What if attacker tries to take your firearm

A

als54

New member
What if attacker tries to take your firearm from you. He's unarmed but won't be if he gets your firearm from you. What could you do with in the law?
 
If this question bothers you, go take a good class in firearms retentions & disarms.

Best money I ever spent.

pax
 
Me? Assuming a struggle over the 1911 (primary), I would let it go, while drawing the .38 from the opposite side. He doesn't have the ability to fire it right away (manual of arms questions, wrong grip, etc), while I have him at muzzlepoint already. Seems like the easiest way of handling it to me. YMMV
 
Well if it were to happen now id just hit the mag eject button and run. My gun has an Ambi-mag release.

Now I plan on getting lessons not only for disarming and protecting my own arms but possibly some martial arts too which I think anyone who carries a gun for self defense should also do!
 
If we are that close, keys in the eyes, corkscrew in the ear or slash them with an edged weapon. Inflict as much pain/damage as possible ASAP.
 
Me? Assuming a struggle over the 1911 (primary), I would let it go, while drawing the .38 from the opposite side. He doesn't have the ability to fire it right away (manual of arms questions, wrong grip, etc), while I have him at muzzlepoint already. Seems like the easiest way of handling it to me.
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You are kidding, right? Surely you would not the guy take your primary (1911), thereby giving the previously unarmed attacker the benefit of having the greater amount of power over your .38.

You seem to be making a couple of assumptions that seem to be in your favor where you are counting on things going poorly for the attacker.

First, you are making a huge assumption that the guy won't have the ability to fire right away and even if he doesn't, he still may be able to get the gun to fire before you can pocket draw your .38. Are you sure you will be able to draw your pocket gun before he gets the 1911 to work? You can't be sure because you don't know your attacker's skills. Do you really want to count on your ability to surive the conflict being largely based on the assumption that your attacker is inept? That seems to be what you are saying. Underestimating your opponent's abilities is a recipe for disaster.

Second, you are assuming that the only thing the guy will be attempting to do is shoot you. Since y'all are in such close proximity, what is to stop him from using your 1911 as a blunt force object on your skull? He won't be losing any time trying to figure out how the gun works if he chooses this blunt force option.

The notion of just letting your attacker take your gun pretty much is in much conflict with gun retention theory that holds one is better off by being able to maintain full of control of their own gun or partial control where you strive to keep the muzzle from being able to be pointed at you for firing. Loss of control of your own gun to an attacker will skyrocket the risk to you at the time control was lost.
 
The ONLY assumption I'm making is that the 1911 is in my hand (drawn to retention). Using that assumtion (and the scenario that he's close enough to have hold of it, and trying to pull it away from me), I can safely say what I did...

First off, the .38 is NOT in a pocket: it's at roughly 10 o'clock, where I can access it with either hand almost as fast as I can the .45 (which is kept at roughly 4). In a tug of war match, if one side let's go, the other side is now off-balance (regardless of training. Only exception is if they're expecting it). If I let go WHILE DRAWING THE .38, I'll have the .38 in hand before he could even bring the .45 up to bludgeon. And 5 rounds of +P .38 will generally stop ANYONE...

Maybe I read more into the situation than I should have?
 
It's very clear to me that if someone is trying to take your gun away they are not then going to smile, hand you a flower and go away. If they are taking your gun, they want to use it in a criminal fashion.

When I was in the IDF we were given clear instructions that if anybody tried to take your rifle or to take a weapon from a soldier next to you, you were to immediately open fire.
 
pax said:
If this question bothers you, go take a good class in firearms retentions & disarms.

Best money I ever spent.
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I wholeheartedly agree! Preventing an attacker already in close quarters from separating you from your weapon, is a skill that everyone carrying a gun needs to know.

Technique aside, if it seemed like the attacker was about to gain control of my gun despite my best efforts, I would fire a shot or two - the slide recoil should do something nice for his grip, and if it hits him, bonus. This of course would be out of the question if the attacker had control of my arm to the extent that the muzzle was pointed back in my direction. In that case I'd best be carrying a knife in a location such that it's easily drawn with my off-hand.
 
This is why carry permits are for CONCEALED carry.

If you present your piece you should pe prepared to use it!

All this martial arts stuff is fine but the BG might just know more than you do, or have spent the last two years in the Greybar hotel pumping iron and learning from pros.

All the "Retention" classes are no match for a guy who is an expert in mongolian death boot fighting.
 
All the "Retention" classes are no match for a guy who is an expert in mongolian death boot fighting.
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And handguns are no match for a guy wearing body armor and carrying a shield, who is hopped up on PCP and other drugs.

Just because all scenarios aren't surviveable, doesn't mean none are.

pax

You're only beaten when you allow yourself to believe it. – John Farnam
 
I think the question is about the law and not about our training or tactics.

If I read the question right - can you act with lethal force and I would say the answer is Yes. However, you better be sure that you were justified in having the gun out or it was clearly an attack on you.

If you drew the gun in a situation not justified, like the guy just yelling at you or you were pissed off and then he grabbed it and you shot him, I could easily see you go to jail.

DNS - some folks do teach letting go of the primary to go for the secondary. You see it with long arms.
 
Mfree is the only who's got it right!

If you draw a gun and the guy does not stop, you could always try to run away. You can also tell the police officer, DA, or judge that he approached in a threatening manner and was reaching for a weapon (assuming there were not a lot of witnesses to say otherwise.) The you can stick your .38 in his old dead hands and say that he grabbed your gun and was going to shoot you with it!

I'm partially kidding... I think you need to clarify the situation though. What reason did you have for drawing your weapon in the first place? If you had a justified self defense situation, just shoot the guy. If you did not have a justified self defense situation, you should not have drawn. That would be brandishing. I Florida, there is no longer the obligation to retreat, but that doesn't mean that using lethal force won't make your life a lot more complicated.

If there really is a credible threat, then by all means, shoot. If your attackers sees your gun and is still approaching, they probably have some seriously bad intentions or are high and not rational. Either scenario goes from bad to very bad if he gets your weapon!
 
I think the question is about the law and not about our training or tactics.

If I read the question right - can you act with lethal force and I would say the answer is Yes. However, you better be sure that you were justified in having the gun out or it was clearly an attack on you.

If you drew the gun in a situation not justified, like the guy just yelling at you or you were pissed off and then he grabbed it and you shot him, I could easily see you go to jail.

DNS - some folks do teach letting go of the primary to go for the secondary. You see it with long arms.
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Yes, you understood correctly. That was my question, I do realize that you cannot use a gun as leverage in a fight situation. I am always aware when someone is close to my gun side and wondered what I could do if I was made and someone made an effort to take my firearm. I do appreciate all of the comments as well.
 
Yep - an attempt to take my gun does not end with the loss of the gun... Such a scenario ends with shots fired. The only question is whether they are mine or his and that is what makes me afraid for my life.

The shots will be mine.
 
IMO, it boils down to this: if you felt threatened enough to draw and present your weapon, then you clearly are more threatened by his action to disarm you.
It is very rare to hear a case where it cannot be articulated that you felt your life was in danger by the subject trying to disarm you. If it was justifiable for you to draw it, it would then be justifiable for you to shoot.
In the military and LE circles, this would be a good shoot everyday.
 
Boom!!

If you had a justified self defense situation, just shoot the guy.
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That would be my approach. If you are in fear for your life and the scumbag in question advances to try to take your weapon, your life is now in even more danger. Shoot him.

If he gets the weapon, rest assured he will kill you with your own gun.
 
http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/weapons/self_defense.html

Q. When can I use my handgun to protect myself?

A. Florida law justifies use of deadly force when you are:

* Trying to protect yourself or another person from death or serious bodily harm;
* Trying to prevent a forcible felony, such as rape, robbery, burglary or kidnapping.


In that case the individual would have put your life in danger, you are justified in using deadly force, not only in fear of your life but because he was attempting to commit strong arm robbery also.

The new law in FL does not require you to run away or place yourself in further danger, nor do you have to conceed your personal property in a robbery attempt.

http://www.flsenate.gov/

search HB 0249

If you live in FL you need to review this new law, we are very fortunate to have gotten it passed.
 
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Maybe I'm missing something, but pull the trigger.

Magazine ejection doesn't work for me. One is all it takes to injure or kill me.
I'm not letting it get to the point where the attacker actually has a decent grip on my gun.
 
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