What would a good gun show look like to you?
- Thread starter LewSchiller
- Start date
S&W-Keeper
New member
Lots of pinned barrel $300 S&W's, and $350 Colt Pythons.
thedudeabides
New member
I know what I'm sick of is the hillbilly flea market gun shows we have in Florida where everything is overpriced, used means used up, obviously fired guns are sold NIB, and everything is market up ridiculously.
Ever since people found out you sell get 45 ACP for 45 dollars per box of 50, that seems to be the going rate.
Haven't gone to a gun show in months, now.
Ever since people found out you sell get 45 ACP for 45 dollars per box of 50, that seems to be the going rate.
Haven't gone to a gun show in months, now.
I think they should change the name of the shows to something like " The cheap chinese knife, jewelry, scented candle, jerky, and overpriced gun show"
There are more cheap chinese knives than guns in the shows anymore...so who buys that junk? Someone must or the dealers would quit selling it.
I went to the Dallas show a couple weeks ago and they were having a militaria show along with it. Several tables were guys dressed in Nazi uniforms and selling nazi stuff.....really creepy I thought. As far as I'm concerned there is no place in a public forum like that for Nazi's.
There are more cheap chinese knives than guns in the shows anymore...so who buys that junk? Someone must or the dealers would quit selling it.
I went to the Dallas show a couple weeks ago and they were having a militaria show along with it. Several tables were guys dressed in Nazi uniforms and selling nazi stuff.....really creepy I thought. As far as I'm concerned there is no place in a public forum like that for Nazi's.
I normally sit on the "dealer" side of the tables. Some things I'd like to see:
Firearm related quiz at the door for all the "experts" about to tell me what's wrong with my stuff. Double admission if they don't pass the quiz. Triple admission if they can't even answer the first question.
Free admission for those who can show at least $500 cash in their possesion but they don't have to spend it if they don't find somethng they like.
People who sit their pop, ammo, etc on my table while they yak with their buddy owe part of my table rent.
Triple admission for those who can't tell original finish from refinished, especially on the stuff they're carrying themselves.
Firearm related quiz at the door for all the "experts" about to tell me what's wrong with my stuff. Double admission if they don't pass the quiz. Triple admission if they can't even answer the first question.
Free admission for those who can show at least $500 cash in their possesion but they don't have to spend it if they don't find somethng they like.
People who sit their pop, ammo, etc on my table while they yak with their buddy owe part of my table rent.
Triple admission for those who can't tell original finish from refinished, especially on the stuff they're carrying themselves.
Hunter Customs
New member
I know exactly what you are saying, been there myself.
Back when I was doing shows I displayed the custom 1911's I built, along with that I had a vast assortment of 1911 parts on the tables for sale
I was set-up at a show and a gentleman selling ammo that had tables next to
me ask me if I did a lot of shows.
I said about 10 or 12 a year.
He replied that he did 51 shows a year and that after a while he realized how really small the gene pool was.
I just said oh and left it at that.
Not long after his statement, the show opened and people started filtering in.
This gentleman steps up in front of the table I'm sitting behind, he's holding a pistol grip 870 at a semi ready position.
He just staring at me not saying a word, he stands there for several minutes doing the same.
I ask him if I could help him and he said yes, he wanted to know if I knew anything about shotguns.
I said yes what's the problem.
He starts to hand me the shotgun, I tell him to open the action first which he does.
He proceeds to show me that the barrel once read 2 3/4 inch but that was x out and now reads 3 inch, I said yes that was a common practice for Remington when they re-chambered a barrel.
He wanted to know if it was still ok to shoot 2 3/4 inch shells in this gun.
I said yes it's ok to shoot the shorter shells in the 3 inch chamber but do not shoot 3 inch shells in a 2 3/4 inch chamber.
He stands there with a puzzled look on his face, then ask me if 2 3/4 is shorter then 3 inch.
I looked at the guy next to me selling ammo, he had this big grin on his face and I said I see what you mean.
Best Regards
Bob Hunter
www.huntercustoms.com
I dealt at gun shows for years and was very successful at it. I would put a reasonable markup on my stuff and sold a lot of it. I listened to guys around me at most every show bitching about the economy, people with no money to spend and everything else they could blame their lack of sales on. There is a lot of money in people's pockets at the gunshows, but the smarter ones aren't going to be spending $100.00 for a $15.00 box of .22's that the dealer bought at Wal Mart. A $600.00 model 10 S&W doesn't attract a lot of buyers either. I always tried to figure out what I would reasonably pay for something if I were on the buyer's side of the table and that would base my sales price.
Blaming a buyer for not knowing how to recognize a refinish on a firearm is not what I would consider a good approach to retail sales....the dealer should be the one with the knowledge to access condition of a firearm. I have never seen a dealer point out the refinish on a firearm they were selling much as a used car salesman does not point out any flaws in their vehicles.
Good honest dealers that treat their customers fairly and with respect, get repeat sales......and find access to the $500.00 in the customer's pocket.
Blaming a buyer for not knowing how to recognize a refinish on a firearm is not what I would consider a good approach to retail sales....the dealer should be the one with the knowledge to access condition of a firearm. I have never seen a dealer point out the refinish on a firearm they were selling much as a used car salesman does not point out any flaws in their vehicles.
Good honest dealers that treat their customers fairly and with respect, get repeat sales......and find access to the $500.00 in the customer's pocket.
LewSchiller
New member
On the way home from the gun show at which we just worked I was reflecting on how much time we spend talking with women - and some couples - about guns. It's interesting in that we don't sell guns.
Scenario #1: Couple will come up to us - we'll start talking about the various concealment methods that we offer. She'll make a comment about her gun being too big...to be honest for anything other than open carry. Then it comes out that he "bought her" the gun that he wanted...I have to believe for himself. She's used it and can control it but there's really no way for her to carry or use it as a CW. He'll start talking about "stopping power" - I'll make a comment about it not being able to stop anything if she can't carry it. She'll say something like "See - I told you" and off we go. The alternate to this is an honest "I bought her a gun but she doesn't like it" which is like saying I bought her a purse. You don't buy a woman a purse. It's a big decision - they marry their purses - you just stand by and offer an opinion if asked.
Gun shopping isn't exactly the same but she has to like the fit and feel before anything else will happen.
Usually this comes to a good conclusion. Sometimes he scowls at me and drags her away.
Scenario #2: Not much different than #1 but the person who told her she needs a big gun was the CCW class instructor.
Scenario #3: She doesn't yet own a gun - hasn't taken a class but she wants to. The first thing we do is point her to Kathy Jackson's book - The Cornered Cat - and strongly recommend it as the only thing she needs to buy at the gun show that day. Some do - some don't - but we always point them to her website in any event.
She'll talk about trying friends guns and not feeling like she can control them or that she couldn't work the slide and so forth. So we'll talk a bit about different models and techniques and revolvers. They are just so happy to have somebody who isn't talking to them like a child that they spend a lot of time with us. Hopefully we're building a future sale
Scenario #4 is "We came here to buy her a gun" They talk to us about what we like and know and who at the show we recommend. We are careful to advise finding a way to actually try the guns that they like to be sure they really are the right bowl of porridge. The NRA Women on Target program is great for this.
The summary of this is - people, especially women, need somebody neutral with whom to discuss these things. Ours isn't a series of tables crowded with guys standing shoulder to shoulder fondling the firearms. In fact we set up a walk in whenever we can so they can get out of traffic into a more calm place. I think that makes the biggest difference of any. We aren't gun experts - and we don't pretend to be. We just listen, reflect and offer our opinions from what we do know and those with whom we've spoken before. I'd bet we're responsible for several sales a day at a good show just because we help people calm down and focus.
I'd suggest that a good gun show would be one at which gun vendors considered this and incorporate some of these points into their business model. There are some vendors we know from the shows who are good at these things and from conversations I know they always do well.
JMO
Scenario #1: Couple will come up to us - we'll start talking about the various concealment methods that we offer. She'll make a comment about her gun being too big...to be honest for anything other than open carry. Then it comes out that he "bought her" the gun that he wanted...I have to believe for himself. She's used it and can control it but there's really no way for her to carry or use it as a CW. He'll start talking about "stopping power" - I'll make a comment about it not being able to stop anything if she can't carry it. She'll say something like "See - I told you" and off we go. The alternate to this is an honest "I bought her a gun but she doesn't like it" which is like saying I bought her a purse. You don't buy a woman a purse. It's a big decision - they marry their purses - you just stand by and offer an opinion if asked.
Gun shopping isn't exactly the same but she has to like the fit and feel before anything else will happen.Usually this comes to a good conclusion. Sometimes he scowls at me and drags her away.
Scenario #2: Not much different than #1 but the person who told her she needs a big gun was the CCW class instructor.
Scenario #3: She doesn't yet own a gun - hasn't taken a class but she wants to. The first thing we do is point her to Kathy Jackson's book - The Cornered Cat - and strongly recommend it as the only thing she needs to buy at the gun show that day. Some do - some don't - but we always point them to her website in any event.
She'll talk about trying friends guns and not feeling like she can control them or that she couldn't work the slide and so forth. So we'll talk a bit about different models and techniques and revolvers. They are just so happy to have somebody who isn't talking to them like a child that they spend a lot of time with us. Hopefully we're building a future sale
Scenario #4 is "We came here to buy her a gun" They talk to us about what we like and know and who at the show we recommend. We are careful to advise finding a way to actually try the guns that they like to be sure they really are the right bowl of porridge. The NRA Women on Target program is great for this.
The summary of this is - people, especially women, need somebody neutral with whom to discuss these things. Ours isn't a series of tables crowded with guys standing shoulder to shoulder fondling the firearms. In fact we set up a walk in whenever we can so they can get out of traffic into a more calm place. I think that makes the biggest difference of any. We aren't gun experts - and we don't pretend to be. We just listen, reflect and offer our opinions from what we do know and those with whom we've spoken before. I'd bet we're responsible for several sales a day at a good show just because we help people calm down and focus.
I'd suggest that a good gun show would be one at which gun vendors considered this and incorporate some of these points into their business model. There are some vendors we know from the shows who are good at these things and from conversations I know they always do well.
JMO
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Evan Thomas
Inactive
Lew, I'd say you're the one who should be getting a free table.
If everyone had this attitude, the world would be a better place... and gun shows would, too.
If everyone had this attitude, the world would be a better place... and gun shows would, too.
LewSchiller
New member
From your lips to the ears of the folks who put on the big Denver show. Not about a free table - happy to pay - just to get a spot in the show at all!
Ignition Override
New member
BornToLooze: Poisonous snakes INside a gun show.
What a strange, revolting idea. The promoters must have though that the variety of guns and beef jerky wasn't enough to attract people.
The Health Department should have been notified (recorded on a weekend).
What a strange, revolting idea. The promoters must have though that the variety of guns and beef jerky wasn't enough to attract people.
The Health Department should have been notified (recorded on a weekend).
I can't figure out how to get quote tags so...
"He stands there with a puzzled look on his face, then ask me if 2 3/4 is shorter then 3 inch."
He missed the first question on the quiz, triple admission for him.
=====
"Blaming a buyer for not knowing how to recognize a refinish on a firearm is not what I would consider a good approach to retail sales....the dealer should be the one with the knowledge to access condition of a firearm. I have never seen a dealer point out the refinish on a firearm they were selling much as a used car salesman does not point out any flaws in their vehicles."
I trade mostly in vintage 1911 firearms to upgrade my own collection more than anything else and it's kind of a small circle of collectors. Trying to pass off a refinished piece as original will get you a reputation you really don't want even if it's to someone not in the collector circle. I'll always point out any issues with finish, parts, etc to anyone looking to buy/trade from me. I'll agree retail dealers don't necessarily do that.
The people I'm talking about are the ones with little knowledge but access to the internet auction sites. They look for the highest auction price they can find for something similar to what they have. They get indignant when I tell them their piece is worth maybe around $6-700 as a shooter. "I saw one just like it on GB, etc and it was four times that much!!!"
I tell them, "I don't know which pistol you saw but likely it had all original finish and parts. Your's has been polished, reblued, has some after market small parts and target sights added. I'm giving you the price I expect you could get here from someone else before you leave the show. I'm not interested in buying your pistol but thanks for bringing it by."
=====
I'll relay one recent experience. Someone brought by a WWI era 1911, a fairly rare example. In short I told them:
$5000+ if it had been 95% or better condition
$3000 in this condition if it had all original parts but this one has many replaced parts (commercial and WWII)
$1500, maybe, if you can find someone needing this slide/frame bad enough
$800, maybe, as is before you leave the show
Thanks for bringing it by but I'm going to have to pass.
Later I heard they walked it all around the show asking $3000.
I just hope they didn't mention my name when asked where they got that number.
"He stands there with a puzzled look on his face, then ask me if 2 3/4 is shorter then 3 inch."
He missed the first question on the quiz, triple admission for him.
=====
"Blaming a buyer for not knowing how to recognize a refinish on a firearm is not what I would consider a good approach to retail sales....the dealer should be the one with the knowledge to access condition of a firearm. I have never seen a dealer point out the refinish on a firearm they were selling much as a used car salesman does not point out any flaws in their vehicles."
I trade mostly in vintage 1911 firearms to upgrade my own collection more than anything else and it's kind of a small circle of collectors. Trying to pass off a refinished piece as original will get you a reputation you really don't want even if it's to someone not in the collector circle. I'll always point out any issues with finish, parts, etc to anyone looking to buy/trade from me. I'll agree retail dealers don't necessarily do that.
The people I'm talking about are the ones with little knowledge but access to the internet auction sites. They look for the highest auction price they can find for something similar to what they have. They get indignant when I tell them their piece is worth maybe around $6-700 as a shooter. "I saw one just like it on GB, etc and it was four times that much!!!"
I tell them, "I don't know which pistol you saw but likely it had all original finish and parts. Your's has been polished, reblued, has some after market small parts and target sights added. I'm giving you the price I expect you could get here from someone else before you leave the show. I'm not interested in buying your pistol but thanks for bringing it by."
=====
I'll relay one recent experience. Someone brought by a WWI era 1911, a fairly rare example. In short I told them:
$5000+ if it had been 95% or better condition
$3000 in this condition if it had all original parts but this one has many replaced parts (commercial and WWII)
$1500, maybe, if you can find someone needing this slide/frame bad enough
$800, maybe, as is before you leave the show
Thanks for bringing it by but I'm going to have to pass.
Later I heard they walked it all around the show asking $3000.
I just hope they didn't mention my name when asked where they got that number.LewSchiller
New member
Let me ask...do people come to you at a show who are interested in becoming a collector? People who'd like to learn more and participate? If so, is there a group? How do you respond to that?
As for the folks in your example, as they say..."a little knowledge is a dangerous thing". Much the same as any collectors market in which there are pieces that bring a high price and others that look identical to a novice but which don't bring the price for various reasons. People who inherit Aunt Jane's 4 door want to believe it's worth as much as the big block convertible.
Sounds like you do the right thing. Help them understand why theirs is worth what it is. If they thought they had a real high dollar item - probably inherited - they have to go through the 5 stages of grief just like any other significant loss...real or perceived.
As for the folks in your example, as they say..."a little knowledge is a dangerous thing"
. Much the same as any collectors market in which there are pieces that bring a high price and others that look identical to a novice but which don't bring the price for various reasons. People who inherit Aunt Jane's 4 door want to believe it's worth as much as the big block convertible.Sounds like you do the right thing. Help them understand why theirs is worth what it is. If they thought they had a real high dollar item - probably inherited - they have to go through the 5 stages of grief just like any other significant loss...real or perceived.
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Beagle45ACP
New member
1) Say goodbye to the tables full of vendors with "Authentic WWII Relics" (read: Chinese-made, neo-Nazi garbage)
2) Dress code - I'm not expecting suits and ties, but seriously, I don't wanna see your ass hanging out
2) Dress code - I'm not expecting suits and ties, but seriously, I don't wanna see your ass hanging out
I do meet many people at gshows wanting vintage 1911 pistols, maybe not a large collection but something "like Dad/Grandpa carried in the war."
I tell them the best way to educate themselves is research with good books and give them a couple websites to study. Also to find trustworthy local collectors and study some of their collection to see what original finish/parts look like.
Don't get in a hurry. Jumping on the first pistol you find for sale may be a very expensive lesson if you don't know what you're looking at.
I tell them the best way to educate themselves is research with good books and give them a couple websites to study. Also to find trustworthy local collectors and study some of their collection to see what original finish/parts look like.
Don't get in a hurry. Jumping on the first pistol you find for sale may be a very expensive lesson if you don't know what you're looking at.
Sometimes in the confusion of the crowds at a show, communication can be difficult and processiing info through some of our old pea brains in a hurry can be a problem. I recently went to a show and carried along a pistol that I really wanted to get rid of. I wanted to trade it, but couldn't find what I was looking for and when dealers kept asking me what I would take for it I finally relented and told them $300.00. After I told one dealer that, he asked for a minute to look it up in his book, after which he told me the best he could do would be $350.00. I told him that would be fine and he counted out the money. He put it on his table for $450, so I guess we both walked away happy anyway.