Which is THE supergun G17 or G19!?!?
- Thread starter mvdemarco
- Start date
ojibweindian
New member
Don't think it's either the G17 or G19. I think the Ruger P-95 is the super gun! The Glocks being a close second, mind you 
The G17 is generally recognized as one of the significant modifications to semi-auto handgun design this half-century. That being said, once the G19's have been in circulation long enough some of them will be "million round" wonderguns as well.
Personally, I prefer the G19 to the G17. Another 995,000 rounds or so, and MINE will have a million through it!
Personally, I prefer the G19 to the G17. Another 995,000 rounds or so, and MINE will have a million through it!
Quantum Singularity
New member
Neither. 9mm Glocks in general do not impress me.
shooter.45
New member
I like the G19 also like the G26 just got one of those. But they are both great guns The g17,g19 just like the 19 better..
In the FBI tests their G23s outperformed the G22s in terms of shots fired w/o any breakages. They were the G22s trigger springs in the government torture test. Big Deal. Both passed with flying colors.
*Source - Weapons for Police and Law Enforcement Spring 2001
Maybe thats an indication of the G19s "superiority" over the G17. If that matters.
*Source - Weapons for Police and Law Enforcement Spring 2001
Maybe thats an indication of the G19s "superiority" over the G17. If that matters.
Quantum,
The Glock 17 and 19 don't impress you, huh? You must not be easily impressed.
Let's see--utter reliability, extremely fast shootability(faster than the other calibers), very light felt recoil, extremely quick recovery from shot to shot, can hold as many as 33 rounds in a magazine(Glock 18 mag, of which I own 3), can handle hot NATO and submachine gun ammo, and has greater penetration capability than either .40 or .45, especially on car bodies and body armor. And, oh yeah, you can find ammunition anywhere in the world for it. You're right--very unimpressive. Why even look twice at the 19 or 17?
I have a feeling, Quantum, that if you went up against someone armed with one of those little piddling Glock 9mm's, and they knew how to use it, you'd have a slightly different impression. Just a guess.
The Glock 17 and 19 don't impress you, huh? You must not be easily impressed.
Let's see--utter reliability, extremely fast shootability(faster than the other calibers), very light felt recoil, extremely quick recovery from shot to shot, can hold as many as 33 rounds in a magazine(Glock 18 mag, of which I own 3), can handle hot NATO and submachine gun ammo, and has greater penetration capability than either .40 or .45, especially on car bodies and body armor. And, oh yeah, you can find ammunition anywhere in the world for it. You're right--very unimpressive. Why even look twice at the 19 or 17?
I have a feeling, Quantum, that if you went up against someone armed with one of those little piddling Glock 9mm's, and they knew how to use it, you'd have a slightly different impression. Just a guess.
Quantum Singularity
New member
Don't get me wrong, I am not knocking the 9mm Glocks. I just don't like the mediocre accuracy that they gave me (the 5 I got rid of were all 9mm). They simply don't work for me. OTOH, the Glock 21 and most of the .45 Glocks group much tighter for me. Since I am not paranoid about combat scenarios, I will take the most accurate gun every time. Additionally, IMO the (G17 and G19) in particular have too much snap and muzzle flip for a 9mm. There are better 9mm's out there than Glocks IMO. One of the reasons I kept my Glock 26 is that it groups much better than the G17s and G19s I got rid of. I scratched my head several times wondering why the baby Glock outshot the larger models, and I still can't figure out the reason.
For combat, the 9mm Glocks work fine.
The 9mm is a great round. You can shoot 9mm's relatively fast. Having said that, I also can shoot .45's Glocks fast. With the Kaliforna magazine ban, I can't get hi-caps legally any more. Even pre-1994 hi caps are illegal. That simplifies the choice even more.....10 rounds of .45 vs 10 rounds of 9mm. Why should I go down in caliber AND lose accuracy? For long range target shooting I'll take a .45 Glock any day of the week over a 9mm Glock. When I decide to shoot 9mm, it will be another pistol brand launching the bullet. 9mm Glocks are fine for combat. No denying that. However, I am not concerned about combat shooting. Even if I were, both my Sig Sauers and Ruger P97 have been MORE reliable than my Glocks as a whole. IMO, any quality gun will serve fine if TSHTF.
I too would like to see documentation on the million round Glock.
Simple answer: G19 over the G17
Complex answer: Sold my G19, won't own a G17.
I can't shoot them. They have never completely felt comfortable to me. The comment about, "going up against someone with a Glock", what is that?
Within the group of guys that I shoot regularly with, Glocks, including my old G19, have never demonstrated anykind of superiority other than being the least accurate of our battery. Granted only G17, G19, G22, and G23 are represented. I take that back .44DE wins hands down.
If I, "Go up against someone", just give me a handgun that I train with, and feels like an extension of my own hand. For myself, it just does not happen to be a Glock.
Simple answer: G19 over the G17
Complex answer: Sold my G19, won't own a G17.
I can't shoot them. They have never completely felt comfortable to me. The comment about, "going up against someone with a Glock", what is that?
Within the group of guys that I shoot regularly with, Glocks, including my old G19, have never demonstrated anykind of superiority other than being the least accurate of our battery. Granted only G17, G19, G22, and G23 are represented. I take that back .44DE wins hands down.
If I, "Go up against someone", just give me a handgun that I train with, and feels like an extension of my own hand. For myself, it just does not happen to be a Glock.
Quantum Singularity
New member
LOL!
Agreed. IMO those are also the least accurate Glock models (23,17,22,19). The G23 being the worst of the four you mentioned.
Having said that, give the Glock 21 and Glock 30 a try. I can't explain why, but the .45 Glocks tend to be the most accurate Glocks. My Glock 21 is a true tackdriver. BTW, the .45 Glocks do a better job of absorbing recoil ("pound for pound") than the other Glocks IMO.
G17 is more pleasant to shoot, in good holster I have no problem with the carry it comfortable all day even with its size. But If you pripary aim is the CCW, then the G19 will be slightly better for that purpose.
Glocks fit MY hand much better than any other gun (maybe together with CZ75/85), and the "no safety" and its sleek and compact design withouth exposed hammer are right what I prefer for the gun I cary and trust to!
I am also fine with the trigger (with 3,5 connector) and prefer the non-serrated versin of G17 over the compact Glocks. If I want trigger to fondle, then CZ does the job! But still, due the mentioned features, I prefer the Glock for cary over anything else - if you will need it and adrenaline goes high, you do not need worry about the safety od doble action trigger...
Glocks fit MY hand much better than any other gun (maybe together with CZ75/85), and the "no safety" and its sleek and compact design withouth exposed hammer are right what I prefer for the gun I cary and trust to!
I am also fine with the trigger (with 3,5 connector) and prefer the non-serrated versin of G17 over the compact Glocks. If I want trigger to fondle, then CZ does the job!
But still, due the mentioned features, I prefer the Glock for cary over anything else - if you will need it and adrenaline goes high, you do not need worry about the safety od doble action trigger...Allow me to explain why I think in combat terms. Here's the thing--I live in Miami, Florida. Unlike the Socialist Repubic of Kalifornia(and a number of other states), where they would make CHEESE illegal if they could, the State of Florida allows its non-felon permanent residents to carry firearms, or any other weapon of their choosing concealed, once they are issued a permit--which is very easy to get.
You see, Miami is a gun town with a prevalent gun culture. It can also be, at times, a dangerous town. Everyone here who carries a firearm on either a daily or semi-daily basis has hopefully prepared themselves mentally for the possibility that one day, God forbid, they may have to use their firearm to defend themselves or others at some point. That's the responsibility of carrying a firearm, and that is why I think in terms of combat scenarios. I do not want it, but I must be prepared for it. If I don't, and it actually happens, I will not respond in the necessary way, and my life, or others' lives, will have much less chance of continuing. That being said, I, like you, enjoy accuracy and the shooting range as much as the next guy. However, most of us down here go to the range to stay as sharp as we can in case something goes down on the street one day.
In Kalifornia and a number of other states, because your states do not trust you as responsible, law abiding citizens to carry a firearm in a safe and responsible manner, and instead treats you like children, the concept of having to use your firearm in a situation outside your own home is not as distinct a possibility as it is down here. This is because if you are out and about, and obeying the laws of your liberal masters, you cannot have your gun with you. I believe it has to be tucked away neatly in your home or office(please let me know if I am mistaken). Down here, those of us who carry concealed take our guns everywhere with us. If they are not on our person, they are usually at least with us while we are zipping around in our cars.
It's a totally different world here than in Kalifornia and these other states. I think you would find it to be quite a culture shock to stay down here for a while, after having to put up with all the restrictions you face where you live.
You see, Miami is a gun town with a prevalent gun culture. It can also be, at times, a dangerous town. Everyone here who carries a firearm on either a daily or semi-daily basis has hopefully prepared themselves mentally for the possibility that one day, God forbid, they may have to use their firearm to defend themselves or others at some point. That's the responsibility of carrying a firearm, and that is why I think in terms of combat scenarios. I do not want it, but I must be prepared for it. If I don't, and it actually happens, I will not respond in the necessary way, and my life, or others' lives, will have much less chance of continuing. That being said, I, like you, enjoy accuracy and the shooting range as much as the next guy. However, most of us down here go to the range to stay as sharp as we can in case something goes down on the street one day.
In Kalifornia and a number of other states, because your states do not trust you as responsible, law abiding citizens to carry a firearm in a safe and responsible manner, and instead treats you like children, the concept of having to use your firearm in a situation outside your own home is not as distinct a possibility as it is down here. This is because if you are out and about, and obeying the laws of your liberal masters, you cannot have your gun with you. I believe it has to be tucked away neatly in your home or office(please let me know if I am mistaken). Down here, those of us who carry concealed take our guns everywhere with us. If they are not on our person, they are usually at least with us while we are zipping around in our cars.
It's a totally different world here than in Kalifornia and these other states. I think you would find it to be quite a culture shock to stay down here for a while, after having to put up with all the restrictions you face where you live.
ojibweindian
New member
I've had the opportunity to shoot the G17 and G19 on a few seperate occasions. I liked them, and was going to buy one. That is, until I was introduced to the Ruger P95. One helluva pistol. Durable, accurate, dependable. I've fed that pistol everything I could get my hands on, and it has eaten it all without a hiccup, excepting a few boxes of UMC 115gr FMJ that were weakly loaded.
During the session in which I had the UMC stuff, feeding was good, but the slide rarely locked after the last round of UMC in the magazine was expended. I had several boxes of Winchester Winclean that gave me no problems whatsoever, and I have had no problems since that particular session. Of course, I haven't used UMC stuff since then, either!
Accuracy is good, with groups ranging from 2 to 5 inches at 25 yards, depending, of course, on a number of variables. The Glocks I have seen and shot do no better.
Really, about the only bad thing I can say about my P95 is its stainless slide which, if not properly cared for, especially during the humid spring and summer months, will accumulate some marginal surface rusting. Routine cleaning does eliminate this problem, however.
Additionally, I've heard that Ruger tested the P95 by subjecting it to a grueling test of twenty thousand consecutive rounds of +P+ ammo with minimal, if any cleaning or lubing, without malfunction or signiificant degredation in accuracy. All at a price that is less than any G17 or G19.
To me, that makes the P95 superior to the G17 or G19.
During the session in which I had the UMC stuff, feeding was good, but the slide rarely locked after the last round of UMC in the magazine was expended. I had several boxes of Winchester Winclean that gave me no problems whatsoever, and I have had no problems since that particular session. Of course, I haven't used UMC stuff since then, either!
Accuracy is good, with groups ranging from 2 to 5 inches at 25 yards, depending, of course, on a number of variables. The Glocks I have seen and shot do no better.
Really, about the only bad thing I can say about my P95 is its stainless slide which, if not properly cared for, especially during the humid spring and summer months, will accumulate some marginal surface rusting. Routine cleaning does eliminate this problem, however.
Additionally, I've heard that Ruger tested the P95 by subjecting it to a grueling test of twenty thousand consecutive rounds of +P+ ammo with minimal, if any cleaning or lubing, without malfunction or signiificant degredation in accuracy. All at a price that is less than any G17 or G19.
To me, that makes the P95 superior to the G17 or G19.
the million round gun
The local gun range used a G17 for a rental gun that was sent to them by Glock. It was the most popular rental. It took all types of ammo over a 5 year period. They called glock and asked them to send them a new one. The people at Glock asked what was wrong with the one they had. The owner of the range said nothing is wrong but, its had an awful lot of rounds through it. Glock asked them to send it to them for inspection and if worn they would send a new one. A week later the old gun came back with a letter telling them that all parts of the gun were still within factory specifications and to send it back when it quit working. As far as I know it is still going strong.
The local gun range used a G17 for a rental gun that was sent to them by Glock. It was the most popular rental. It took all types of ammo over a 5 year period. They called glock and asked them to send them a new one. The people at Glock asked what was wrong with the one they had. The owner of the range said nothing is wrong but, its had an awful lot of rounds through it. Glock asked them to send it to them for inspection and if worn they would send a new one. A week later the old gun came back with a letter telling them that all parts of the gun were still within factory specifications and to send it back when it quit working. As far as I know it is still going strong.
WoundChannel
New member
G19...
For me, its the G19 when it comes to ccw, everyday livability, and portability. I'd bet my life on it and I do.
For me, its the G19 when it comes to ccw, everyday livability, and portability. I'd bet my life on it and I do.