revolverrandy
New member
back in the day when police officers carried revolvers as their service weapon,what brand/model and caliber did most carry?
what revolver did police use to carry?
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tschmittel
New member
I think S&W model 10 or M&P, or Colt police positves were pretty popular.
Real Cops Carry Revolvers.
I was a cop in the Revolver days, The day I hired on I was given a wore out Model 15 Smith, which I promply truned in for the New Model 28s the dept got.
We were orginaly issued 158 GR RN Lead cast and loaded by trustees. Needless to say I carried my own Reloads, Cast 150 Grn SWCs (I still use that same mold today). Then they told us we couldnt carry reloads so I bought Winchester 158 Grn SWC, 357s.
I still have my Model 28, I was allowed to keep it when I retired. If I was to go back into police work today, my Model 28 would be my choice of carry.
I was a cop in the Revolver days, The day I hired on I was given a wore out Model 15 Smith, which I promply truned in for the New Model 28s the dept got.
We were orginaly issued 158 GR RN Lead cast and loaded by trustees. Needless to say I carried my own Reloads, Cast 150 Grn SWCs (I still use that same mold today). Then they told us we couldnt carry reloads so I bought Winchester 158 Grn SWC, 357s.
I still have my Model 28, I was allowed to keep it when I retired. If I was to go back into police work today, my Model 28 would be my choice of carry.
Cheapshooter
New member
S&W and Colts in 38 Spcl. I think the most popular was the S&W Mod 10 4" Heavy Barrel model. I believe in my state the Highway Patrol in the 60's were ahead of their times with S&W Model 39 9mm Semi-Autos.
Mike Irwin
Staff
Up through World War II it was pretty evenly distributed between Colt and Smith & Wesson.
After World War II, Colt essentially surrendered the much of its civilian market sales to Smith & Wesson to concentrate more and more on military.
From the 1950s onward Smith & Wesson ruled the roost.
After World War II, Colt essentially surrendered the much of its civilian market sales to Smith & Wesson to concentrate more and more on military.
From the 1950s onward Smith & Wesson ruled the roost.
revolvers for street duty
My med-large city department did not allow .357's because of the penetration factor so from the 60's to the late 70's it was S&W model 10's and 64's for street duty and model 36 Chiefs for plain clothes and off duty. In the late 70's, 9mm semi-autos were allowed for detectives and off duty but model 10's and 64's only for the street.
County deputy sheriffs and highway patrol carried .357's
Now city cops carry Sig .40's.
My med-large city department did not allow .357's because of the penetration factor so from the 60's to the late 70's it was S&W model 10's and 64's for street duty and model 36 Chiefs for plain clothes and off duty. In the late 70's, 9mm semi-autos were allowed for detectives and off duty but model 10's and 64's only for the street.
County deputy sheriffs and highway patrol carried .357's
Now city cops carry Sig .40's.
Mike Irwin is pretty much correct.
Prior to WW-II, Colt and S&W were slugging it out trying to sell guns to police departments nationwide. Colt was the public's favorite but S&W was catching up, especially when people saw policemen wearing them. During the depression few agencies were buying very many guns. In smaller towns during the depression it was a job pre-requisite to own your own revolver. Colt's Official Police and S&W's M&P revolver were typical police sidearms.
In the post WW-II era, Colt focused more on Military production and sales to police departments kept shrinking. Some of those agencies had "old timers" (Chiefs or administrators) who liked dealing with Colt and who continued buying Colts as a "better" police revolver. In the late 50's though, S&W really took over most city police bids.
By the 1970's, this is the landscape I saw...
After 1970, when stainless K-frames started being produced, coastal and southern states started buying them in droves to reduce the corrosion from humidity and salt air. It would be almost 5 years before you could walk into a shop and buy a Model 66 4-inch .357 without paying a huge mark-up.
Sadly, the Colt Police Positive Specials were slowly phased out of most police services by the middle 60's. So too were the S&W Model 30 and 31 .32 Longs with which some agencies armed their "matrons" who served mostly in auxillary roles.
You can find exceptions to the rule too. Smaller towns with only a few officers might have a mix of revolvers, based on what each man personally owned. Some town might own only 3 revolvers in various conditions as issue guns. One of the small towns in California's Sierra "Gold Country" issued their six officers S&W revolvers in .44 Special until 1980.
The oddest one I saw was a "town constable" in a NW Arizona town about 1979. He was carrying a S&W .32-20 M&P revolver! Not much crime there, so no need for much gun.
Prior to WW-II, Colt and S&W were slugging it out trying to sell guns to police departments nationwide. Colt was the public's favorite but S&W was catching up, especially when people saw policemen wearing them. During the depression few agencies were buying very many guns. In smaller towns during the depression it was a job pre-requisite to own your own revolver. Colt's Official Police and S&W's M&P revolver were typical police sidearms.
In the post WW-II era, Colt focused more on Military production and sales to police departments kept shrinking. Some of those agencies had "old timers" (Chiefs or administrators) who liked dealing with Colt and who continued buying Colts as a "better" police revolver. In the late 50's though, S&W really took over most city police bids.
By the 1970's, this is the landscape I saw...
- S&W Model 10 - by far and away, the most prevelant revolver, especially for most larger metro PD's. And it was also popular for smaller departments with limited budgets.
- S&W Model 19 .357 - in agencies where the .357 Magnum was allowed, it was typically the much more popular choice than it's second-place favorite...
- The Colt Python .357 - had the edge in panache, status and legendary accuracy. But for a $400 price tag in 1974, it was like buying a Ferarri.
- S&W Model 14 or 15 - With adjustable sights, the K-38 was issued in a fair number of departments. Some agencies reserved them for more senior officers until the older M10's were replaced. LAPD started issuing the Model 14 or 15 in the mid-60's, IIRC. The 6" M14 was favored by motor units and the traffic division, airport & harbor police. The 4" M15 was more common for patrol officers.
- S&W Model 28 .357 - Many rural deputies and highway patrol agencies favored the heavy Model 28 for its ruggedness and because it could absorb lots of .357 recoil. And in a roadside fight it made a formidible sap too.
- Colt Lawman .357 - These were still seen being carried by several local LEO's until semiautos came in. Sturdy, well balanced and heavy enough to shoot the .357 well.
- Colt Trooper / Trooper Mk III - The first wheelgun I carried was a Trooper Mk III because two others carried them. This was when you could still buy your own from an approved list and carry it. The Trooper was (basically) an adjustable sighted Lawman and the Mk III was second only to the Python in .357 accuracy.
After 1970, when stainless K-frames started being produced, coastal and southern states started buying them in droves to reduce the corrosion from humidity and salt air. It would be almost 5 years before you could walk into a shop and buy a Model 66 4-inch .357 without paying a huge mark-up.
Sadly, the Colt Police Positive Specials were slowly phased out of most police services by the middle 60's. So too were the S&W Model 30 and 31 .32 Longs with which some agencies armed their "matrons" who served mostly in auxillary roles.
You can find exceptions to the rule too. Smaller towns with only a few officers might have a mix of revolvers, based on what each man personally owned. Some town might own only 3 revolvers in various conditions as issue guns. One of the small towns in California's Sierra "Gold Country" issued their six officers S&W revolvers in .44 Special until 1980.
The oddest one I saw was a "town constable" in a NW Arizona town about 1979. He was carrying a S&W .32-20 M&P revolver! Not much crime there, so no need for much gun.
I began my career as a Police Officer in 1973 Back in the day when cops carried revolvers.
At that time my department authorized several revolvers.
1) S&W model 10 (heavy or pencil barrel)
2) Colt Official police
3) Colt metropolitan MkIII (.38)
Originally police women werent assigned to patrol duties. They mostly worked in the women bureau, and were assigned to various juvinile enfocement jobs, and in the detective bureau. At that time "POLICE WOMEN" wore a uniform consisting of a tunic, and a skirt. They carried their revolvers in a purse with a built in holster. I believe they carried S&W terriers in .32 cal. At some point (before my time) the POLICE WOMANS bureau was intergrated into the patrol bureau and the detective bureau. Women were put out on patrol along with men. These women were authorizd a "female officers revolver" This was a S&W J frame model 36. 5 shot blue steel revolver. It had a squair butt (handle), and a 3" heavy barrel. In appearance it looked like a small model 10 heavy barrel. Many women opted for a regulation service revolver, and the Female officers revolver was discontinued as a service revolver, and women carried the same revolvers as the men.
Any revolver could be submited for individual appoval. It had so meet specs. Be a Blue steel,6 shot revolver,of a medium frame, with fixed combat sights, and a 4" barrel. It also had to properly fit into a regulation holster.
Off duty weapons also had to be approved. We were allowed any blued revolver, with fixed sights.
When the department went from standard velocity ammo (158 gr SWC lead) to +p ammo (158gr SWC lead +p, then 158gr SWC lead nyclad +p) The aluminum frame off duty revolvers were condemed for police work. (Many assignments allowed an officer to carry his/her off duty gun instead of his service revolver)
Although the department transitioned to the semi-auto pistols in the early
90's... Any officer who carried a revolver is still able to qualify with that revolver, and carry it on patrol. In fact some guys are qualified, and authorized for both Auto, and Revolver. Off duty revolvers are still popular.
At that time my department authorized several revolvers.
1) S&W model 10 (heavy or pencil barrel)
2) Colt Official police
3) Colt metropolitan MkIII (.38)
Originally police women werent assigned to patrol duties. They mostly worked in the women bureau, and were assigned to various juvinile enfocement jobs, and in the detective bureau. At that time "POLICE WOMEN" wore a uniform consisting of a tunic, and a skirt. They carried their revolvers in a purse with a built in holster. I believe they carried S&W terriers in .32 cal. At some point (before my time) the POLICE WOMANS bureau was intergrated into the patrol bureau and the detective bureau. Women were put out on patrol along with men. These women were authorizd a "female officers revolver" This was a S&W J frame model 36. 5 shot blue steel revolver. It had a squair butt (handle), and a 3" heavy barrel. In appearance it looked like a small model 10 heavy barrel. Many women opted for a regulation service revolver, and the Female officers revolver was discontinued as a service revolver, and women carried the same revolvers as the men.
Any revolver could be submited for individual appoval. It had so meet specs. Be a Blue steel,6 shot revolver,of a medium frame, with fixed combat sights, and a 4" barrel. It also had to properly fit into a regulation holster.
Off duty weapons also had to be approved. We were allowed any blued revolver, with fixed sights.
When the department went from standard velocity ammo (158 gr SWC lead) to +p ammo (158gr SWC lead +p, then 158gr SWC lead nyclad +p) The aluminum frame off duty revolvers were condemed for police work. (Many assignments allowed an officer to carry his/her off duty gun instead of his service revolver)
Although the department transitioned to the semi-auto pistols in the early
90's... Any officer who carried a revolver is still able to qualify with that revolver, and carry it on patrol. In fact some guys are qualified, and authorized for both Auto, and Revolver. Off duty revolvers are still popular.
I have my Grandfather's S&W .38-44 Target Model that he carried for the Borger, Tx PD in the 50's and 60's. My Mom used that weapon in her academy in '75 or '76. I'm kinda irked they won't let me carry it here where I put in my time. Talk about a piece of art! It doesn't look like much by today's standards and it's had a less than cushy life- but I'd trust it 100%.
Once I met a Border Patrol officer (in missouri?) in uniform and carrying. he was carrying a smith (dnk model) .357 magnum and a belt full of speed loaders, he was using what appeared to be remington 158 grain JHP.
My father in law told me years ago that our PD carried smiths. he bought a k38 so that he could enter service revolver matches with them. I own that pistol now.
My father in law told me years ago that our PD carried smiths. he bought a k38 so that he could enter service revolver matches with them. I own that pistol now.
Mike Irwin
Staff
Before they went to semi-autos, the US Park Police carried S&W Model 10s loaded with 158-gr. +P+.
Washington, DC, Metro and the Virginia State Police were also armed with Model 10s for many years.
I don't know what the Metro police carried in their guns, but the VSP were, for the last few years, issuing Winchester 158-gr. LSWCHP +Ps, which had a VERY good reputation as a fight stopper. The FBI also issued the same load for many years.
FBI Agent Mirelles ended the Miami Shootout in 1986 by killing Platt and Mattix with those rounds fired from a Smith & Wesson Model 19.
Washington, DC, Metro and the Virginia State Police were also armed with Model 10s for many years.
I don't know what the Metro police carried in their guns, but the VSP were, for the last few years, issuing Winchester 158-gr. LSWCHP +Ps, which had a VERY good reputation as a fight stopper. The FBI also issued the same load for many years.
FBI Agent Mirelles ended the Miami Shootout in 1986 by killing Platt and Mattix with those rounds fired from a Smith & Wesson Model 19.
Horseless Trooper
New member
My old Dept. carried the Colt New Service .45 Colt until the late 50's. Then tey went to the 6in. Official Police, then the 4in. OP. The first S&W's were a Model 10 in .357 Magnum, later the M0del 13. In the 70's they went with the Model 28 Highway patrolman. Plain clothes officers carried Colt Detective Specials and Undercover carried Walther PPK's. When I started In '83 we carried the S&W 681 .357 with 158gr Magnum softpoints and plainclothes carried S&W M65 3in. revolvers.
BillCA is right about small towns, but the diversity was greater than he indicates. I grew up in an area in PA that had dozens of small towns, and each usually had only one or two cops. The assortment of guns would have made a collector ecstatic.
The cop in my hometown carried an S&W .44 HE, with a split chamber; he kept a wood plug in it so he wouldn't load it. Another cop carried a Mauser HSc, another a Luger, another a P.38, and one an old Colt Lightning. In a larger town, the chief of police (he had two cops under him, one part time) carried a Colt in .22 WRF, which looked more impressive than it was.
And the sole officer in an adjacent town did not carry or even own a gun. He said he saw no need for one, and truth be told at that time, he was right. In those days, it was rare for any police officer to actually fire his gun. Cartridges turned green in belt loops, and I saw police revolvers with cartridges so corroded they had to be hammered out of the chambers.
I think it was a better time.
Jim
The cop in my hometown carried an S&W .44 HE, with a split chamber; he kept a wood plug in it so he wouldn't load it. Another cop carried a Mauser HSc, another a Luger, another a P.38, and one an old Colt Lightning. In a larger town, the chief of police (he had two cops under him, one part time) carried a Colt in .22 WRF, which looked more impressive than it was.
And the sole officer in an adjacent town did not carry or even own a gun. He said he saw no need for one, and truth be told at that time, he was right. In those days, it was rare for any police officer to actually fire his gun. Cartridges turned green in belt loops, and I saw police revolvers with cartridges so corroded they had to be hammered out of the chambers.
I think it was a better time.
Jim