Why a SA revolver?

More of a Quest For the Perfect Sixgun?

A Ruger is still just a Ruger Jim, grandpa called them pot metal and I still can't disagree. Strong and sturdy yessir! The 454 Casull in a Ruger? Yep, been there but the company that supplied the cylinders quit because of a supposed litigation from Ruger? That's what he told me anyway, I think Reider might still do it? Bowen, P&R, Linebaugh and Strogh (sp?) won't anymore. I forgot about the M.R. gun, saw one at a store last year for $800.00 but it was a piece of crap, poorly fitted with the lightest cut rifling I've ever seen. The 97, three of us bought these and all of us had some problems but all FA prejidice aside the gun is just in a class of it's own with it's size and power. Something else to toss in the mix Jim is the old Ruger Flattop or the old model .357s which have a smaller and lighter frame than the new models. Case wall thickness in the Linebaughs? Not to worry Jim, myself and many others have run the pressures up in the Linebaughs with no cylinder failures to my knowlege. We've run the 440s@1500fps out of both the .475 and the .500s for more than several years now. Definitely not thumbing loads Jim, as far as the .44 Mag being optimal I can't say either. It's hard to argue Keith still, the .44 Mag is the upper limit of controlability in a handgun. Try to get someone to loan/rent a 454 Casull or one or both of the Linebaughs for a little session of pins. It'll be one of those Kodak moments, would ya believe I had a newby correct me on the use of 454 instead of .454? Picky people these days but admittedly he had a point cuz some people believe that the 454 Casull is a .454? GRIN! Thanks for the patience Jim, Roy
 
Hey Jim, I tried to find a smith to get the parts to convert my second gen SAA civilian 45 and turn it into a slipgun ( keeping standard parts to change it back to original ). But then I've always subscribed to the school of thought that the crazier I look the less likely they'll mess with me.
 
A Slip Gun in 454 Casull!

I'm still grinning! Rusty, what's so tough about a slip gun? Lower the hammer spur (welding shop) and lose the top part of the trigger that engages the hammer (grind/file), done deal. Roy
 
Why own a single action? Here's 10 reasons...

1. Double Action wheelguns look silly in my buscadero rig.

2. They sure are purty.

3. The Duke did. So did The Man With No Name.

4. Because dry-firing at the TV with a double action or (ptui!) an autopistol while watching Tombstone, Young Guns 2, Lonesome Dove, or Unforgiven is just plain wrong.

5. Because if you practice a lot and eat your wheaties, maybe you can be like Bob Munden when you grow up.

6. Because double actions in Mr. Linebaugh's atomic calibers are thin on the ground.

7. Because you can.

8. Because one of the reasons for collecting guns is getting a feel for the tools that helped create this great nation...

9. Swapping cylinders on a Blackhawk is easier than swapping barrels on an auto.

10. They go *bang!*, don't they?
 
I just bought a 3rd gen SAA for much the same reasons that Tamara mentioned. That color-case hardened frame sure does look nice. I can't shoot it worth darn, but them I'm not very good shooting single-handed, and I suspect that the SASS folks would take a dim view of me using Isoceles...

M1911
 
There was no practical reason to buy any of the SA revolvers which I now own. The only justification I could find is fun and that was good enough. Now, if you're talking about owning just one gun and whether it should be DA or SA revolver, that's a different matter altogether.
 
Gary:

Well, the "practical reason" why I bought my SAA was that I need an SA revolver for demonstration when I teach NRA Basic Pistol. At least, that's the excuse I'm using this week ;)

M1911
 
Alaska Roy,

I was rather suprised by your insider information that Linebaugh, P&R, and Bowen will no longer convert Rugers. Where did you get your information about big name gunsmiths not rechambering Rugers in 454 due to liability issues?? They're still advertising those services on their webpages.

Linebaugh chambers Rugers exclusively in 475linebaugh and up as well as fitting them with 5 shot 45colt cylinders (equal to 454 in some loadings). Bowen will rechamber a Ruger SA in 454, 475 Linebaugh, and 500Linebaugh (as well as the Redhawk in 454 and SuperRedhawk in 475). Stroh doesn't list any rechambering on his webpage (that I could find), but I believe he's more of a "tuner" to begin with (he did a great job on my gun).


Chris
 
Mtnbker

On the 454 Casull conversion I admit to having lurked on Taffins and Taylors sixguns site. Taffins said it several times that a reliable smith would never do the conversion. Over the years I've bought 6 or eight cylinders from P&R in Texas pre-chambered in 454 but in my last conversation with Roger he mentioned a litigation threat has caused him to discontinue the chambering so I just got the five shot .45 Colts and bought a reamer to deepen the chambers on the last couple. FYI many of the gun guys are slow getting into this net stuff (me too) and prefer one on one conversations on the phone. Roy
 
I'm out there every day as well. The only thing along those lines I've heard is a problem converting a levergun to 454 (they all shoot apart very quickly). I wonder what John Linebaugh's going to do if he won't convert Rugers since that's all he seems to be willing to work on. I'll have to keep an eye out for news regarding Ruger conversions.

Chris
 
Roy? We've got our wires crossed somewhere...?

Is the fear that the .454Casull converted Rugers will blow up, or is it a fear of FA suing them for using the caliber?

Neither makes any sense at all. I mean, sorry, but...OK, let's take this piece by piece.

1) The .475Linebaugh is more potent than the .454Casull, right? (Please, if that's wrong, say so, it might explain what's up if we're starting from a false premise?)

2) If the .454 is the milder load, then in a five-shot cylinder of the same outward dimensions as a .475Linebaugh cylinder, the .454 should be stronger due to case wall thickness?

3) Ruger sells a six-shot DA in .454Casull. (see also: http://www.ruger-firearms.com/rvlarge.html ) Now, the Super Redhawk is a fine gun and all, but we've all been assuming that at least in five-shot, the Super Blackhawk can take more pressure. True?

I'm not trying to be disrespectful, I genuinely appreciate someone involved who's really "been there, done that". I'm just askin' for clarification here...

Jim
 
454 Casull and .475 Linebaugh-

The times they are a changing, the original (just my memory) was a big bullet (400-440gn) chugging out at 1200-1350fps at pressures around 35-38,000cup. Nowdays everyone is running the pressures up to get the bullets to the 14-1500fps but still around 50,00psi (dunno about the psi vs cup conversion?) but the Linebaugh sales thing is big bullets at lower pressures. The 454 casull way back in the Bi-Centenial (Utah guns) were using triplex loads running 65,80,000 cup (some say 100,000cup!) cuz H-110 wasn't out yet. When Casull got the plant going in Wyoming things changed a bit with the gun being made from a stainless intead of the blued tool steel. Early eighties we got brass with inserts for the primers to take the small rifle primers then later the brass came with small primer holes. Hmm, nowdays Jim the 454 has been downsized in pressure from the eightys but still runs in the mid 50,000cup to 60,00cup depending on ammo mfg. As I posted above somewhere I believe the Redhawk and Super Redhawk to be stronger than the BH/SBH frames but in my experience the BH/SBH new model frame is strong enough for the 454 Casull. I run 305gc@1800fps out of the 5 1/2in Bisley conversion with no sweat. The case is totally fill with a very compressed load of H-110 using mag small rifle primers. Frankly Jim, I dunno if P&R was covering their butts or not and don't care. They've been a good supply of parts to wile the winter away and don't wanna burn that bridge. I understand they've stopped supplying the parts kits to all but the old timer customer list now that they've started building their own gun line. A guy in Anchorage just got a SRH in .500 Linebaugh from Ca. gunsith Jack Huntington that I really want to try out next weekend. It's finally snowing! Roy
 
Tamara? Linebaughs Are Thin?

Thin on the ground???? Ya lost me there, Mr. March sorry I got to drifting again. Basically the Casull is a very high pressure cartridge compared to most anything we can load. The Weatherbys only run 55,000cup whole we routinely ran loads in the 80,000cup range in conversions and Casulls. That's why the 454 has the rifle primers and the Linebaughs have pistol primers. Mtnbker, ask Taffin if ya don't believe me? He's the self appointed guru and one hell of a marketer of the sixguns, I bought the book too along with a bunch of sixguns and all the tools from Brownells to do my own work. The gunsmiths were just too proud and pricey for me, Linebaugh gets what? $1300.00 plus the gun for a conversion with $300.00 in parts? No thanks, a Ruger ain't that complicated nor precise to justify that price. BTW Jim, here in AK I'llwager we've got more 454s than any other state. At the range i see and shoot many of the Rugers 454 SRHs and the Taurus RBs. The Taurus won't holdup to the old full power loads but no problems with the Rugers other than a little polishing here and there. The new steel they use is even stronger than the older castings they use in the .44s and .45s
Roy
 
"Thin on the ground"= an aphorism meaning "scarce, uncommon", as in "Palm trees are pretty thin on the ground north of the Brooks Range." :)
 
Ah! THAT explains it...

It's a pressure difference. Makes sense.

<scratches head>

Hey, that leads to a different question entirely...just how hot could you push the .357Mag in a Blackhawk? 1500fps in a 158 seems sane in the BH or a six-gun N-Frame by several accounts...is that the limit? :D

Jim
 
.357 Mag. Loads-

Jim, that's a caliber I never got excited about and only rarely load it for a buddy with book loads. I flipped through a couple manuals and the 1500fps doesn't sound too hard to reach with a barrel 5in or longer and hopefully the barrel to cylinder gap isn't excessive. Some factory gaps these days run up to .008 and tightning to .002-.003 can gain upto a hundred fps with magnum loads. Roy
 
FYI: You may not be able to get Custom Ruger SA's in 454 but you can get them in 5 shot 45 LC that are in same pressure & power league. From Bowen, Linebaugh, & others.
 
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