What is so great about CZs
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Per the Gun Week arti, I don't read the authors comments as a ringing endorsement of the Beretta over the CZ. He gives the nod to one or the other at different times, with the Beretta ending up in the lead at the end just a little.
The CZ was a common example of the contract guns and the Beretta was the " product of two brothers" ...forgot how he put it but it sounded like it could have been a tuned piece???
Fair comparison....who cares. It was just some gun rag author's opinion of two guns on a given day.
Anyway, you can pick the arti apart if you want. I see no benefit to that either way. He rates the guns on the ability to clear jams and gives the nod to Beretta. But neither jammed during testing. (Hummmmmm.....he had to simulate stovepipes.....and judges one better for something that never happened??)
Maybe he is correct and it is hard to clear SPs for the CZ, if I ever have the first one in one of my CZ s I'll find out I suppose.
Not everone likes the CZ, Glock or Beretta or whatever. Personal preferences. For the life of me I have tried and tried to "like" the Glock but alas, not. That trigger, that shape, that tupperware ugliness
Oh the horror!!!! But that is just me.
These are the reasons others love them so.
The Glock suffers no shortage on supporters, but the CZ is close on its heels in terms of supporters.
Both groups can be and are correct.
As long as LE buys so many Glocks for duty weapons, there is an underpinning (at least some psycological underpinning) to the idea that Glocks have something going for them that other products do not. I sell to LE and frankly they go with the lowest bidder in many ( heLL most) cases and follow-the-leader is part of their basic approcah to purchasing.
Were that not the case, I think the CZ-PCR/P-01 in 9 or 40 would be an outstanding replacement for the Glock in the hands of LE nationwide.
Since that would only run up the prices for well informed private buyers, like myself
, I pray LE remains on track with their current Glock based equipment. Actually I am a bit surprised the US military never jumped in/on the Glock bandwagon.
S-
The CZ was a common example of the contract guns and the Beretta was the " product of two brothers" ...forgot how he put it but it sounded like it could have been a tuned piece???
Fair comparison....who cares. It was just some gun rag author's opinion of two guns on a given day.
Anyway, you can pick the arti apart if you want. I see no benefit to that either way. He rates the guns on the ability to clear jams and gives the nod to Beretta. But neither jammed during testing. (Hummmmmm.....he had to simulate stovepipes.....and judges one better for something that never happened??)
Maybe he is correct and it is hard to clear SPs for the CZ, if I ever have the first one in one of my CZ s I'll find out I suppose.
Not everone likes the CZ, Glock or Beretta or whatever. Personal preferences. For the life of me I have tried and tried to "like" the Glock but alas, not. That trigger, that shape, that tupperware ugliness
Oh the horror!!!! But that is just me.These are the reasons others love them so.
The Glock suffers no shortage on supporters, but the CZ is close on its heels in terms of supporters.
Both groups can be and are correct.
As long as LE buys so many Glocks for duty weapons, there is an underpinning (at least some psycological underpinning) to the idea that Glocks have something going for them that other products do not. I sell to LE and frankly they go with the lowest bidder in many ( heLL most) cases and follow-the-leader is part of their basic approcah to purchasing.
Were that not the case, I think the CZ-PCR/P-01 in 9 or 40 would be an outstanding replacement for the Glock in the hands of LE nationwide.
Since that would only run up the prices for well informed private buyers, like myself
, I pray LE remains on track with their current Glock based equipment. Actually I am a bit surprised the US military never jumped in/on the Glock bandwagon.S-
I recently purchased a CZ 85 Combat. The fit and finish on the inside of the gun is as good as I have seen on anything. There are not the "gnaw" marks refered to by V V G on the one I got. Maybe the military surplus models are not finished as well. Mine is every bit as nicely finished as my Kahr MK40 or my BHP made in Belguim.
Nightcrawler
New member
www.cz-usa.com
Can the CZ-97B handle +P ammo? I emailed CZ and they kind of said no. Were they just covering their butts?
Can the CZ-97B handle +P ammo? I emailed CZ and they kind of said no. Were they just covering their butts?
lockandrock
New member
everybody so far have made reference to the CZ75 or 83. The CZ97 is a very nicely package 45. the trigger on the 97 is smooth from start to end. Something you don't see or hear about in the more expensive beretta and sigs.
My first semi-auto was a CZ75 and for $350.00 before taxes, it by far was the best buck for buck spent when compared aganist my beretta and sig and glocks. It equal or slightly better in accuracy then my current 92FS/inox.
What the gun review fail to state was the 92FS inox or Elite ( shown in photos )cost on avg 150 to 300 dollars or more when compared to the simple but yet effcient CZ 75. For a high quality starter 9mm the CZ is hard to beat.
My first semi-auto was a CZ75 and for $350.00 before taxes, it by far was the best buck for buck spent when compared aganist my beretta and sig and glocks. It equal or slightly better in accuracy then my current 92FS/inox.
What the gun review fail to state was the 92FS inox or Elite ( shown in photos )cost on avg 150 to 300 dollars or more when compared to the simple but yet effcient CZ 75. For a high quality starter 9mm the CZ is hard to beat.
For what I know, the Philippines police and military standard issued sidearm is the Beretta 92FS. Its was patterned after the US military. BUT the philippine shooting team uses CZ-75, also the team who won the AustralAsian IPSC production match held in the Philippines uses CZ75.
About the question "What is so great about CZs?"
1.Ergonomics
2.Cheap price
3.Accurate
4.Most copied firearm (Witness, Baby Eagle, Tanfoglio, .....)
5.Uses by Spetnaz
6.Reliable
7.I'm sure there's more.
About the question "What is so great about CZs?"
1.Ergonomics
2.Cheap price
3.Accurate
4.Most copied firearm (Witness, Baby Eagle, Tanfoglio, .....)
5.Uses by Spetnaz
6.Reliable
7.I'm sure there's more.
Here's examples of the kind of hyperbole that I referenced earlier:
The CZ is a good shooting gun for the money. But like every other product, it reflects a number of design tradeoffs that will well suit some people and not others.
One area that CZ has been unfairly critized for is support. I broke the slide stop on my CZ 85 Combat. They told me I had to send it back to them as the part had been redesigned (with a thicker sleeve, which was what broke) but returned it to me in three weeks, at no charge. No bad for an 8 year old pistol! CZ-USA does a good job.
CZ USA
CZ Home in Czech Republic
Yeah, right.
The CZ uses the tilting barrel lockup that John Browning used in the M1911, and later improved in the Browning Hi Power. There are a couple of clones of the CZ, but compare that to the number of M1911A1 clone manufacturers, or even HiPower clone manufacturers.
The CZ is a good shooting gun for the money. But like every other product, it reflects a number of design tradeoffs that will well suit some people and not others.
One area that CZ has been unfairly critized for is support. I broke the slide stop on my CZ 85 Combat. They told me I had to send it back to them as the part had been redesigned (with a thicker sleeve, which was what broke) but returned it to me in three weeks, at no charge. No bad for an 8 year old pistol! CZ-USA does a good job.
CZ USA
CZ Home in Czech Republic
Eric Larsen
New member
Ill jump in here again...why not? CZ have alot of great qualities in any price range. Ive had CZ's that have better triggers than Sigs...Ive had a PT940 Taurus that had a better trigger than my CZ's. The internals are rough where it doesnt matter, where it counts there just as good as any other maker.
The 83 is the best 380/Mak on the market..best capacity vs size, best balanced gun Ive owned period. Great accuracy, 1.9" @ 25yds 5 shots 95gr JPH silvertips rested. Trigger is what d/a guns should all be. Dependable beyond what is expected.
The 75/85 series is one of the top 3 copied guns of all time, 1911-BHP get credit where its due...Good trigger, sights, great accuracy and dependability. Ergonomics are great for most people and price is lower than it should be.
The 40 is a defunct colt/cz design that cz ran with. Top end/slide and barrel are typical of the 75-85 series with a 1911 "style" grip and angle thrown in from the colt influence. Great gun, all of the qualities of the 75/85 with a different twist thrown in.
The 97 is the cadillac of outa the box 45's. Best finish available from a production gun.....you gotta see the blued gun in person......drool! Typical Cz qualities and a better trigger than the 75/85 guns....close to the 83. Accuracy is one of the best production guns made....typical 25 yds groups are under 1.5"
The 100 is a Poly/DAO gun in 9 and 40. Very reasonably priced and great size/weight combo. Very thin and smaller than the XD most compare it too. Some bitch about the trigger and I shoot a range gun that the trigger is outstanding...long pull, but light and smooth.
The Compact/PCR/P01 are great carry guns...have the standard CZ stuff accuracy, trigger, dependability etc...PCR and P01 with an alloy frame, decocker, novak style sights, serrations on the f/b straps, comp style mag eject button, front and rear slide serrations for quick failure clearing and more.....all designed for a police side arm and a great CCW (My next CCW probably)
My Hi Caps for my Compact with Wolff springs held 15rnds and fed everyone of them all of the time...in a compact gun.
All in all,CZ doesnt have the most models, maybe more calibers would be nice...a 357 Sig CZ 100 or Compact/PCR ?
Its said You get what you pay for! True story, Im a salesman...trust me, you do get what you pay for.
CZ's just give you a little more for a little less.
Shoot well
The 83 is the best 380/Mak on the market..best capacity vs size, best balanced gun Ive owned period. Great accuracy, 1.9" @ 25yds 5 shots 95gr JPH silvertips rested. Trigger is what d/a guns should all be. Dependable beyond what is expected.
The 75/85 series is one of the top 3 copied guns of all time, 1911-BHP get credit where its due...Good trigger, sights, great accuracy and dependability. Ergonomics are great for most people and price is lower than it should be.
The 40 is a defunct colt/cz design that cz ran with. Top end/slide and barrel are typical of the 75-85 series with a 1911 "style" grip and angle thrown in from the colt influence. Great gun, all of the qualities of the 75/85 with a different twist thrown in.
The 97 is the cadillac of outa the box 45's. Best finish available from a production gun.....you gotta see the blued gun in person......drool! Typical Cz qualities and a better trigger than the 75/85 guns....close to the 83. Accuracy is one of the best production guns made....typical 25 yds groups are under 1.5"
The 100 is a Poly/DAO gun in 9 and 40. Very reasonably priced and great size/weight combo. Very thin and smaller than the XD most compare it too. Some bitch about the trigger and I shoot a range gun that the trigger is outstanding...long pull, but light and smooth.
The Compact/PCR/P01 are great carry guns...have the standard CZ stuff accuracy, trigger, dependability etc...PCR and P01 with an alloy frame, decocker, novak style sights, serrations on the f/b straps, comp style mag eject button, front and rear slide serrations for quick failure clearing and more.....all designed for a police side arm and a great CCW (My next CCW probably)
My Hi Caps for my Compact with Wolff springs held 15rnds and fed everyone of them all of the time...in a compact gun.
All in all,CZ doesnt have the most models, maybe more calibers would be nice...a 357 Sig CZ 100 or Compact/PCR ?
Its said You get what you pay for! True story, Im a salesman...trust me, you do get what you pay for.
CZ's just give you a little more for a little less.
Shoot well
You don't _always_ get what you pay for.
"You get what you pay for." is something that you hear all the time. Sometimes its true, and sometimes its not.
The situations where you get more than you pay for usually requires that you know something that most people don't. That is the premise behind insider trading, knowing the good restaurants before they get rated by a newspaper and any number of other things.
Everybody knows what a Glock is, but few people know what a CZ is. Since they don't know what it is, there isn't that much demand, so the prices stay low. And CZ can afford to sell them at a low price because Czechoslovakian manufacturing is probably dirt cheap.
CZ's are really nice guns that handle well, are generally very well constructed and are very accurate.
For manufacturing quality and QA, they aren't in the same class as Sigs or other expensive European brands, but for durability, ergonomics and accuracy, they rank right up there (imo).
I'd pick a CZ over a Ruger P series any day of the week, and I couldn't bring myself to spend the kind of money to buy a new Sig, Glock, Beretta or HK when I know how well the CZ shoots.
Steve
"You get what you pay for." is something that you hear all the time. Sometimes its true, and sometimes its not.
The situations where you get more than you pay for usually requires that you know something that most people don't. That is the premise behind insider trading, knowing the good restaurants before they get rated by a newspaper and any number of other things.
Everybody knows what a Glock is, but few people know what a CZ is. Since they don't know what it is, there isn't that much demand, so the prices stay low. And CZ can afford to sell them at a low price because Czechoslovakian manufacturing is probably dirt cheap.
CZ's are really nice guns that handle well, are generally very well constructed and are very accurate.
For manufacturing quality and QA, they aren't in the same class as Sigs or other expensive European brands, but for durability, ergonomics and accuracy, they rank right up there (imo).
I'd pick a CZ over a Ruger P series any day of the week, and I couldn't bring myself to spend the kind of money to buy a new Sig, Glock, Beretta or HK when I know how well the CZ shoots.
Steve
Stephen A. Camp
Staff In Memoriam
Hello. "Inaccurate?" Not a 25 yard target, but fired at 50'.
Best.
PS: In 9mm, I've found CZ75s to show a preference for a particular round or two for best accuracy. During my short time with a CZ75B in .40, it seemed to "like" about any factory load or handload I tried! Go figure.
Best.
PS: In 9mm, I've found CZ75s to show a preference for a particular round or two for best accuracy. During my short time with a CZ75B in .40, it seemed to "like" about any factory load or handload I tried! Go figure.
Stephen A. Camp
Staff In Memoriam
Hello. Yes, offhand and two-hand hold. Everything's stock on the pistol except the Novak sights and the finish. The bbl's the factory, but it's been hardchromed.
I wish I could say "rapid fire," but it was slow and deliberate.
Best.
I wish I could say "rapid fire," but it was slow and deliberate.
Best.
Nightcrawler,
Why don't you ask them what the barrel is made of? Most are made of SAE/ANSI 4140 ordnance steel, and it would be really hard to make a barrel of that stuff that couldn't handle +P pressures. They should answer that without worrying about CYA.
I'd be really surprised if it can't. The lower pressure limitations of old guns was mainly due to the poorer quality steels of the time. Most any modern gun can handle the higher pressures of +P rounds.
Why don't you ask them what the barrel is made of? Most are made of SAE/ANSI 4140 ordnance steel, and it would be really hard to make a barrel of that stuff that couldn't handle +P pressures. They should answer that without worrying about CYA.
Hyperbole, huh!?!
Yes, all three utilize the tilting barrell lockup design. But, the similarities between the CZ75, 1911 and BHP stop there. Whereas the 1911 and BHP have the slide riding ON outer frame rails, the CZ75 has the slide riding IN the frame on inner rails, an inherently stronger design. The 1911 and BHP are SINGLE ACTION designs. The CZ75B is a DOUBLE ACTION/SINGLE ACTION design yet can be carried cocked and locked ala 1911/BHP. You can't even really compare the BHP to the 1911. The BHP was an improvement over the 1911. John Browning designed the BHP to correct the "flaws" in the 1911 design. Many people consider the CZ75B to be an improvement over the BHP. As far as the three pistols go, they're all are completely different, IMHO.
I'll concede you one point. There are more 1911 clones.
BHP clones? I can only name three or four. All are nice, reasonably priced pistols, but nowhere near the quality of the original BHP.
Colt and Springfield were impressed enough with the CZ75 design to produce, either in partnership with CZ or on their own, CZ75 clones. I don't see CZ producing a 1911 clone.
So, I'll requalify my "most copied design" claim. The CZ75 is the most copied "modern" pistol design. AND, I can name AT LEAST 10 CZ clone designs. Chances are you've heard of them all.
I own and currently shoot all three. My favorite? My 1911's, (a Colt XSE and a Springfield 9mm Loaded). What do I carry? The BHP, (I prefer the "feel", the SA trigger and the 17+1 capacity with KRD mags). Which was the best "out of the box" shooter? The CZ75, hands down. It has the best DA trigger around, (including the SIG P220, which I also own).
If all you can afford is one pistol for everything, it's kind of hard to beat the CZ75.
Yeah, and the Mustang and Camaro are both front engine, rear wheel drive high performance cars.
Yes, all three utilize the tilting barrell lockup design. But, the similarities between the CZ75, 1911 and BHP stop there. Whereas the 1911 and BHP have the slide riding ON outer frame rails, the CZ75 has the slide riding IN the frame on inner rails, an inherently stronger design. The 1911 and BHP are SINGLE ACTION designs. The CZ75B is a DOUBLE ACTION/SINGLE ACTION design yet can be carried cocked and locked ala 1911/BHP. You can't even really compare the BHP to the 1911. The BHP was an improvement over the 1911. John Browning designed the BHP to correct the "flaws" in the 1911 design. Many people consider the CZ75B to be an improvement over the BHP. As far as the three pistols go, they're all are completely different, IMHO.
I'll concede you one point. There are more 1911 clones.
BHP clones? I can only name three or four. All are nice, reasonably priced pistols, but nowhere near the quality of the original BHP.
Colt and Springfield were impressed enough with the CZ75 design to produce, either in partnership with CZ or on their own, CZ75 clones. I don't see CZ producing a 1911 clone.
So, I'll requalify my "most copied design" claim. The CZ75 is the most copied "modern" pistol design. AND, I can name AT LEAST 10 CZ clone designs. Chances are you've heard of them all.
I own and currently shoot all three. My favorite? My 1911's, (a Colt XSE and a Springfield 9mm Loaded). What do I carry? The BHP, (I prefer the "feel", the SA trigger and the 17+1 capacity with KRD mags). Which was the best "out of the box" shooter? The CZ75, hands down. It has the best DA trigger around, (including the SIG P220, which I also own).
If all you can afford is one pistol for everything, it's kind of hard to beat the CZ75.
If I for some reason want to start with DA, I use thumb and triggerfinger, and of course keeping the gun in a safe direction. The last part should be obligatory for decockers as well.
Haven't slipped so far, and don't expect to, but then I don't feel the urge to shoot starting from DA all that often either.
Haven't slipped so far, and don't expect to, but then I don't feel the urge to shoot starting from DA all that often either.
Tim Croley
New member
When lowering the hammer on the CZ75, does it go down to a half cock or all the way down? What is the safest way to let the hammer down for a DA start?
Being left handed, this is the way that I would probably carry.
Being left handed, this is the way that I would probably carry.
You can stop it at half cock or drop it all the way. The safest way is to be careful (since you decock the same way you would a revolver), remove your finger from the trigger as soon as you can while still being able to lower the hammer (it does have a firing pin safety so if you slip after you remove your finger from the trigger you should be fine), and point the gun in a safe direction (if you are really nervous do it on the ground floor or outside and pointing the gun at the ground, however there are usually other options that are safe as well),
If this will be a carry gun and you think you will usually, or always, carry DA then think about getting the CZ 75BD. This is a decocker model so you don't have to manually decock the gun (something that isn't that bad but it makes many people nervous).
Another option, especially if you want the SA option at the range, is to get the 85 which has ambidextrous controls so you can carry SA more easily.