What am I missing? 243 is frustrating me!

Well, I'm not giving up on the 243 barrel yet. Based on my experience with my other 77s I don't think the bedding is causing it to shoot so wildly. I found some Hoppe's #9 Bench Rest Copper Solvent, a new Rod and some Brass Jags and the right sized patches I had squirreled away and I've been running wet patches down the bore and letting the bore sit for 30 minutes to a few hours doing other things between working patches down the bore. Been getting bright green patches out after giving the copper solvent time to work so I know there is plenty of copper in the barrel. I also ran some copper solvent down my 97 vintage Mark II in 223 and it's 1:12 barrel is not nearly as copper fouled as the 243 with much lighter green patches coming out of that gun. It's possible the previous owner was shooting some of those light loads near 4000fps down the bore and really fouled it up and I've just added to the problem not being agressive enough cleaning out the bore! My fingers are crossed that some patience cleaning it out in more than just a cursory manner to remove fouling will pay off with a gun that shoots well under 2 inches at 130 yards with anything load I feed it! I will also know that copper solvent will be a must for cleaning the gun after every 50 to 100 rounds from now on.
 
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Bench rest shooters i run with use a mix of Sweets, and Hoppes #9.
Wet patch. Let sit overnight. Scrub in morning.

Bear in mind, that after getting all the copper out, it's not uncommon for a Ruger to take upwards of 50 rounds to settle in and shoot proper afterwards.

Ruger will more than likely do nothing for you accuracy wise.
Once free floated, the accuracy warranty is void.
 
Jack is your 243 a Ruger or another brand?

I am looking forward to putting some rounds down range and see how my results have been affected by the copper removal. I ran a few more wet soak for awhile then dry patch to see what would come out and the last time the patch had a minimal amount of green so I followed up with outers bore solvent to wipe out any remaining crud and the patch looked pretty clean. Now if I would have let copper solvent sit in the barrel over night it may have gotten more out of the pores but I think I've removed enough to give the barrel a fair chance to shoot well. The rifling looks pretty good looking down the bore. I am wondering if like leading, once it gets to a certain point the bullets start swaging down and the stripping of material from the bullets dramatically increases.
 
I worked on a rifle recently that had heavily fouled rifling and was shooting erratically, it wasn't very old and didn't have that many cartridges through it. I spent a couple days getting the rifling clean, but within a few shots they became fouled quickly, I finally noticed that there was a lot of chatter in the rifling grooves that appeared to be stripping copper from the bullet with each shot. It became an exercise in getting a few accurate shots off and then a heavy cleaning ritual. I finally decided it was time to get a quality borecam.
 
If your going for copper removal, especially for diagnosing an accuracy issue, pretty clean isn't clean enough.

Keep scrubbing.
 
Using brass jags will give a false reading, the copper solvent will just keep leaching the copper out of the brass showing green on the patches. Same with brushes, best to use some sort of nylon.
 
Have you only tried 70 grains? I tried so hard for my 700 varmint gun in .243 to like 75 grain bullets but it didn't. It'll shoot 52 grain into an inch at 200 though.
 
Just tried 70s and 100s so far..... The brass jag wasn't in there long enough with the solvent to make much difference on the wet patch. There was a dramatic reduction in green copper on the patches between the start and end of the process over the course of the day. I scrubbed with a bronze brush and outers solvent too a few times in between copper cleanings and dry patching and after about 10 to 20 passes with the brush there was a lot of black fouling that wiped out when I followed the brushing with wet patches. I don't know how much cleaner I could get the barrel at this point!!!
 
Bad bedding is the number one cause of erratic groups. The barreled action is moving in the stock.
"...a lot of black fouling..." Endless patches will just make you crazy. Clean it the way bamaranger suggests. Gives the solvent time to work. Mind you, a dirty barrel isn't going to cause horribly erratic groups.
Loads near 4,000 fps don't excessively foul a barrel either.
 
Well, it may be a bedding problem. I shot several loads today and the ohly one that showed any promise was 38.5gr of H4895 behind the 70grain Nossler. Some groups were both vertically and horizontally spread. Sometimes it was mainly horizontal spread but there was usually some left to right dispersion too. Are there any good aftermarket stocks that will correctly bed this action? My buddy bought an aftermarket stock for his model 7 in 308 and it shoots very well now.. It's enough to make a grown man cry to send five shots down range that you would need an open hand to cover the group:mad: The best shooting load would hit a 3 inch dot most of the time:cool:
 
Try this. Clean the barrel with a good solvent. I use Wipe Out Patch Out. It takes time, but it will make it clean of copper. Hopes may do a bit better on carbon. Give each enough time to work. Use a brush.

Then shoot it with some decent factory match ammo. Hornady usually has something for like $25-$35 per box.

Shoot 4 x 5 shot groups at 100 yards off your best rest. What rest are you using?

That is a good baseline for a factory rifle, IMO.

Before shooting, check torque on all action and scope bolts. Is this the Hawkeye with the angled front screw? If so, it has to be a very high(for a gun) torque like 90 in lbs.

Post pics, if you can.

One anomaly in your writing was you seemed to say your other rifles shoot 2” groups at 100 yds. Is that good? Is that your target?
 
Nathan my other guns will shoot just about any load into two inches, Better loads about an inch or less at 130 yards which is my range limit from a good bench with bags. This is a Pre Hawkeye Mark II but same thing with the angled front screw that secures the floor plate. The main difference is blonde laminate stock and better high polish finish rather than later cheaper matte finish. There may be some trigger differences also but this one has the typical newer 3 position ruger 77 safety.. If I got a consistent 2 inches at 130 yards with 100 grain speer soft points I would be relatively content but the grouping is so unpredictable it's driving me crazy. I also noticed in this 243 a switch from 70 to 100 grain bullets results in a large drop in the point of impact of about 6 to 8 inches so there is no way to have two loads that can be used without a major sight adjustment. I bought the gun used and you may have missed the prior owner free floated it and I replaced the pad at the front of the stock with devcon. So it probably had accuracy issues long before I laid my hands on it.
 
jinxed!!

You've jinxed me! Took one of my .243's out today, wouldn't group worth a hoot. Initial shots were 6-8" from point of aim. Investigation yielded loose rings. Shot some better after that, but after 10 rds or so, got a bit sloppy again. I've deep cleaned it tonight, and will try proven ammo in the near future.
 
How did you get the 38.5gr of H4895 with the 70gr bullet?
Ladder test?
Velocity test?
Did you play with seating depth?

I've seen big (8-10 inches) differences between 100gr factory ammo & handloads.
 
There are 3 screws holding the action in place. Loosen the middle screw then snug it down. If this screw is to tight, the rifle will not shoot well. Play with the tension on the middle screw and see what happens. If this fails, you probably have a bad barrel. This has worked for me on five M77s.
 
Well I've seen a few comments I agree with. Decoppering the barrel was one of the first thing that came to mind. Nathan mentioned the torque value for the front screw was 90 inch pounds and he just may be right. I thought it was 75 inch pounds. The comment on the middle screw is also spot on. I've noticed that if it isn't right. too loose of too tight the floor plate latch doesn't work right; hard to close or open.
On the "altered" stock, Ruger will still warranty the gun but will tell you you have to buy a new stock. They do return the old to you though. I had an M77 tang safety rifle that I'd bought second hand. The previous owner had free floated the barrel. The extractor wouldn't pull fired cases from the chamber. When I called Ruger and explained my problem I was informed they'd fix the extractor but I would have to buy a new stock. After studying the situation I just replaced the extractor with one that came off a Mauser action I'd scrapped. Worked just fine until I sold the rifle to to friend. He's never said he had any problem with it. Good luck on finding the fix.
Paul .
 
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