What's the best PPK clone?
- Thread starter RdNckMaterialCulture
- Start date
Kentucky Rifle
New member
Look at all these posts from people who picked the Bersa!
It just goes to show you that sometimes, inexpensive pistols (some of the uninformed call "saturday night specials") are, in fact quite good. It'd be a shame if some politician somewhere is plotting against the Bersa just because it's an inexpensive pistol. Oh, that's right--NOW they've got OTHER things to worry about.
(Snicker
)
KR
It just goes to show you that sometimes, inexpensive pistols (some of the uninformed call "saturday night specials") are, in fact quite good. It'd be a shame if some politician somewhere is plotting against the Bersa just because it's an inexpensive pistol. Oh, that's right--NOW they've got OTHER things to worry about.
(Snicker)KR
I have a PA-63, made by FEG Hungary. It's pretty good, but the stock DA trigger pull was horrible until I obtained and installed a 9-lb mainspring. Now it works well.
As noted above, the PA-63 has an aluminum frame and is chambered in 9x18 Makarov. It's not bad to shoot, but you won't want to put 500 rounds thru it at one sitting. It's very handy to carry and the 9mm Mak is a decent SD cartridge, particularly with a JHP bullet. My PA-63 feeds JHPs no problem, but I have heard that some don't feed well with JHPs and have to be smoothed out a little.
I paid about $130 for mine. I make no pretense that it's a Walther, or even a Bersa, but it does what I want it to do for a minimal outlay of cash. You might want to check it out at www.Makarov.com and also go to the discussion board.
Good luck.
Bob
As noted above, the PA-63 has an aluminum frame and is chambered in 9x18 Makarov. It's not bad to shoot, but you won't want to put 500 rounds thru it at one sitting. It's very handy to carry and the 9mm Mak is a decent SD cartridge, particularly with a JHP bullet. My PA-63 feeds JHPs no problem, but I have heard that some don't feed well with JHPs and have to be smoothed out a little.
I paid about $130 for mine. I make no pretense that it's a Walther, or even a Bersa, but it does what I want it to do for a minimal outlay of cash. You might want to check it out at www.Makarov.com and also go to the discussion board.
Good luck.
Bob
Prodigalshooter
New member
The PA-63 is really a very nice pistol for the $$, mine always works, shoots HP & ball equally well. I'd like to get a Mak too, have heard so much about them being better than the PA-63.
I've also looked at the Bersas, they seem well made, but I'm not sure I want to add another caliber to my ammo stash(.380), as I don't think they come in 9x18, at least in Calif.
I tried to buy the CZ in 9x18, but it's not "allowed" here
I've also looked at the Bersas, they seem well made, but I'm not sure I want to add another caliber to my ammo stash(.380), as I don't think they come in 9x18, at least in Calif.
I tried to buy the CZ in 9x18, but it's not "allowed" here
ProdigalShooter - I made the same caliber decision the other way. I had a Bulgarian Makarov that I really liked and kinda wish I still had but let it go because between .380 and 9x18 I ended up opting for .380. It does have a wee less power but there are so many choices in ammo and so many great choices in pistols. Reading this thread, I would echo the praise for the P230/232, the now discontinued FEG AP and APK, and the non-clone CZ83. The 83, in particular, though a bit large but no larger than a Mak, is truly a very, very nice pistol. One of these days, I'm gonna have to pick up a Bersa. I just keep reading and hearing too many good things. I did like that Bulgie, though. Oh, well...
1911Fencer
New member
I was going to look for a PPK/S soon myself for CCW. I could carry my full size 1911, but it's too big to really be comfortable with, IMHO, especially for long times. Sure, you can't beat the power, but a smaller, more compact single stack pistol would work better.
Now that I've looked into it more, I think the Bersa Thunder will be my next buy. It has something I wish the PPK/S had, a manual slide stop/release. I have yet to hear ANYTHING negative about them, and for $200, I don't think you could beat that with a stick! I want the stainless tho. The Bersa-Llama website shows a satin nickel...
Does anyone know if the Bersa is available in Stainless, or is it just a satin nickel finish?
M@
Now that I've looked into it more, I think the Bersa Thunder will be my next buy. It has something I wish the PPK/S had, a manual slide stop/release. I have yet to hear ANYTHING negative about them, and for $200, I don't think you could beat that with a stick! I want the stainless tho. The Bersa-Llama website shows a satin nickel...
Does anyone know if the Bersa is available in Stainless, or is it just a satin nickel finish?
M@
Another vote for the Bersa.
A SIG 230 is a darned fine gun and the fit and finish is certainly better but is it worth double?
A true Walther PPK would be nice simply to have the genuine article and the fit and finish again is quite nice. But again, is it worth double?
An FEG is cheaper and from all accounts a decent gun. However, the Bersa is already pretty cheap (the price difference isn't that great) and it is much nicer. Also, the FEG is known for a horrible trigger.
A Mak is a great gun but the ammo isn't as easy to find in many areas, fit and finish isn't quite as nice, it is noticably bigger, and it isn't any cheaper.
My Bersa has NEVER failed to fire, feed or eject. It is quite accurate. Fit and finish is nice. The trigger is pretty good. Pointability is nice. Overall it is a very impressive gun and best of all I got it for only $215 new.
A SIG 230 is a darned fine gun and the fit and finish is certainly better but is it worth double?
A true Walther PPK would be nice simply to have the genuine article and the fit and finish again is quite nice. But again, is it worth double?
An FEG is cheaper and from all accounts a decent gun. However, the Bersa is already pretty cheap (the price difference isn't that great) and it is much nicer. Also, the FEG is known for a horrible trigger.
A Mak is a great gun but the ammo isn't as easy to find in many areas, fit and finish isn't quite as nice, it is noticably bigger, and it isn't any cheaper.
My Bersa has NEVER failed to fire, feed or eject. It is quite accurate. Fit and finish is nice. The trigger is pretty good. Pointability is nice. Overall it is a very impressive gun and best of all I got it for only $215 new.
I have a satin Bersa Thunder in .380. It is closer in size to my PPK/S. I wish someone would make a clone close in size to the PPK, with a flat magazine. There is one I saw, made by Indian Arms, but could not get a good enough look to tell the quality of it. It was stainless. I think I should just look for another stainless PPK, perhaps a used one.
MAK
IMHO, if you want that type of pistol it is hard to beat a military Makarov.
It was developed and issued as a war pistol by people who experienced war, death, and destruction unparalleled in modern history.
There are only 25 parts to the Mak and this includes the grip and the grip screw. There is obviously more to dependability than number of parts but in contrast the PP/PPK has 42 parts.
The Mak was built around the 9X18 which is supposedly the most powerful cartridge that a straight blow back action can handle for endurance functioning.
I have two EGs and two Bulgarians,I had fifth but gave it to a friend. I shoot them often. I have a Mak slide with 3dot sights-Novak low mount rear and Heine front. This slide was marketed by Makarov.com about 12-15 years ago. I can rotate this slide among the 4 pistols. It is my favorite carry weapon and I have more than a few handguns.
Much is made of the quality of EGs over the others but in my experience although they are finished better, with less tool/polish marks, there aint a lick of difference in reliability or accuracy between the EGs and Bulgies. Again, this is my experience. You'll be surprised how accurate as well as how simple they are to completely dismantle.
However, at one time they could be had for unbelievably low prices and have gone up considerably which takes some of the novelty away.
BTW, rear sights on military Maks are different heights. The are marked with numbers 1-4. 4 being highest, I think, so some shoot slightly high but none of mine have shot below POA...All the best, JJ
IMHO, if you want that type of pistol it is hard to beat a military Makarov.
It was developed and issued as a war pistol by people who experienced war, death, and destruction unparalleled in modern history.
There are only 25 parts to the Mak and this includes the grip and the grip screw. There is obviously more to dependability than number of parts but in contrast the PP/PPK has 42 parts.
The Mak was built around the 9X18 which is supposedly the most powerful cartridge that a straight blow back action can handle for endurance functioning.
I have two EGs and two Bulgarians,I had fifth but gave it to a friend. I shoot them often. I have a Mak slide with 3dot sights-Novak low mount rear and Heine front. This slide was marketed by Makarov.com about 12-15 years ago. I can rotate this slide among the 4 pistols. It is my favorite carry weapon and I have more than a few handguns.
Much is made of the quality of EGs over the others but in my experience although they are finished better, with less tool/polish marks, there aint a lick of difference in reliability or accuracy between the EGs and Bulgies. Again, this is my experience. You'll be surprised how accurate as well as how simple they are to completely dismantle.
However, at one time they could be had for unbelievably low prices and have gone up considerably which takes some of the novelty away.
BTW, rear sights on military Maks are different heights. The are marked with numbers 1-4. 4 being highest, I think, so some shoot slightly high but none of mine have shot below POA...All the best, JJ
BTW, the Makarov also has a chromed bore originally designed to better resist the effects of corrosive ammo.
Speaking of ammo, you can believe this or not but the Russians, at first, took into consideration that the ammo would be mass produced by unskilled, underpaid, peasants. Consistency and quality of lots of ammo might not be real good and the Mak was designed to somewhat overcome this. Keep in mind this condition concerns the initial timeframe in which the pistol was born.
Also, the Mak is built to shoot cheap, steel cased Wolf, Barnaul, etc. I have shot this ammo exclusively in all my Maks with no problems. Compare the cost of this ammo and you can afford to practice and stock up without going broke.
Speaking of ammo, you can believe this or not but the Russians, at first, took into consideration that the ammo would be mass produced by unskilled, underpaid, peasants. Consistency and quality of lots of ammo might not be real good and the Mak was designed to somewhat overcome this. Keep in mind this condition concerns the initial timeframe in which the pistol was born.
Also, the Mak is built to shoot cheap, steel cased Wolf, Barnaul, etc. I have shot this ammo exclusively in all my Maks with no problems. Compare the cost of this ammo and you can afford to practice and stock up without going broke.
Pond James Pond
New member
I don't think I've seen any mention of the Astra Constable or A60.
Both, I feel, are beautiful pistols. The former a more authentic single-stack, the other an impressive double-stack.
Both, I feel, are beautiful pistols. The former a more authentic single-stack, the other an impressive double-stack.
