Why set a rifle down with the barrel up?

chiefr said:
I was told: It keeps the ball & powder from rolling out of the barrel.
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A holdover from the olden days. These days there is no chance of that happening.

Placing a firearm which fires from an open bolt muzzle down is not a good idea. One bump and you could have an AD. Ever notice that soldiers always jump off of a truck or obstacle with the muzzle up if they are holding a firearm that fires from an open bolt? Bad idea to do so with the muzzle down. Gravity and inertia are not your friend.

A plugged barrel will always have the potential for harm. Muzzle up is just all around the best idea.
 
Mine are stored some muzzle up and some muzzle down to minimize overall space taken up by them.

At the range it's muzzle up, but I wouldn't get bent out of shape if someone wanted to rack one muzzle down. I see no safety issue with the latter.
 
Simply a matter of of gravity and friction. The butt is generally heavier and broader, so the rifle is far less likely to tip over if leaning against a wall with butt on the floor. If leaning into a corner the barrel has no place to go.

A loaded, cocked weapon with safety disengaged can "go off by itself" with no finger on the trigger. The brother of a aquaintance lost his jaw and much of his face to a shotgun that tipped over when an door was wrenched open then slammed closed.
Worn sears and/or crud in the mechanism can result in a creeping disengagement several seconds to a minute or more after a gun is cocked.
There are many factors that can result in a spontaneous discharge.

I sometimes hang a unloaded cased rifle with muzzle down, and after cleaning and oiling I place the rifle on its rack upside down so oil doesn't seep into the wood.

I don't lean a loaded gun against a wall, and don't lean a rifle against a log or stump in the woods for even a minute unless the safety is on or chamber empty and prefer to leave the action open. Any longer than a few minutes and I'd unload the rifle.

PS
The problem of AD when jumping from a truck with an autoloader is when the muzzle is up. Inertia caused the bolt to retract far enough to pick up a round but not far enough for the sear to engage.
The STEN, the MP38, and the PPSH all suffered from this until the bolt tracks or knobs were redesigned.
The early production models of the M1 Carbine were also subject to this.
 
Up, thought of another reason I've put a weapon muzzle down before.

Army aircrews got real persnickety when we clamored onto to thier Blackhawks. They always asked us nicely to put the muzzles of air weapons on the deck of the helicopter.

A crew chief explained it to me that in the even of an ND, there is a lot less breakable stuff in the bottom of the helicopter than the top.
 
A friend stores muzzle down (strange to me, since I had never seen this done). His reasoning was the "oil and wood" thing and had to wonder how much oil you'd have to slather on to soak the wood with oil. Then he takes a spray can of Rem-oil and sprays everything in the rack! WHAT? Stored muzzle up and a regular wipe-down works for me.
 
I walked out the door, packed my bags, sleeved my gun's, grabbed my target during the ceasefire, called it an early day and drove off in my car.

I saw the member again, a month later, and he proceeded to rack his guns with the muzzle down. I performed another early departure from the range; without saying a word to the member.
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I don't know if it would have mattered to the president, or any of the other higher ups at your club, but I would have told them that if they were going to keep allowing people to blatantly break safety rules that you were going to find another place to shoot. I'd even go as far as to ask for my pro-rated dues/fees back.

I'm big on safety. Anytime I see a safety violation, I bring it up to an RSO. Some may want to call me a narc or snitch, or whatever, but I personally don't feel like getting shot, or seeing damage or liability to my range of choice. Luckily, the RSOs at the range I frequent are also big on safety, and have no problem dealing with confrontation, when it comes to safety.
 
His reasoning was the "oil and wood" thing and had to wonder how much oil you'd have to slather on to soak the wood with oil.
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Back in the days when I was a kid(50+ years ago) and grandpa was doing this you have to realize, that things were much different. Homes were not air conditioned in the summertime, thus guns were subject to high humidity.....thus they got heavily oiled to prevent rust. Guns used for hunting deer got taken outta the closet for one week a year and then put back until the following year, thus guns were heavily oiled to prevent rust. Being oiled like this before the age of gun safes, dehumidifiers, desiccants, and air conditioning is the only reason many of those old guns are in good condition today. Many old timers like my grandpa didn't have the luxury of having a specialized gun oil either, they used the same 3in1 oil or clean motor oil that they used to oil everything else they owned. This oil tended to stain wood because of the powder fouling it dissolve in the actions. Thus, they stored their guns muzzle down for extended period of time. Gramps had those nice canvas cases with the leather pads on the muzzle for all his guns, and the leather pads were all stained dark from the oil. Not only did the oil stain the stocks, they also made them swell from the absorbed oil and thus the wood to metal fit suffered. No..... gramps didn't intentionally stick his muzzle in the mud and snow, nor did he rest the unprotected muzzle on a hard surface. Nor did he keep his guns loaded while they were stored........back then there was no reason.
 
It's sad to see a fine old British double shotgun with the stock around the receiver rotted out from the oil. Many shooters use much too much oil. A light coating is enough.
 
So it won't damage the crown. If you're over the barrel of a loaded rifle and you manage to set it off then plus one for Darwin.
 
Gaerek said:
I don't know if it would have mattered to the president, or any of the other higher ups at your club, but I would have told them that if they were going to keep allowing people to blatantly break safety rules that you were going to find another place to shoot. I'd even go as far as to ask for my pro-rated dues/fees back.
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Me too. What's the point of rules if everyone can just "do what you feel is safe"?
 
I can see somebody who is in the habit of resting their rifles with the muzzle on the floor of their safe propping one up that way by a tree or fence and not thinking twice about it until they take the next shot.
 
Rainbow Demon said:
The problem of AD when jumping from a truck with an autoloader is when the muzzle is up. Inertia caused the bolt to retract far enough to pick up a round but not far enough for the sear to engage.
The STEN, the MP38, and the PPSH all suffered from this until the bolt tracks or knobs were redesigned.
The early production models of the M1 Carbine were also subject to this.
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I was told the Thompson sub gun also had this propensity. Not good for a military firearm to discharge when the enemy is near.
 
Seems to me that if you were talking about storing a shotgun, AR-15, or similar for home defense in a single gun safe, rack, etc., storing with the muzzle down would allow you to retrieve and position the gun quicker and with just your strong hand, especially if it has a pistol grip. I have always thought this would be the way I would choose for that application. All my long guns are stored in my safe with the muzzle up.
 
Grabbing the fore-grip with your off-hand would be no slower than grabbing a pistol-grip with your primary hand.... and there's no trigger to accidentally grab with your off-hand.
 
Major reason for setting weapon down barrel up is debris in the barrel.

Brother was goose hunting. Set shotgun muzzle down. Mud in barrel. Fired 12 gauge. Bulged barrel and ruined family heirloom.
 
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