Why the .40?

I

imi

Inactive
Forgive me for missing out on history, but why was the .40 and commissioned by LE agencies when the .45 ACP is very much around?
 
It has now taken popularity because it has the speed of a 9mm with near or sometimes above power of the .45. I'll be the first to admit I don't have experience with the .45, so don't think I am flaming it.But judging from balistics the .40 is a good way to go.
 
The nice thing about .40 is the size effiiency of the round. You can put it in 9mm size guns where a 45 has to use a larger platform. When you do make a small 45 it then becomes how many rounds can you have.
I have a Glock27 that will hold 10 rounds in the clip and one in the tube, and a Colt compact (officer's size model) that holds 6 in the clip and one in the chamber.
The Glock is lighter and holds more rounds and .40 has alot more oompf to it than a 9mm.
I like 45acp and I like 44 mag too, but for small handguns, .40 is hard to beat.
 
I think it's all marketing.

Gun makers must do something to intice you to buy a new gun, because they can only reinvent the wheel so many times (variations on a certain model) with one calibre.

They develop a new, supposedly better, calibre, and the gun magazine writers convince you that if you don't buy this so-called better calibre, you'll be seriously behind the stopping power curve.

People buy into this hype, and thus another license to print money is issued.

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“The whole of the Bill (of Rights) is a declaration of the right of the people at large or considered as individuals. ... It establishes some rights of the individual as unalienable and which consequently, no majority has a right to deprive them of.” -Alexander Addison, 1789
 
deanf,

Wise are you sir. Gun manufacturers must continually invent new products to maintain a market. This makes perfect business sense. The 40SW was born for the same reason the 357SIG was, to get LE agencies and individual citizens to part with their cash.

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So many pistols, so little money.
 
Well, there's a LITTLE more to it than that! It seems that the main attraction of the .40 S&W round is that it can be chambered in handguns of small size, equivalent to those shooting the 9x19mm. This permits carrying of a more powerful round without having to carry a bigger gun! (By whatever measure you choose, whether momentum, kinetic energy, frontal area, permanent wound cavitation volume, etc, the "best" .40 S&W loads outperform the "best" 9mm loads.) Sure, the purveyors of the cartridge/guns want to make money, but the products are attractive to the customers, as well, and for a justifiable reason.
Personally, I don't particularly like the .40 S&W cartridge, since in my hands at least, it's less accurate than the .45acp or the 9mm. Most handgun cartridges fill a niche of some sort, however, and the .40 S&W's appears to be "size-efficiency", Mark Moritz' term for the appropriate correspondence between handgun size and the power of the cartridge fired by the gun.

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"Potius sero quam nunquam."
 
135 grains - 10mm diameter - 1300 FPS.

Any Questions?

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"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." - Sigmund Freud
Hey, have I mentioned my new book? It is called:
MEN ARE FROM MARS and WOMEN JUST NEED TO DEAL WITH IT!
 
George, I can do better.. ;)
165gr LRN @ 1320fps in a .40 S&W case !
With no buldging. :)
Kicks 9 minimum butt...grin

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"The Gun from Down Under !"
http://www.para1911fanclub.w3.to/
E-mail hotshot_2000@hotmail.com
Alternate E-mail
HS2000@ausi.com
 
I like to think of the .40S&W as a "compromise" between the 9mm parabellum and .45ACP. I prefer the .45ACP over any other auto cartridge, but some people (LE especially) want "MORE" capacity, as well as a harder hitting punch.

The .40 is not a bad cartridge. I prefer it over the 9 as a defensive round in a handgun. However, I too have found the 9mm to be a slightly more accurate cartridge. All of the three most popular auto cartridges (9mm, .40S&W, .45ACP) have +'s and -'s.

I will stick with the more than proven .45ACP.



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SURE SHOT
 
I too like the .45 ACP, but there are some damn good 9mm loads out there. If you go with 9mm, you get to carry more rounds. If you choose .40S&W, you get fewer rounds, and only a marginal performance increase if any over the 9mm, plus you have to deal with the sharper recoil of the .40S&W. I don't see the point.
 
I have a couple .40's, in addition to 9's and a 1911 .45acp. I like 'em all. I'd think about 10mm too or 9X23, esp if I could reload it.

The .40 does seem to be a compromise between mag capacity (more of an issue with hi-caps) and power (i know...Short & Weak). If I HAD to pick one caliber, it might be a .40 though (the new Steyr?). 15 rounds of .40 in my G22 ain't bad. The recoil impulse is sharper than the .45 to me, but not unpleasant.

That said, I may be shifting my emphasis to 9mm (cheap ammo and decent stopping power) and .45 (the classic). For carry? The Glock 19 or the 1911, probably.

In the right hands, they're ALL good. Ken Hackathorn carries a .45 1911 for duty, and for off-duty more often than not carries a Glock 19 9mm. Another SWAT cop/trainer friend, who likes the .40 a lot, says "You can't discount the 9mm though... the "high speed killers"... GSG9, SAS, SEALS, LASD SEB all use 9mm, and they get the job done..." (of course, their primary weapon is an HK MP5!)
:) imo

[This message has been edited by Covert Mission (edited November 29, 1999).]
 
Speaking of 9mm
From the standpoint that I need home defense loads, that will not go through perp and into the next room where my child lies, what is THE BEST 9mm load? and what is the best 9mm load for the cost (most bang for the buck)?
In other words, I could care less about stopping power, or penetration as long as it stays in the perp and thus in the room.
Any help would be apreciated!
thanks!
 
Beretta Boy,
This may be an area where the .40S&W has a slight advantage, as well as some other cartridges. It is somewhat harder it appers to get low soft/hard penetration and good stopping power from the 9mm Luger. (I mention this because the thread is about .40 auto.) It seems from what I have read that the MagSafe SWAT loads are the least likely to cause a downrange injury in the event of either a miss or marginal shot placement. (the .40 loading offers VERY low soft penetration as well) At longer distances, something like the hard to get Geco Blitz Action Trauma 86-grain bullets might do well at losing energy quickly to lower the effective lethal range.
For cheap all around use in the 9x19, I would consider the Winchester 115-grain standard pressure Silvertip. It has low soft penetration, tactical penetration is less than the +P+ 115 JHP(or the .45 ACP with FMJ) and "stopping power" is in the middle of the effectiveness scale per M/S. The heavy 140+ grain hollow points have the lowest hard penetration but are the most likely to over penetrate the intended target. If this is a real concern, some different thinking may be in order. Plan where the safest shots can be taken, and base your defense stategy accordingly. Hope this helps because I am a Beretta 92 fan also.
 
The 40 has more fl/lb energy than a 45.
With corbon loads though, I think you get good stopping power with 9mm, 40, or 45, however, I am a revolver fan, so give me a 41 magnum.
 
HS said it. Sawbones is right, too.

George, that reminds me of what the marquee sign at the local Hooters says right now:

"Football. Chicken Wings. Hooters Girls. Any Questions?"
 
Since the only mags you can buy these days without selling your first born only hold 10 rounds, I'd say why bother with anything smaller than .40?

I like it because I shoot it better than a .45, and it comes in a smaller package (I find it "crisper" if anyone understands what I'm getting at).

Spark

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Kevin Jon Schlossberg
SysOp and Administrator for BladeForums.com
www.bladeforums.com
 
Calling all engineers and gunsmiths! Yep the .40 has the dubious advantage of being available in a "9mm package size". Am I crazy or does it seem that gun mfg in their rush to capitalize on the .40's popularity have simply cloned their 9mm with spit,polish and a stronger spring? Please tell me I'm wrong. I actually like the cartridge and would like some reassurance abaout vastly improved QC.
 
When i was in the market for a new auto i knew right away that i wanted more than a 9mm. I thought long and hard about the .45 and came to the same conclusion as many.

The 9mm is great. plenty of power and not bad for target practice if you wanna save money. I personally dont feel as protected with a 9mm as i do with the .45 so that takes me to the 45.

The 45 is notorious for its 1 shot killing power. (i know, i know... please hold the comments) the recoil can sometimes be overwhelming and the price to practice is high. so i opted for something in-between.

The .40 is cheaper to shoot. more capacity and plenty of power. recoil is not heaven but its better than the 45. if i was in a gunfight i would take the 40 over any handgun round. As would alot of others.

I havent had any experience with the 10mm so i cant say anything about that. Ill be lookin into it.




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TIM : )
 
Because the .40 is so popular, the 357Sig also became famous. The 357Sig smoked the 9X23 pistol, not because it's better, but because it fits in a smaller size pistol and is thus more flexible.

The .40 and 357 SIG duo also are proving themselves very well on the street. So, even though manufacturers have to dream up new ways to make money (called capitalism), they hit a sweet spot. Very simple.
 
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