What constitutes proof of residence?

C

cgjohnst

New member
Hey guys, I am moving to New Mexico on Saturday for a military PCS. My understanding of what I need to purchase firearms in New Mexico is my id card, my orders, and a proof of residence. Both gun stores I called said I need a bill. Do I need a paper bill that is mailed to my house or can I just print off a bill from online? Most, if not all, of my bills will be set up for ebilling. Shouldn't that suffice or is there a problem with people abusing that somehow?

Thanks guys! I'm not sure how long I can wait to get my first AR-15 and my wife's pistol!
 
Most places will take a power bill even if it is printed out or a signed rental contract. If they have any doubts they can contact the utility company to confirm.

Doug
 
Awesome, thanks! I seem to keep getting the guys who have to go ask their manager every time I ask them a question on the phone.
 
Actually, it's not nearly as complex as they're making it.

If it's a rifle or shotgun, all you need is an ID with current address. If your driver's license from back home still has a valid address, that suffices. You'll use that for the form.

If it's a handgun, you need a copy of your orders on top of that. Use your NM address on the form.

I'm not sure why they're asking for power bills or somesuch, since those aren't government issued. You've already got what you legally need.
 
Vehicle(s)....

If it were me, Id use my new NM auto insurance ID card & documentation. Id use the new DMV vehicle reg too if that is in New Mexico.
I had to use my auto insurance ID & DMV documents for a "proof of residence" issue in 2012.
FWIW, you might want to ask the NM's veterans affairs office(dept) or the agency that runs the CCWs if active duty military get any waviers or special policies. Some states & jurisdictions grant service members and/or veterans these SOPs.
 
I'll have to ask about that. My auto insurance will definitely be moved over, but I have my car registered in the state of my permanent address. Then I'm a Florida resident which is a different state than my permanent address. There's some rule about being a resident of one state, having your car in another, and living elsewhere if you're active duty. I can't remember it all, but I just remember I was told I don't have to change anything as long as I leave them where they are. If I move them I have to move them to where I'm currently living.

Hopefully the auto insurance cards will work. That seems like it would make sense.
 
JAG/legal affairs....

I'd discuss these issues with a JAG lawyer or legal affairs specialist.
It's been about 24 years since I was a MP, so I doubt my "advice" would be as valid as a recent base/post office.
When I was on active duty, your "home of record"(where you are from or what is your residence) is where you put your POV(private owned vehicle) state reg, your DL, your proof of insurance, etc would be that state(location).
While I was in the military, I just used my mom's information since her house was 2 hours from my duty station. I put all my POV information there.
I kept my DL in the state I lived in prior to my enlistment(PA) since it was valid & as a PA resident in the US military I was exempt from PA state income tax. ;)

FWIW; PA is one of the state's that allow active duty service members to get CCWs even if they are under 21.

CF
 
cgjohnst Hey guys, I am moving to New Mexico on Saturday for a military PCS. My understanding of what I need to purchase firearms in New Mexico is my id card, my orders, and a proof of residence.
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If you read the instructions to Question 20a on the Form 4473 it will tell you that you need:
-a government issued photo ID, showing your name, birthdate and current residence address. A combination of government issued documents is acceptable.
-If the buyer is a member of the Armed forces, acquiring a firearm in the state where his permanent duty station is located then the dealer will need to see a copy of your orders to list on Que 20a
-If the government issued photo ID does not show the current residence address then government issued "alternate documentation" is recorded on Question 20b.
-


Both gun stores I called said I need a bill.
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Only if the bill is issued by a government entity.



-rdmallory Most places will take a power bill even if it is printed out or a signed rental contract.
-ClydeFrog If it were me, Id use my new NM auto insurance ID card
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Neither is acceptable as alternate government issued documentation for "proof of residence".
 
ClydeFrog
When I was on active duty, your "home of record"(where you are from or what is your residence) is where you put your POV(private owned vehicle) state reg, your DL, your proof of insurance, etc would be that state(location).
While I was in the military, I just used my mom's information since her house was 2 hours from my duty station. I put all my POV information there.
I kept my DL in the state I lived in prior to my enlistment(PA) since it was valid & as a PA resident in the US military I was exempt from PA state income tax.
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For the purposes of buying a firearm, "home of record" doesn't matter.
Current residence address matters
Permanent Duty Station matters.
The 4473 has instructions for the dealer to follow.
 
Virginia allows utility bills as a secondary means of proving residence for handgun purchases.

Requires a drivers license or military as primary ID.
 
No Jokes Please

Dealers in California (it's true, we still have & shoot our guns here) ask for a copy of a power or phone bill to super-double-extra-prove residence.
 
-Mike Irwin Virginia allows utility bills as a secondary means of proving residence for handgun purchases.
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Sorry, but its ATF, not Virginia that determines what is acceptable for proof od residency and identification. While VA may have its own requirement they cannot be less stringent than ATF regs/Federal law.
A utility bill would only be acceptable as alternate documentation if issued by a government entity:
City of Richmond water bill?............acceptable.
Megagiant Power & Light Electric Co. Inc?.............no, its a business, not a government entity. (even if it is the ONLY electric co in the state)


ATF clearly states in the instructions on the Form 4473 what is acceptable.......dealers don't get to decide on their own.;)
 
Neither is acceptable as alternate government issued documentation for "proof of residence".
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That may be true, but most FFLs accept utility bills without giving it a second thought. It isn't the buyer that gets in trouble for a transfer with insufficient identification - it's the FFL. If they accept it, it's their problem.

Hell... I had one take a credit card bill as proof of residency, once, since my DL had an old address on it (Utah's approved method of updating your address is writing it in pen, on a piece of tape, on the back of the card :rolleyes:).
 
The Virginia State Police website states that the primary form of identification for a firearm transfer must be a government issued photo ID showing the individual’s name, race, sex, address, and date of birth. This satisfies the Federal law requirements (plus some).

Virginia law also requires a secondary form of ID, and says utility bills are acceptable for this secondary ID:

The secondary form of identification, for Virginia residents and residents of other states, must show an address identical to that shown on the primary form of identification. Some acceptable forms of secondary ID are:

•a current lease,
•evidence of currently paid personal property tax or real estate tax,
•a current utility or telephone bill,
•a current voter registration card,
•a current bank check,
•a current passport,
•a current automobile registration and
•current hunting or fishing license.
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http://www.vsp.state.va.us/Firearms_VFTP.shtm

TomNJV
 
Thanks for posting that, Tom.

I had hoped that "primary" and "secondary" would have been clear enough, but I should have expanded my first post to better explain that.

I never understood the passport being viable as a secondary means of identification, because to the best of my knowledge, passports still don't show the holder's address.

Under Virginia law, proof of citizenship is required to purchase an "assault weapon," and for that the passport does suffice.

I always carry both my driver's license and my voter's registration card so that when I hit the gunshop/show, I'm not trying to find a secondary source of ID.
 
When I was in the military your "home of record" (HOR) was wherever you lived when you entered military service and could never be changed. I entered from New York, and for several years, even after I became a resident of Texas while on active duty (I registered to vote in Texas, got a Texas driver's license, and bought cowboy boots and a Stetson!) the state of New York tried to force me to pay state income taxes on my military pay. I was warned by an attorney, after successfully getting them to acknowledge that I no longer lived in NY, and had no intention of returning, that if I EVER returned to NY to live, even 30 or 40 years later, I would risk them coming after me for back taxes on ALL of my income during those 30 or 40 years saying that my return was "proof" that I never truly intended to give up NY residency.

Back in those days, if I recall, I bought a handgun in Texas and I don't think I had to present anything other than my cash on the counter, not even a driver's license (but that was almost 50 years ago!).

Sadly, I am now a resident of the awful state of Illinois.
 
In Virginia I can accept your orders to a base in Virginia as your proof of residence. At least, that's how I interpret the Virginia and ATF instruction.
 
Found the ATF instruction on it

Copied from the ATF Website

18 U.S.C.
922(t)(1)(C): IDENTIFICATION OF TRANSFEREE
27 CFR
178.124: FIREARMS TRANSACTION RECORD
Licensees
may accept a combination of valid government-issued documents to satisfy the
identification document requirements of the Brady Act. The required valid
government-issued photo identification document bearing the name, photograph,
and date of birth of the transferee may be supplemented by another valid,
government-issued document showing the transferee's residence address. A member
of the Armed Forces on active duty is a resident of the State in which his
or her permanent duty station is
located, and may satisfy the identification document requirement by presenting
his or her military identification card along with official orders showing
that his or her permanent duty station is within the State where the licensed
premises are located.
 
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