Where is the line?

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No - the best thing is to have some thought and practice about possibilities. I'm afraid gun lists sometimes get pissy-wissy if the solution isn't just open fire.

It offends folks to think that a shoot out isn't a guaranteed solution.
 
I would rather live knowing I used every possible skill I had to defend myself and my family.

Like I said once before, if you are not aware of a problem you can't do anything about it. If you look up from your table and there are two armed men standing in front of you, you have lost that fight.

If you carry a firearm for self defence you are obliged to know how to use it. If not, you absolutley can't do anything about a threat.
 
I would rather live knowing I used every possible skill I had to defend myself and my family.
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Define skill - do you only mean starting a gun fight or does skill mean using intelligence to get to the best possible outcome?

If you look up and someone shoots you in the head immediately, you lost. If you are in the waffle house, those guys will draw before you, despite you being in Condition Flaming Crimson! So the guns are out, what then?

I'm sorry - I don't go for cliches over thought.
 
Or possibly I may have enough sense to say to myself "Hmm these guys don't look like they want waffles".

So I guess using your logic, we should just leave the guns at home if we aren't at the range.

The can nots are always so defensive when their skills tap them on their shoulder and say "nope, you can't do anything".
 
Missed the point - whatever.

In the Waffle House, in an urban area, lots of interesting strange people walk in for waffles. You gonna jump up and shoot everyone who walks up to the register who doesn't fit your view of the world. Get real here.

And if you want to postulate that I said to leave the guns home because I think about things a touch - that is a very misguided view and a typical response to someone who doesn't automatically say SHOOT 'EM ALL. Cheap rhetoric, IMHO.

Now, I getting pissy-wissy. :D
 
The point isnt to leave your guns at home, or that you should never shoot... just that you should use your head before you do... correct?
Saying that you'll shoot just because someone is robbing you doesnt make sense...

edit: just beat by Glenn
 
I would rather live knowing I used every possible skill I had to defend myself and my family.
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There is far more to defending self and family than getting into a gunfight, just as there is a lot more to defense than shooting. Understanding that is the key to rational response, IMO.
 
It's in the criminology literature - so one can go google-scholar or other data bases to look it up.
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Heaven forbid we should actually look up data and research, Glenn. It is so much more satisfying to go on "That's the way it is 'cuz I seen it happen on the news once."
 
Well, if you are just going to open fire on the Goth Chick with the Biker who walk into Cracker Barrel and go to register - that's a good idea for you.

Maybe they want to buy some Tipsy Fudge Cake or have a Momma's Pancake Breakfast.

I remember sitting in the Pancake house waiting for some takeout and waiting for it. I was carrying a Glock 19 with Federal 124 gr Hydrashoks in a Milt Sparks IWB. In comes a big evil looking guy in leather jacket with chains on it. He walks to the cash register.

Shoot him? Because if he draws the gun, I lost the gun fight. But guess what, he was getting take out also.

Or possibly I may have enough sense to say to myself "Hmm these guys don't look like they want waffles".

I don't have the telepathic powers to discern who to shoot all the time.
 
I am of the opinion that unless your life or the life of a loved one (not some stranger) is in immediate unavoidable jeopardy then fine to shoot.

I do not think it is right or moral to shoot a thief who is not threatening you. The recent case in Texas of Joe Horn is one that quickly comes to mind. I think Joe Horn should have been prosecuted, but he wasn't, still I think he did wrong and am glad I don't have to live with the aftermath.
 
Glenn E. Meyer

Glenn, Would you please leave the Goth Chick alone, the NEAR dead have enough problems:).

Think I've fired all of my ammo on this subject, AGAIN all misses! Just wanted to again tip my hat, as of post #33 you have been compelling (Not quite as good as "what to do when the police come"), but a quality voice in favor of reason.

Aren't Milt's summer specials wonderful holsters, have now retired mine after 25 years of use for a Bladetec IWB. Times, they do change.

Good Luck & Be Safe

PS By the look of things, guess I need to reload and re-engage!
 
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Double Naught Spy
armed robbery, where at no time did the original thread mention guns pointed at the CCW holder or his family. That has been the issue and discussion. Do you intervene on a armed robbery, not that the gun is pointing at you, if I remember correctly "guns waving around" was the exact quote.
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Yes, I am sure they didn't point a gun at a single person during the robbery such as those not complying fast enough. :barf:

You don't have to be swept by a gun to consider your life in danger by robbers who are systematically robbing the patrons of the eatery.

Of course, you can do whatever you want, but if I am in a place during an armed robbery where the robbers have taken control of the situation, then I consider my life as being in danger and I won't have any problems justifying my actions via case or book law.
 
Double Naught Spy

I do not care about others, I am no longer a sheepdog, Good Luck white knight. When you are done I hope those very sheep you protect don't accuse you and file on you. :barf: right back at ya, sport.
 
Criminolgy literature? Are you nuts?

My response to David Armstrong who keeps ranting on what we should do when something terrible happens to us. I find it very hard to believe he was ever in law enforcement?? He doesn't have a clue to what I have been saying happened to me, (or all the other folks out there who are robbed and their life is put at rish by some low life loser).
Who the hell has time to worry about looking up some B.S. written by some legal eagle who says "this is exactly what you must do when your life is threatned or else you could end up in deep doo doo" Gag me! What a joke! You don't have that much time to think about it David. Trust me son, its scary and I acutally peed in my pants. I was attacked and injured. I was lucky because others have not walked away from robberies.
Maybe you need to go teach somewhere in a very liberal college where they would understand your "thinking"...........
I can't becuse, THIS IS THE REAL WORLD.
 
... I am troubled by having to make the choice between passive and aggresive responce in a situation like the one in the post above or the threads in past posts. I know what the law says, but what would a reasonable person do?
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If one knows what the law says, what is wrong with complying with the law ? If one does not, how can one say they are better that those that violate the law ?

It seems to me that if this distinction becomes blurred, then so does the 'line' between legal and illegal.
 
"I do not care about others"-Scattergun Bob

Tough to hear you don't care about others. The simple fact is, there are those of us here that will not be robbed, beaten, or watch this happen to our loved ones. It's not about saving the world, its about doing what needs to be done to protect ourselves. Not sitting there quietly and hope it does not take a turn for the worse.
 
tirvin73

Please understand, for 20 plus years I was responsible for the safety and defense of others. I have great pride and bare the scars of that service. I am not suggesting that others are wrong doing this. I am simply saying that those who can not defend themselves need to look toward another white knight (sheepdog) beside ME. If that is a problem for you, well, DO your 20 and then see how you feel.

I don't know why you would construe my posts to suggest that I would "be sitting there quietly and hope it does not take a turn for the worse." If you knew my history and my writing you would find that observation as funny as I do :D. If a true and valid threat identifier is present, trust me I will respond with decisive and aggressive behavior, It may not be in the manner of the Hondo's on the forum.
 
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