What do you carry for self defense when you are not able to carry your pistol? I won't be 21 for another 13 months, so I am somewhat limited in what I can have on my person while not in my home. I always carry my SOG Pentagon Elite 4" folder clipped to my right front pocket, and occasionally I keep a 26" Asp in my back pocket or in a shouler rig under my jacket.
What to carry when you can't Carry?
- Thread starter mgdavis
- Start date
GrandmasterB
New member
Fox OC pepper spray: http://www.foxlabs.com/FoxLabs.html
MG, Be carefull, as young as you are, about carrying anything that is a weapon. I say this because if you get in a scrape, as young people can tend to do sometimes, the police will look dimly on a 19yr. old carrying any weapon & if you get a weapons charge it could make it real hard to get a carry permit when you become an adult. Stay away from trouble and if it comes at you run the other way or learn Karate. 
jehu has a great point. You sure don't need 4 pocket knives, 2 cans of spray, and a tire iron.
But no matter what age you are (over 18 of course) it's not a bad idea to have at least something on your person.
Keep it in moderation because as jehu says you do not want to jeopardize your right to carry if your state allows.
But no matter what age you are (over 18 of course) it's not a bad idea to have at least something on your person.
Keep it in moderation because as jehu says you do not want to jeopardize your right to carry if your state allows.
FallenPhoenix
New member
I'd get pepper spray and stick to that. I would never consider using a knife for self defense if there is any other option.
I double-checked with the RCW's, and I think I'm pretty safe in carrying my Asp. The only aplicable part I could find was Title 9, Section 41. It says that as long as I don't brandish it at random people on the street I should be ok 
. RCW 9.41.270
I am also smart enough not to go looking for trouble. I generally only carry the Asp if I know I'm going to be out late in Seattle or something similar.
. RCW 9.41.270 I am also smart enough not to go looking for trouble. I generally only carry the Asp if I know I'm going to be out late in Seattle or something similar.
Mr. Davis, I am familiar with the RCW's, and FYI, just about any LE agency I am aware of up here considers the ASP or other collapsible batons to be a deadly weapon. Using it will get you a second or third degree assault charge. If you are caught carrying it, expect to be charged with a gross misdemeanor and the baton confiscated.
Of course, if you are merely carrying it concealed and would only use it in response to a deadly force attack on yourself or a companion, you should not run into trouble. If you carry it into a courthouse or Federal building, expect lots of attention from the security people as they hold you pending the arrival of the police.
Of course, if you are merely carrying it concealed and would only use it in response to a deadly force attack on yourself or a companion, you should not run into trouble. If you carry it into a courthouse or Federal building, expect lots of attention from the security people as they hold you pending the arrival of the police.
MillCreek, I may have misunderstood the RCW in question (9.41.270). If so, I would appreciate your pointing out the specific points. The way I read it, it said that it was unlawful to carry a club in a situation that would cause another individual to feel threatened, and of course carrying it in places such as court houses, bars, etc.
The way I understood it, it is legal to carry when the intent is self defence.
The first thing that you should carry is the Vote. The second thing that you should carry is the Voice to get out the Vote, and the third thing that you should carry is the Thought of Why, you can't carry a Gun (or any other weapon).
As in, you should get with people your age, 18 to 20, to demand that they have the same Rights as everyone else. Why is it that when you turn 21 you become more responsible? Nothing, it's just a line drawn in the sand to make you do as others say. You can join the Military at 18, shoot, train on, and have fun with fully auto's, M9's, and even M-60's, tanks, etc.. but when you're not on duty, you can't own nothing without permission. Really should make one think huh... you can have a job with the most powerful weapons on the face of the planet but you can't own a simple handgun or carry for protection.
Honestly, at your point in time, I cannot really say what you should carry or what you should do for your own protection. In the eyes of society you can have a job that can be very dangerous and have the weapons to protect yourself but when you're off duty, you're a kid. This is something that your generation has to fight for, and for your generation to teach to those coming up behind you. We've tried, it seems that your generation doesn't want to actually vote and make your voices heard and then most ask what they can do until (they reach 21).
Good luck on your endeaver. I, for one, wouldn't trust a stick of wood, a seasoning, or some sort of "alternate" fighting tool for my protection. And just because I'm "allowed" to be able to buy and own the best tools for protection isn't a factor, because you should be able to do the same. But, you've allowed yourself to be disarmed because "daddy government" told you so.
Again, good luck.
Wayne
*sorry for the rant, but if 18 to 20 year olds keep on asking what they should do, yet do nothing to get "adult" Rights, then I really can't help them out.
As in, you should get with people your age, 18 to 20, to demand that they have the same Rights as everyone else. Why is it that when you turn 21 you become more responsible? Nothing, it's just a line drawn in the sand to make you do as others say. You can join the Military at 18, shoot, train on, and have fun with fully auto's, M9's, and even M-60's, tanks, etc.. but when you're not on duty, you can't own nothing without permission. Really should make one think huh... you can have a job with the most powerful weapons on the face of the planet but you can't own a simple handgun or carry for protection.
Honestly, at your point in time, I cannot really say what you should carry or what you should do for your own protection. In the eyes of society you can have a job that can be very dangerous and have the weapons to protect yourself but when you're off duty, you're a kid. This is something that your generation has to fight for, and for your generation to teach to those coming up behind you. We've tried, it seems that your generation doesn't want to actually vote and make your voices heard and then most ask what they can do until (they reach 21).
Good luck on your endeaver. I, for one, wouldn't trust a stick of wood, a seasoning, or some sort of "alternate" fighting tool for my protection. And just because I'm "allowed" to be able to buy and own the best tools for protection isn't a factor, because you should be able to do the same. But, you've allowed yourself to be disarmed because "daddy government" told you so.
Again, good luck.
Wayne
*sorry for the rant, but if 18 to 20 year olds keep on asking what they should do, yet do nothing to get "adult" Rights, then I really can't help them out.
Mr. Davis, looking at RCW 9A.036.021 and .031 may prove instructive. These statutes are from the criminal code and show the elements of second and third degree assault.
The problem with relying upon RCW 9.41.270 is that enforcement is discretionary. All you need is any person to say that you were menacing, threatening or intimidating, and they thought they saw a lead pipe on your belt or a suspicious bulge in your pocket. A quick pat down, discovery of the collapsible baton and voila! A quick arrest. This is the same law that is used to charge people if they shake a tire iron at someone else during a road rage incident or the like. Back when I did an internship with the prosecuting attorney's office, this was an easy catch-all charge.
It is often also used by law enforcement as an 'attitude' charge. If you have a poor attitude during your interaction with law enforcement, and they find a baton or the like, well, this is another charge they can hang on you.
I am neither recommending for or against carrying an ASP baton. I note parenthetically that I have several ASP batons stemming from my law enforcement days. You might find it interesting to contact your local police/sheriff agency or your county prosecutor and ask them what they think about a private citizen carrying a collapsible baton, and if they think that RCW 9.41.270 makes it legal to so carry. They will probably point you to the numerous case law decisions over the years (you can search them out on the state court website) which suggest that it does not, based on the number of people who have been prosecuted.
Confusion over this very issue is the major reason why several years ago, Washington state changed the 'CCW' or carry concealed weapons permit to the 'CPL' or concealed pistol license. They wanted to make it crystal clear that a carry permit pertains only to handguns and not other weapons, such as batons, balisong knives and the like.
All of this is perhaps a moot point if no one ever knows you are carrying an ASP baton or you never have to use it. I myself would plan on arguing that the application of a collapsible baton with strikes to the joints was part of a graduated continuum of force to contain the situation short of being compelled to use deadly force to safeguard myself or others.
The problem with relying upon RCW 9.41.270 is that enforcement is discretionary. All you need is any person to say that you were menacing, threatening or intimidating, and they thought they saw a lead pipe on your belt or a suspicious bulge in your pocket. A quick pat down, discovery of the collapsible baton and voila! A quick arrest. This is the same law that is used to charge people if they shake a tire iron at someone else during a road rage incident or the like. Back when I did an internship with the prosecuting attorney's office, this was an easy catch-all charge.
It is often also used by law enforcement as an 'attitude' charge. If you have a poor attitude during your interaction with law enforcement, and they find a baton or the like, well, this is another charge they can hang on you.
I am neither recommending for or against carrying an ASP baton. I note parenthetically that I have several ASP batons stemming from my law enforcement days. You might find it interesting to contact your local police/sheriff agency or your county prosecutor and ask them what they think about a private citizen carrying a collapsible baton, and if they think that RCW 9.41.270 makes it legal to so carry. They will probably point you to the numerous case law decisions over the years (you can search them out on the state court website) which suggest that it does not, based on the number of people who have been prosecuted.
Confusion over this very issue is the major reason why several years ago, Washington state changed the 'CCW' or carry concealed weapons permit to the 'CPL' or concealed pistol license. They wanted to make it crystal clear that a carry permit pertains only to handguns and not other weapons, such as batons, balisong knives and the like.
All of this is perhaps a moot point if no one ever knows you are carrying an ASP baton or you never have to use it. I myself would plan on arguing that the application of a collapsible baton with strikes to the joints was part of a graduated continuum of force to contain the situation short of being compelled to use deadly force to safeguard myself or others.
jonathon,
No, you have to be 21 http://www.packing.org/state/index.jsp/oregon .
For all those under 21, you folks really need to rally and get the age brought down to at least 18. You notice that the pols want your votes but treat you like children (as does the brandy bunch, vpc, etc..).
Wayne
No, you have to be 21 http://www.packing.org/state/index.jsp/oregon .
For all those under 21, you folks really need to rally and get the age brought down to at least 18. You notice that the pols want your votes but treat you like children (as does the brandy bunch, vpc, etc..).
Wayne
S.E.R.T.SGT
New member
Just a thought...ASP also makes a small OC spray that can fit on your key chain, but also looks like a small "kubaton". This is good for things like joint manipulation, pressure points, etc. (Only if you have training in this.), but can also be used for the obvious: Pepper Spray. I live in a completely different state, so I have no idea what your specific laws are in regards to this. However, I think in most states pepper spray is legal for things like protection against dogs, while walking, etc.etc. The best advice I can give however, whatever you decide to do, is obviously check the laws in your state, for confirmation. Good advice in this post.