What is a Private Sale?

[Willie Sutton]

I have been to many gun shows myself and this is my interpretation only; You would be in violation of the law if you buy and sell firearms repetitively at different shows as your MAIN source of income and livelihood, as stated in Section 921



Sure glad you're not a lawyer... you best take some advice from ^^ above, as your opinion would be laughed outta court anywhere, anytime....


Seems you have read:

"with the principal objective of livelihood and profit "

as

"with the objective of principal livelihood and profit"



Being "Engaged in the Business" versus "Hobby Collector improving his collection" is like defining the difference between pornography & fine art nude photography. You might not be able to write down the differences, but anyone looking at it can tell the difference. Don't be the one to stick out as a dealer without a license. As Frank says, it's the totality of the effort that is the holistic "thing" that is going to be presented to a Grand Jury. Folks are not as stupid as they seem, and it's your peers that are going to be the ones deciding if it's pornography or art.



Willie

.

 

[lcpiper]

Now if you as an individual have a regular day job, and you only engage in the firearms business on the side once every month or less, then it is NOT your primary means of livelihood and only a supplement to your income.

You missed it all entirely didn't you?

What other jobs you may have has no bearing.


The operative concepts are
(1) devoting time, attention and labor; (once a month or less is still fits)
(2) doing so regularly as a trade or business; (This still fits)
(3) the repetitive purchase and resale of guns; and (Yes, still fits)
(4) intending to make money.(Definitely fits).

What kills your entire statement is this

"and you only engage in the firearms business"

The word business is the operative word that sinks it. You can't do this with the objective being to make money, even a little bit, even if you actually lose money. As long as the objective, the point, your effort, is to make money, then you are guilty.

 

[Newton24b]

a private sale was once established as a private citizen who sells a gun he happens to own, while following all gun laws that apply to the situation.

the problem is, if your someone who buys 3 guns a month, then waits till the next month to sell htem off, thats a business.

 

[ScottRiqui]

the problem is, if your someone who buys 3 guns a month, then waits till the next month to sell htem off, thats a business.

While there are transactions that are obviously "private", and other transactions that are obviously "business", there's no "bright line" separating the two - you have to look at the totality of the circumstances.

I can think of reasonable examples where someone might buy three guns one month and then sell them the next month without them being "business" transactions. Maybe the credit card bill arrives and the buyer realizes he's outspent his budget. Maybe he needs to raise some quick cash to cover unexpected medical expenses. Perhaps after buying the guns, he comes across a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to buy one of his "bucket list" guns, and sells his recent purchases to fund his dream gun.

 

[Frank Ettin]

...if your someone who buys 3 guns a month, then waits till the next month to sell htem off, thats a business.

Not necessarily.

See the cases I cited in post 9. Federal courts of appeal are explicitly telling us the factors that are to be considered in deciding if someone is "engaged in the business" of dealing in firearms. We need to listen to what the courts are telling us and not substitute our own judgment or interpretation.

We read the cases because in future cases other courts will make their decisions based on what prior courts have said. It is critical to understand what courts have done in past cases in order to be able to reasonably anticipate what courts are likely to do in future cases.

 

[Tom Servo]

While there are transactions that are obviously "private", and other transactions that are obviously "business", there's no "bright line" separating the two - you have to look at the totality of the circumstances.

Correct. More to the point, the definition is vague to the point that it will partially be up to arresting agents and/or a grand jury.