changed out springs in lots of Rugers over the years, and have done a bit of careful stoning too. Just don't like the unbalanced idea.
By the way, when I first started shooting Rugers, the 'Poor Man's' trigger job was to make sure the gun is unloaded, put the hammer at full cock, and push really hard against the hammer spur with your thumb while slowly pulling the trigger until the hammer falls. Doing this two or three times will marry the surfaces together of the full cock notch and sear and help smooth things out a little bit.
Put me down as one who does not favor the 'poor boy's trigger job', as far as moving one leg of the trigger spring off the stud. Just never liked the idea of unbalancing the spring that way. I have changed out springs in lots of Rugers over the years, and have done a bit of careful stoning too. Just don't like the unbalanced idea.
By the way, when I first started shooting Rugers, the 'Poor Man's' trigger job was to make sure the gun is unloaded, put the hammer at full cock, and push really hard against the hammer spur with your thumb while slowly pulling the trigger until the hammer falls. Doing this two or three times will marry the surfaces together of the full cock notch and sear and help smooth things out a little bit.
I tried this on my Bisley. It reduced the trigger pull markedly, to the point of it almost feeling TOO light. I have been shooting it this way for about a year now and even took a nice little buck with it this past season.
That said, I still fully intend to save up and send it off for a full trigger and timing job in the future.
That said, I still fully intend to save up and send it off for a full trigger and timing job in the future.
Naturally if I was a smith I'd prefer you sent the gun to me. I recently took my BH apart for cleaning, I wish SR included a detailed instruction for the job.
I've removed one leg of the spring from its stud and it did lessen the trigger pull. My advice is to try it both ways and use the one that's best for you. Then you can get all contentious when someone does it the other way.
I've removed one leg of the spring from its stud and it did lessen the trigger pull. My advice is to try it both ways and use the one that's best for you. Then you can get all contentious when someone does it the other way.