Whats the proper thing to do?

S

Soybomb

New member
I was in downtown St. Louis one afternoon, parked my car, got out, and a man approached me shortly after I fed the parking meter and began to walk away asking for money. I said I just put it all in the meter and he persisted talking relatively incoherently asking if I liked pancakes or something. I started walking away and he kept following me, our paces quickening, even following me across the street. He wasn't within arms reach and was keeping a little distance maybe 10-15 feet but clearly following. A few seconds later a group of people came around the corner and he veered off in a different direction.

I don't know what his intentions were now of course, but it put me on edge since he was clearly following me. How would you deal with this where you get the feeling something's up, but haven't been threatened directly yet?
 
Just keep walking. If he actually made physical contact, you'd be justified to respond in kind, but certainly not a unholstering situation. It's situations such as this where pepper spray may well be an important tool.
 
You don't say where you live. In some states physical contact is not necessary to establish imminent danger.

You did right in walking away, if you were not walking to a secluded spot out of view of the public ,not that the public will always help you.
Never ever let them decide where you will walk and always be aware of what and who is ahead of you.

If he closed the distance or caused you to actually fear immediate attack you may have to take an aggressive defensive posture. Pepper spray would work well in that case, I don't think that there is a brandishing law on that
 
Well the only bad thing about waiting for physical contact would be this was a guy that could have wrung me like a wet towel :D

This was in missouri a couple years ago before they allowed concealed carry anyway, but its just something I was thinking about now as a what-if.
 
Soybomb, I don't understand your point. Would your preference have been to shoot the guy because you had the feeling something was up? One must learn to accept that it's a big world and everybody in it is not your friend.
My question to you is what would you have done had not the group of people walked around the corner? I'm not flaming you, but you come across as a scared man. Myself, I'm not a particularly large man, but I'd never be wrung like a wet towel. The best advice I can offer you is to keep your world as small as possible.
 
Soybomb
There is no shame in recognizing and admitting your limitations, or in running like hell if the situation calls for it.
 
:rolleyes: I don't know; my first thought would have been to use OC spray on him; but, from what you've said, he WAS minding his manners. Because he was careful to act non-threatening I would have, probably, tossed a couple of bucks at him - if for no other reason than I had errands to run and he knew what I was driving! ;)
 
Just what you did. Walk away until you can't walk away any longer. Then turn face them, and get loud. I mean top of your voice, bulhorn screaming loud. "Stop following me, and leave me alone". You want to draw attention of as many people as you can. If this doesn't work, yell FIRE!. If you are 5' 2", and the BG is 6' 4", and 400 lbs, once he closes to within 7 yards things change. Always try to find the peaceful non violent resolution.
We live in a day and age when unfortunately far to many people ignore cries of help, but nobody ignores a fire!
 
Soybomb, I don't understand your point. Would your preference have been to shoot the guy because you had the feeling something was up? One must learn to accept that it's a big world and everybody in it is not your friend. My question to you is what would you have done had not the group of people walked around the corner? I'm not flaming you, but you come across as a scared man. Myself, I'm not a particularly large man, but I'd never be wrung like a wet towel. The best advice I can offer you is to keep your world as small as possible.
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No, I don't even carry actually, I'm just new to the site and trying to see how people react with carrying. Call it scared if you like, personally I think its a decent idea to have some idea of what you want to do if a scenario were to repeat itself somewhat differently. I think its also good to know your limits physically, a physical confrontation with him wouldn't have ended well for me, although that sort of thing seems unlikely anyway in this situation.

Had the group not come around I would have continued as I was, increasing speed to keep him from closing the gap. If he produced a gun I would have probably tossed my wallet and took off hoping he'd go for it. He may have just been a random nut case too and thats all there was to it. Its more of a what-if thing.

I was actually more curious how those that do carry would respond to something like this. At what point do you feel threatened enough to get a grip or draw without seeing that the other person is armed? Ever? Wait until they're on top of you? Never unless you see they're armed? Call it the new guy's curiosity to see how others would have responded I guess. Alot of people talk about how fast someone close distance, so how much do you worry about that?
 
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It is a gray area, and has been discussed before on other threads.

Let me say a few things on it though - First is that fear is the number one survival trait that has kept the human species from becoming extinct. Fear is not something to be ashamed of, it is something to be alert to - if you feel fear then pay attention because your strongest survival instinct is talking to you.

When to pull a gun on an apparently unarmed person is going to boil down to three things - circumstances, circumstances and circumstances. You can't pin down a scenario that someone else can't pull apart, from the safety of their chairs.

But when you get to a point where you are in a situation that causes you to be in fear of grievous bodily harm and/or for your life, then pull.
 
Seems like sound logic butch. I probably shouldn't have even asked until I'd taken a carry course or two next month, but nothing betterto do on a slow afternoon. :D
 
He may have been a bum [nonPC for 'homeless'],criminal, on alcohol, drugs or mentally ill. Any of those can be a danger ! Get away from him quickly .Go toward people in a well lit area.Or at least put a car between you and him.
 
I'd like to take the opportunity to suggest martial arts. I haven't spent much time on this forum so I'm not sure what kind of reaction this will get. See, most forums I've been on have a smattering of gun owners. Many of them are great guys and girls, just like anyone else. But occassionally I've come across the gun owners that balk and laugh at any mention of martial arts, using the argument that with their ability to carry firearms it's pointless and useless as a form of self defense.

From what I've seen on this forum, the people here seem to have quite a bit more common sense.

You said the guy could've easily taken you; change that. If you're physically unfit then do something about it and next time you won't be as worried. And unless you've lost the use of three or more limbs, physical disability is rarely an excuse. I've met a 70+ year old great grandmother fully capable of taking down full grown men...my last kung fu sigung was a small man in his late 40s, had suffered two strokes, was bound to a wheelchair the majority of the time, yet still managed to inflict some serious pain on any student of his choosing.

Pepper spray is a great idea and in an absolute worst case scenario you've got your sidearm but that's no reason not to start hitting a gym and getting yourself physically capable of taking down an aggressor. Tack on some useful hand to hand combat training (in other words, avoid pointless money making schemes such as self-teaching videos and books or any type of school teaching so-called "American Karate") and you'll be more confident in situations like these.


The best solution is still, like everyone said, to simply keep walking away. But the confidence you'll get from being in better shape and knowing that you can defend yourself unarmed will keep you calm and allow you to analyze the situation and choose a proper course of action.
 
Meaning no disrespect to redworm and others of the same opinion, but not everyone has the funds, the physical health, the time, and the inclination to involve oneself in martial arts.

I am one of those. I have a bum ticker, a few bad joints, am 60 years old, and have mostly survived this long by the Lord's protection and choosing which fights I would persue, . . . and which ones I would not. I have more than once walked away or run away today, . . . so that I would be here tomorrow.

My usual carry piece is a 1911 that I have never had to pull, and certainly hope that I never will have to. But I absolutely refuse to allow myself to come into close enough proximity to someone 1/2 or 1/3 my age who is hell bent on doing me less than well.

For me, . . . pepper spray is not an option, . . . as well as martial arts. If I can't out hobble the bg, . . . out think him (go into a public building, . . . pull out my cell phone and start dialing 911, . . . get back into my car, . . . etc.) then when he closes the distance that I feel my well being is threatened, . . . he is going to get an up close and personal look at the front end of my 1911 barrel, barrel bushing, front sight, . . . and if his eyesight is good and the light is right, . . . he may even be able to see the 230 grain FMJ sitting in there with his initials on it if he pushes the issue any more.

I have all the intentions of being the most peaceable person on the street, . . . but one of the most important battle rules is if you want to win, . . . you have to get bad enough, quick enough. Bg's win if you don't.

May God bless,
Dwight
 
Funds and time are understandable. A less than ideal physical condition is, in my opinion, even more of a reason to consider it. A bad heart, a few bad joints, and six decades won't allow you to take up Wing Tsung or Hung Gar but chen style Taijiquan is not only still an option but specifically suited to those kinds of variables. Many people think of Tai Chi as just wavy movements that people do as low impact excercise but most don't realize that the majority of techniques you learn from it are in fact very useful and very deadly.

The system is partially based on the principle of muscle training. If you learn how to move a certain way very slowly and practice it for years on end, the time can come when that particular motion can move an attackers arm out of the way while at the same time brining the back of your hand into his nose, shattering cartilage and forcing into his sinuses. There are other systems similar (though of course not as popular) that are also specifically tailored for either children, seniors, women, the disabled....hell, there's a system of kung fu, a very effective one by the way, that's designed to give the blind a fighting chance.


Sorry, I'm digressing. My point is that even without the martial arts, if he feels he's physically unable to defend himself then at the very least hitting a local gym or just buying a cheap weight set would do wonders. When you're in shape and know you can at the very least land a hard punch if you need to, it increases confidence which is absolutely essential in the decision making process when in any kind of threatening situation.

But that's just my two cents, I could be wrong. :p
 
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