What if the choice in 2008 is...

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defjon

New member
Hillary/Obama (take your pick) vs. Rudy..? Maybe Mitt (I must confess I don't know anything about this guy. I just won't vote for him based on what I've read here concerning his 2nd ammendment views, Mass. gun laws are awful, and I don't want to vote for an extremely wealthy aristrocrat who would be completely disconnected from the majority of his voting base (read: Kerry). )

I'm not really seeing a choice there. I'd possibly not vote...or, another line of thinking has me considering that Hillary would probably really serve to polarize congress. The remaining republicans there would probably fight her tooth and nail, wanting to look good doing so. Hillary as prez might really get the republican party into high gear.

Rudy as prez, which is just as bad for gun rights, well...maybe he could do more harm, you know? He would be dressed in friendly colors, and I think that a lot of the time people vote along with their party.

Thoughts? What would you do if this is how it shakes down?
 
If it's a choice between liberal, anti-gun Democrats and liberal, anti-gun Republicans, then I'll vote Libertarian.

Enough is enough. I'm never voting against the Constitution or traditional American values again.

Incidentally, if it comes down to Hillary/Obama versus Giuliani, then I'd rather see Hillary/Obama win. Of course I wouldn't vote for them, but anyone is better than Giuliani, who said these utterly revolting words:

Freedom is about authority. Freedom is about the willingness of every single human being to cede to lawful authority a great deal of discretion about what you do.
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Source: http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9A01E2D9173CF933A15750C0A962958260

:mad: :barf:

And yes, both Giuliani and Romney are anti-gun. Either one WILL sign another Assault Weapons Ban if it gets to his desk. I'm not sure about McCain, Huckabee, or Thompson on that score. I do know that Ron Paul will veto ANY new federal gun legislation, as well as any other unconstitutional legislation.
 
Considering party politics, there may be a silver lining to the dark cloud should a democrat win in 08. Republican party rules are that the party will not recognize any other candidate during a presidential election year if the incumbent republican is running. So like in 04 if you were a republican you had no choice but to vote for Bush or "uncommitted" in the primary. So if Guliani or some other moderate republican wins chances are he'll be around 8 years cause there will be something in 012 why the nation will re-elect him plus the dem's will beat themselves up like they did in 04.
If a dem wins then the 012 primary is open and a more conservative candidate will probably arise. Sort of like Nixon/Carter/Reagan.
Chances are we will be in a recession if not in 08 then by 09, the party in the White house gets blamed setting up a change of party in 012.
I'd hate to see a dem in the White House but it may be inevitable.
 
I've flip-flopped on this subject a few times, but I think I've settled into my answer now. Although I have no doubt any of the front running GOP candidates will sign a new AWB (as would prez Bush), even one more invasive than the last, I don't think any of them will actively push for it. Or for any other gun control. They'll have to answer to a lot of fellow republicans who are pro-gun, and I think they'll try to to tick off their core conservative supporters.

Rudy has also talked a pretty good game, that he will hopefully support, and said that he would only push for constructionist SCOTUS judges and did believe the 2nd amnendment was an individual right. It goes against his history, of course, but if he wants to get a second term and be respected he needs to at least somewhat stand behind his campaign promises.

So I will still vote republican. Even for Rudy or Mitt. They are not pro-gun candidates, but they won't be agressivley anti-gun. And if the republicans push them hard enough (not likely) they may even veto some negative bills.
 
I don't live in NYC and neither does the rest of the country.

Rudy is our wost choice. If you look at how NYC operates you see Rudy in action over and over. And regardless of how it worked there it not the way I want the country run. Given a bad choice and lesser evil you might be surprised how you choose.
 
I do not see any of the current crop of candidates who will be an America first leader and in my opinion unless we have that soon all is lost so discussing who is the best guy is needless it should be who will do the least damage.

We've lost our industrial base, we outsource, sell off our assets to China and others all in the name of "free trade", the current policies are leading us down a poor path.
 
I've prostituted myself since the 1960s, voting for what I considered the "lesser of two evils" in the two major parties. In hindsight, only very few of them were worth the time it took to cast my vote. No more. In my gray years, I've decided to redeem my character and vote for the most constitutional individual I can find. The country will get exactly what it deserves from the upcoming election, but from now on, I will no longer be ashamed of my vote.
 
I can't say until the primaries are over.

One thing is for certain McCain, Gulliani, or Romney will never get my vote.

What has happened to the soul of the Rep party?

President John F. Kennedy would have thought McCain and Gulliani were too liberal, maybe even Romney.
 
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anyone is better than Giuliani
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+1.
I don't think he stands a snowman's chance in hell though, not anticipating it'll a problem.

Of the three you listed I would vote (choke) Hillary. I think she would accomplish nothing, and therefore screw up the smallest number of things.

Romney, Huckleberry, and Obama are lunatics from the fringes. JMO.

How did we ever end up with this collection of losers to choose from for the most important job one the planet....
 
I really think it just gets worse everytime...
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I think your right defjon.

Soon our choices for President will be between the pro big government, anti gun, liberal and the pro big government, anti gun, liberal.
 
If it is Hillary or Obama vs Guiliani or Romney I will vote Libertarian. I don't feel any need to assist the above four to more power than they currently hold. I disagree with most of their past and current beliefs so why would I vote for them? I want a smaller government that keeps it's nose out of the majority of my life. I will happily pay them to build roads, make trade deals that are advantagous to American business, defend our borders but other than that I want a small, itty bitty,teeny weeny, non interventionist both here and abroad federal government.
 
I understand all of the frustration posted above, but a vote for the Libertarians will help elect Hillary or Obama. That's just the reality. I will vote for the Republican whoever it is in hopes of avoiding a Democratic House, Senate and President. I live in a one party state and i wouldn't wish that on anyone!
 
We are SOL if its Obama (or Clinton) vs. Rudi the Rino. This seems like a 50-50 scenario to me. Obama and Clinton are likely going to win as Dems, with Rudi the Rino perhaps has a 40% chance to win as a Repub. This is worst case because all three are extreme liberals on social issues, IMO.

OTOH, if it comes down to Edwards vs. Thompson, its not quite as bad (Edwards being somewhat moderate of a liberal, likewise Thompson a moderate conservative). This scenario seems highly unlikely though--less than 1%.

Its most likely going to be Obama (or Hillary) vs. McCain. Extreme liberal democrat vs. soft conservative republican (bordering on being a mild RINO). I certainly could live with McCain (he's a lot better than Rudi the RINO or Mitt), but we are seriously fracked if Obama or Hillary win the whole election, especially if the libs remain in control of the house and senate.

I agree with wuluf... voting for a libertarian will hand the keys to the dems. Only scenario I vote for a libertarian is if Rudi the RINO is the Republican winner... since I see him as NO BETTER than Obama or Hillary. I'm not going to support a Republican that is more liberal than most dems on social issues, as IMO Rudi is.
 
(bordering on being a mild RINO)
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He has already crossed the border to full blown RINO.
McCain_Rino225.jpg
 
Mitt won Michigan...

This leaves the door open for Rudi the Rino to win the large states and come out in decent shape.

It just seems that we are not going to get a decent social conservative in there no matter what.

We may just be SOL in 2008...
 
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