What Where to buy HD Load

G

Gary H

New member
Enjoyed Dave's tutorial on HD practice.

So, what are you using for your HD load? I've been using Federal's low recoil 00 buck, but willing to change to another load in order to reduce cost and increase practice time.

Given the need to put in the time and materials for practice, where do you buy your supplies/ammunition? How do you keep your costs down?
 
I use my old duty load, Winchester 9 pellet 00 for HD, behind a couple of #6 high brass field loads.Premise,while practically any load hits as a solid mass at typical HD ranges, if the scenario is still going after a shot or two, I may have to take out someone hiding behind the fridge, or the kidproof furniture.

A note, more important than pellet size is reliability. Some ammo,even the best stuff, is not 100% reliable feed and fire in some shotguns. This is why you hear me rant about using your duty HD load for at least part of your training. Generic field loads are great on price,great for most training, but the serious stuff has to be checked out periodically.

One thing you can/should do, is to use the ammo IN the shotgun as range ammo each time. This rotates the ammo,and lets you know about duration and reliability.

As for practice costs, one can reload, buy one's ammo at super special prices post season,or use the Govt's ammo. Done all three...
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gary H:
Enjoyed Dave's tutorial on HD practice.

So, what are you using for your HD load? I've been using Federal's low recoil 00 buck, but willing to change to another load in order to reduce cost and increase practice time.

Given the need to put in the time and materials for practice, where do you buy your supplies/ammunition? How do you keep your costs down?[/quote]

I use the low recoil "Personal Defense" ammo from federal. It uses #2 birdshot. I can't handle buckshot loads and I feel this load is much better than any handgun round.
 
As much as I like Federal's H132 Tactical buckshot loads, of late I have been training with Estate Cartridge Co.'s "SWAT" reduced recoil buckshot load. It performs and patterns well, but is considerably cheaper than the Federal loads.
 
Estate Cartridge Co. OO ('8 Ball') and #4 buckshot is available from The Sportsman's Guide. They have a website (don't have trhe address) that youm can order from.
In regard to the Federal OO Tactical buckshot, how much do you pay for a 5 round box or a pack of 50? Last time I had bought some, it was around $31.00 with shipping for a pack of 50 rounds from a place called DKT.
 
Everything from trap loads to full power federal premium slugs.. that's what's NEAT about shotguns is you can shoot all kinds of ammunition. I usually get my clay busting stuff at walmart, or at super-k. Occasionally a sale will come up at Sportsman's Guide , etc. butyou pay heavily for shipping.

Funny story.. Dad was buying Federal Buckshot loads at Walmart after the LA Riots scare.. the sales clerk noted "we sure have sold a LOT of that stuff, what do people use it for.. to which Dad replied, "badguys" and walked off with his purchase. Left the kid looking stunned. (this is Colorado.. nobody hunts deer here with a shotgun)

Rather than shoot that "reduced recoil" stuff.. or "tactical teds overpriced miracle ammo" I say shoot a LOT of clays/skeet/ trap and learn to use the shotgun.. train up to heavier loads. Even a 3 inch magnum 1 ounce slug doesn't really kick when you are looking at a deer or shooting in competition. #4 Buckshot is probably the best comprimise in lethality/spread/and penetration at 50 feet or less, but its often hard to find #4 buckshot (not the same as a #4 goose load). Even a good "duck and pheasant" #6 will work. The real trick is finding a range that will let you shoot "full power" or magnum loads.

Practice makes perfect.. ask Dave he's the Man. ;)

Dr.Rob
 
Thanks, Dr Rob. Flattery will get you anything(G)...

Re reduced loads, if you need them, use them,but...

Full power loads will be more effective, with exceptions. As you said, one that's practiced well with the barnburner loads will do better,all things being equal.

A shotgun weighing X amount with a load producing X amount of whump will recoil a given amount. How WE fire it and how the stock fits are the variables. And learning to shoot even heavy kickers will give more effectiveness than all the custom smithing, addons and mods.

Led,the 3 inch Mag slug is a perversion of the more is better principle. Lightfield, who have done probably as much research as the rest of the industry combined on slugs doesn't sell a 3 inch. And, there's no deer in North America that can tell if he's been shot with a 3" Testosterone Special or a dinky lil' 2 3/4" load.

If the folks buying all those 3 inch slugs spent more time at the range learning to shoot and more time in the woods honing their hunting skills, they'd be better off.
 
I go to gun shows and pick up ammo. Using Federal Tactical Load 00 Buck, Side Saddle holding two #4s, two #00, and two Federal tactical rifle slug (2 3/4"1oz Hydra Shok HP). Is that too extreme or just prepared?
 
Buckshot goes through sheetrock walls and studs. Hope no one using it for HD lives in an apartment complex. Definitely agree on 3" slugs. I've never been able to wring any accuracy out of them, so I've always stuck to 2 3/4" Brenneke and Activs.
 
I don't know about using birdshot or some of the lighter buckshot loads for home defense. It sounds good, having a load that won't penetrate sheetrock walls, but I can penetrate sheetrock with my fist. What happens if the invader is hiding behind furniture shooting at you. Or what if he is a big fat guy wearing a very heavy leather jacket?

I think I will stick to 00 and work on shot placement. Your kids aren't going to be any safer if the bad guy kills you.

By the way, has anyone seen any statistics about errant buckshot wounding family or neighboors. It seems to me that most of the innocent parties that are getting shot are being shot by gang bangers who close their eyes and spray a whole neighborhood with bullets.
 
For the record, I use 3 inch maximum slugs asa back up rifle for elk and bear.. I'd NEVER recommend them for HD.. I was just making the point that if you practice.. even that heavy load will purr like a kitten.. well ok like a 300 pound kitten on crack.. but really when your adrenaline is up you won't feel much of the recoil.

Dave is still the man.. tac lights and wonderbullets and sidesaddles and bayonet mounts don't add up to practice.

*virtual tip of the hat to Dave*

Dr.Rob
 
I still don't understand the need for slugs in HD. Have you read of situations where buckshot was inadequate? Take my house for example. In the house we are at buckshot distance. I can't imagine a battle scene where someone is out on the street shooting at me, but should that be the case, my Carbon 15 is a better weapon. Inside of the house, when are you loading the slug? Is Mr. BG behind the refrigerator, or your wood desk and will a slug do the job?
 
I agree with Gary H. on not using slugs as a primary HD round. However, that said, it wouldn't hurt to carry a few in a butt cuff or side saddle just in case.

Why limit yourself. You don't have to use slugs, but, if someone is hiding behind a thick door and you have a clean shot, it might make sense.
 
Slugs for home defense? The point of slugs is to extend your range when you really wish you had a rifle, rather than a shotgun. As long as none of the rooms in your house are longer than 20 yards, I can't see the point of slugs for home defense.

Regarding penetration, you'd have to have some mighty tough doors to need slugs over 00 buck.

As for 3" magnums, I have a box of 5 Breneke 3" slugs at home. I was low on slugs in deer season, needed some more, and that's all they had. If there's anyone here in MA who wants them, there all yours. No way I'm firing them.

Jared
 
Thanks guys....

Slugs have little advantage in AS scenarios, if any. I keep a couple around because I learned long ago to always have a Plan B.
 
I keep five rounds of #2 buck in my 20 gauge followe dby two slugs. However, I seriously wonder why anyone would pick up a shotgun when a perfectly good Mak90/Garand/AR15 is right next to it. The only reason I can think of is the speed of pointing over more deliberate aiming (matter of different training more than the guns themselves) and to reduce over-penetration. Where the excess punch isn't an issue, why bother with less effective round (I would expect a 30-06 soft point to do at least as well as buckshot or am I dreaming?)
 
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