Go to www.10-8forums.com. There is a dealer there who has seen this occur on more than a few occasions.
Why do you hate internal locks?
- Thread starter LH2
- Start date
Go to www.10-8forums.com. There is a dealer there who has seen this occur on more than a few occasions.
I sold my marlin lever action because I kept wanting to remove the crossbolt and buy the aftermarket kit that fills in the left over holes.
In the example above where the lock was used to disable the gun, that works if you have the keys with you. I had a smith and wesson with a built in lock for a bit and left the keys in the safe all the time. If I knew I had to lock a gun up I would rather have a cable lock so I could disable the gun and lock it to something as well.
I even dislike the transfer bar on single action revolvers since I don't mind carrying hammer down on an empty chamber.
My uses for the single action are either hunting or varminting or plinking and in each of these the extra round is not a big deal.
I can see some safety things actually being worth adding to older models, but the only example I can think of pertains to automobiles that have only a lap belt. Should I ever buy a car with only a lap belt I will modify it so I have a 3 point belt. That is the only example I can come up with.
Thanks for the actual examples of the safeties making the gun inoperable though, I always wondered about that and now that it has come true I am not as paranoid as I used to be.
In the example above where the lock was used to disable the gun, that works if you have the keys with you. I had a smith and wesson with a built in lock for a bit and left the keys in the safe all the time. If I knew I had to lock a gun up I would rather have a cable lock so I could disable the gun and lock it to something as well.
I even dislike the transfer bar on single action revolvers since I don't mind carrying hammer down on an empty chamber.
My uses for the single action are either hunting or varminting or plinking and in each of these the extra round is not a big deal.
I can see some safety things actually being worth adding to older models, but the only example I can think of pertains to automobiles that have only a lap belt. Should I ever buy a car with only a lap belt I will modify it so I have a 3 point belt. That is the only example I can come up with.
Thanks for the actual examples of the safeties making the gun inoperable though, I always wondered about that and now that it has come true I am not as paranoid as I used to be.
Lock you pistol then wake up quickly at 4 in morning and with the lights off see how long it takes you to find the key to unlock the pistol Then unlock the pistol.10 sec20,30 come on your life is on the line I had you lock it so your rug rat walking around middle of night didn't play with it and shoot someone. I hate lawyers and the what if people. My guns are where I can reach them No keys ,no lock boxes ,needed or wanted in my house. I have raised 5 kids in this house with out the need for this junk.
the only usefullness the locks have is when you flat out ignore the basics of firearm ownership and handling. Even Then a person who generally does that will not even use the lock anyway so whats the point.
Many people including myself beleive Revolvers in general have an advantage (among others) an auto loader say doesnt. That advantage is simplicity and reliability in operation. they rely on the mechanics of the gun itself rather than the ability of the ammo to assist in the function, this makes them more likely to go bang when you pull the trigger. When they added this lock they added a significant reason for the gun to potentially not go bang when you pull the trigger. The locking system renders a gun less reliable than it could be becuase it can unitentionally lock under less than extreme circumstances in a self defense situation.
Many people including myself beleive Revolvers in general have an advantage (among others) an auto loader say doesnt. That advantage is simplicity and reliability in operation. they rely on the mechanics of the gun itself rather than the ability of the ammo to assist in the function, this makes them more likely to go bang when you pull the trigger. When they added this lock they added a significant reason for the gun to potentially not go bang when you pull the trigger. The locking system renders a gun less reliable than it could be becuase it can unitentionally lock under less than extreme circumstances in a self defense situation.perception
New member
I personally will never ever use a lock on a handgun. I have no use for it. That is why I do not like the internal locks.
1. If you ever NEED the gun, you are going to be slower. People carry autos with a round in the chamber because they might not have time to rack the slide. Finding and fumbling with a key is going to be much slower than that. I would consider that unnaceptable.
2. One more thing to break. Chances are pretty slim that your lock will break, but then again, your chances of winning the lottery are pretty slim too. People do win the lottery though.
3. Its ugly. The only hole I want in my gun is the one you don't want pointed at you. The locks break up the continuity of the revolver, and are just kind of annoying to look at.
1. If you ever NEED the gun, you are going to be slower. People carry autos with a round in the chamber because they might not have time to rack the slide. Finding and fumbling with a key is going to be much slower than that. I would consider that unnaceptable.
2. One more thing to break. Chances are pretty slim that your lock will break, but then again, your chances of winning the lottery are pretty slim too. People do win the lottery though.
3. Its ugly. The only hole I want in my gun is the one you don't want pointed at you. The locks break up the continuity of the revolver, and are just kind of annoying to look at.
Mister_Dinky
Moderator
Why do you hate internal locks?
More stuff to break at the least opportune moment. With guns as with most things, less is more.
More stuff to break at the least opportune moment. With guns as with most things, less is more.
Mastrogiacomo
New member
Great...I was thinking of getting the 64 3", 640, and 65LS seeing that I can never find the prelock here or afford to out bid people online. Now I'm thinking of getting a 3" SP to go with my SP101 DAO. I may look to get a Bisley Vaquero before they put a lock on that too.
the issue with the automatic seat belts was that the government mandated that cars have some sort of passive restraint system if it didnt have an airbag. airbags were required by a certain date (96?)...
because of the initial cost of designing the impact system for the different models, it was a field expedient task to install the motorized shoulder belt to meet the requirements. the owners manual specifically stated that you had to use the lap belt in conjunction with the shoulder belt. if someone didnt and ended up decapitated thats on them. not the auto manufacturer...
if you notice there isnt a car on the market that doesnt have airbags. THATS why the motorized belts are gone. no other reason...
david
because of the initial cost of designing the impact system for the different models, it was a field expedient task to install the motorized shoulder belt to meet the requirements. the owners manual specifically stated that you had to use the lap belt in conjunction with the shoulder belt. if someone didnt and ended up decapitated thats on them. not the auto manufacturer...
if you notice there isnt a car on the market that doesnt have airbags. THATS why the motorized belts are gone. no other reason...
david
orionengnr
New member
ways to remove said obtrusive S&W lock
http://smith-wessonforum.com/eve/ubb.x/a/tpc/f/530103904/m/292106234/r/693106234#693106234
disclaimer: I have not done this (yet).
Although I only own two S&Ws (both 340PDs) with "the lock"...and as soon as I figure out which one to keep and sell the other, I likely will...
Want to make my decision easier? Offer to buy one--PM me.
http://smith-wessonforum.com/eve/ubb.x/a/tpc/f/530103904/m/292106234/r/693106234#693106234
disclaimer: I have not done this (yet).
Although I only own two S&Ws (both 340PDs) with "the lock"...and as soon as I figure out which one to keep and sell the other, I likely will...
Want to make my decision easier? Offer to buy one--PM me.
While I don't like internal locks in particular, I specifically don't like them on revolvers.
Why don't I like internal locks in general? Most of the prior replies have pretty well summed up my feelings on the matter: Decreased reliability, increased potential for something going wrong, eyesore, inhibits legit SD, etc. One other reason for not liking them is the rationale behind installing the infernal things in the first place. They are a sell-out to the anti's, nanny staters and assorted litigous scumbags -- nothing more than that. While I agree that it would be better to thave those assinine locks than to not have guns available at all, it would be even better to stand up to those infernal forces and tell them to go bugger off.
Why moreso on revolvers? It is more of a mindset than anything else. I am attracted to revolvers in general because of this aura of "old school" that is about them. They are not supposed to be up-to-date with all of the latest wiz-bangery. They are supposed to be "throwbacks" to an earlier age -- I cling to them because they worked well back then and still work just as well now, without all of the newer, fancier techno-whatever. Adding that extra bit of unneccessary complexity is an assault on that tried and true simplicity. It (the lock, not the revolver) becomes an abomination.
Why don't I like internal locks in general? Most of the prior replies have pretty well summed up my feelings on the matter: Decreased reliability, increased potential for something going wrong, eyesore, inhibits legit SD, etc. One other reason for not liking them is the rationale behind installing the infernal things in the first place. They are a sell-out to the anti's, nanny staters and assorted litigous scumbags -- nothing more than that. While I agree that it would be better to thave those assinine locks than to not have guns available at all, it would be even better to stand up to those infernal forces and tell them to go bugger off.
Why moreso on revolvers? It is more of a mindset than anything else. I am attracted to revolvers in general because of this aura of "old school" that is about them. They are not supposed to be up-to-date with all of the latest wiz-bangery. They are supposed to be "throwbacks" to an earlier age -- I cling to them because they worked well back then and still work just as well now, without all of the newer, fancier techno-whatever. Adding that extra bit of unneccessary complexity is an assault on that tried and true simplicity. It (the lock, not the revolver) becomes an abomination.
It's another non-issue! I've never touched the locks on my guns and I never will. My guns always go bang when I pull the trigger! Some folks who claim to be part of gun culture just like to whine about anything S&W and other gun companys. They also love to moan about the good old days when the guns had a beautiful deep blue but metalurgy from the old iron age. I wonder what their agenda really is? End of Rant, 
Dennis
DennisJust talked to a friend an co-worker who is shipping his Ruger MkIII back to the factory.
It failed to operate properly at the range--may have been reassembled improperly. He thought that the internal lock might have engaged by mistake and tried to unlock it. It appears that either that was the case, or that he accidentally engaged the internal lock while testing to see if it was locked.
At any rate, the internal lock is now locked and will not unlock. The gun will not come off safe, and can not be disassembled while the internal lock is engaged.
It's going back to Ruger.
One more reason to love internal locks.
It failed to operate properly at the range--may have been reassembled improperly. He thought that the internal lock might have engaged by mistake and tried to unlock it. It appears that either that was the case, or that he accidentally engaged the internal lock while testing to see if it was locked.
At any rate, the internal lock is now locked and will not unlock. The gun will not come off safe, and can not be disassembled while the internal lock is engaged.
It's going back to Ruger.
One more reason to love internal locks.
