What .30-06 projectile/powder for 1,000 yards?

R

Rangerrich99

New member
Okay, here's the deal: I was recently invited to attend a long-range precision rifle class by one of my defensive handgun/carbine instructors. Maximum range will be slightly over 1,000 yards.

My rifle will probably be my Savage M110 chambered in .30-06 Springfield. I freely admit that while I've been reloading .30-06 cartridges, they've exclusively been with hunting in mind, so I haven't loaded anything other than 165/168 grain Nosler Accubonds. I realized that I have no idea if my current cartridge is even close to appropriate for this upcoming class.

So I'm here to ask you guys: what projectile and what powder would you experienced long-range shooters use for best results with a Savage M110 chambered in .30-06?

Thanks in advance for your replies.

P.S. Also, on a kind of sidenote, what book would you guys recommend for learning as much as I can about long range shooting before this class?
 
The book is by Bryan Litz, “Applied Ballistics for Long range shooting”.

I’m not familiar with your rifle, but suggest the following. Match Grade ammo, not plinking or hunting. I use Hornady AMax in my Barrett .50BMG and TP 6.5 Creedmoor. Incredibly consistent ammo.

But like any ammo you need to see what ammo works best in your Savage.
Good luck, 1000 is my favorite distance, requiring a lot more considerations than 100 yard plinking.

And remember your gun is most accurate when you touch it as little as possible while on the trigger. :)
 
I agree with TXAZ. Good book to read!
The bullet/powder choice is another matter.
You'll probably want to stick in the 165-168 gr weight class. Others will tell you to go as heavy as possible.
Sierra Tipped MatchKing, Hornady ELDM, Nosler RDF, and of course Berger VLD would all be bullets i'd look at.
Powder, you want something stable. Not just temp stable. But for long range your looking at your ES/SD.
 
Rangerrich99 said:
Okay, here's the deal: I was recently invited to attend a long-range precision rifle class by one of my defensive handgun/carbine instructors. Maximum range will be slightly over 1,000 yards.

My rifle will probably be my Savage M110 chambered in .30-06 Springfield. I freely admit that while I've been reloading .30-06 cartridges, they've exclusively been with hunting in mind, so I haven't loaded anything other than 165/168 grain Nosler Accubonds. I realized that I have no idea if my current cartridge is even close to appropriate for this upcoming class.

So I'm here to ask you guys: what projectile and what powder would you experienced long-range shooters use for best results with a Savage M110 chambered in .30-06?

Thanks in advance for your replies.

P.S. Also, on a kind of sidenote, what book would you guys recommend for learning as much as I can about long range shooting before this class?
Click to expand...

Before I get into some 1000 yd feedback , we need to know more about your rifle. You commented "hunting" so im assuming your Savage is a hunting rifle ? Understand shooting 1000 yds is challenging. You need to have adequate equipment to be successful. Also need to know what type of optic you have ? Post up the twist rate of your barrel, this will help with bullet selection. Plan on fitting your rifle with a bipod, do NOT try shooting 1000 yds off a bag for support. Verify that your optic has sufficient additional elevation adjustment to reach 1000 yds. If your rifle has a sporter profile barrel it's going to get very hot quickly shooting 30-06. One last tip is buy yourself some type of recoil pad, trust me your going to need it...
 
Great feedback Road Clam.
RR99, can respectively make a different suggest?

Consider borrowing a rifle that has much better ballistics at 1000 yards than the 20th century’s workhorse at 300 yards the .30-06, which was great but the ballistics are not up to par with newer much higher BC rounds.

6.5 Creedmoor, 7mm (many) and others.
That Ruger Precision Rifle is pretty impressive in .308 and 6.5 Cm.

And if money isn’t a problem, :) a semi-auto Barrett .50 BMG M107A1 will easily outshoot your .30-06 at 1,000 AND will be MUCH kinder to your shoulder after 50 rounds than 10 from a bolt .06.
Anyway just an idea.
 
At a minimum, I would use the 175-grain MatchKing bullets. Under no circumstances use the 168-grain MatchKing or its copies by other makers. It has a known dynamic stability problem once it drops below about 1400 fps, and I've seen a dozen people simultaneously getting keyholing and complete misses with them at 800 yards. The 175-grain SMK is the bullet used in military sniper ammo and works fine at all velocities. Tipped MatchKing has a better ballistic coefficient, but it's a secant ogive bullet, and they don't tend to straighten themselves in the gun's throat as well as tangent ogive bullets like the regular MatchKing do. They are also more sensitive to tuning seating depth. Follow Berger's VLD seating depth tuning procedure with them.

I find IMR4064 and Varget both very good accuracy powders with these loads, but you'll get more velocity out of H4350 and good temperature stability to boot. I would see if I could find a good sweet spot with that powder.
 
I shot in 1,000 yard F Class Competition for 6 years, 3 years of which were shot with a .30-06. The absolute best load is a 190gr Sierra MatchKing bullet in Lapua brass using a Fed 210M primer and 60.7gr of RL22 powder. Out of my 26" Krieger MTU contour barrel, I got 2900fps. That's about as flat shooting as you will get with the '06 (30.5 of "up" from a 100 yard zero).

Don
 
Everything start's from somewhere. Where does a 1000 yd load start? Pretty sure they don't load up some ammo to test and take it to the thousand yd range! I'm guessing they also start at the 100yds range but what do they look for at 100yds? If you have a rifle shooting 1/2" at 100yds with good match bullet's, will that get you going out to 1000 yds? Then if that works, Why the need for a match bullet in the first place? Don't get me wrong, I have fooled with long range to 500yds just a bit and love my 6.5 140gr SMK! It does shoot somewhat better than say my 140gr Hornady interlock's. I have a somewhat under standing of the ballistic quality of the higher BC match bullet's but some how think that that higher BC works more for trajectory and wind drift and a well taught shooter could over come that?
 
"...even close to appropriate..." Don't worry about that. Think in terms of having fun. And it's more about things like reading the wind and mirage than the ballistics.
Nosler Accubonds are hunting bullets. Ain't the same thing as Match grade bullets. 168 grain match bullets are for out to 600 yards. Think 175's or 190's for 1,000 yards. IMR4064 is your friend. So is Varget.
Any of this stuff can, and probably will be, negated to some degree if your Savage 110, being a hunting rifle, doesn't have a heavy match grade barrel. Preferably with a 1 in 10 twist.
 
I have a somewhat under standing of the ballistic quality of the higher BC match bullet's but some how think that that higher BC works more for trajectory and wind drift and a well taught shooter could over come that?
Click to expand...

Personally, I don't know of anyone who has overcome wind drift. Trajectory you can account for, but wind is your constant enemy. The higher the BC of the bullet, the LESS the wind hurts you.

Don
 
In reply: thanks TXAZ for the book title I’ll buy a copy today.

Yes the model 110 is a hunting rifle. Rifling twist is 1:10.

The optic options I have are as follows: Vortex diamondback 4 x 12, vortex diamondback 4 x 16, vortex Viper 6.5 x 20. I’m assuming that my vortex 2.5 x 10 would not be appropriate to the task.

TXAZ, when my instructor first approached me about taking this class, one of my first thoughts was, “I’m not sure if I have enough gun for this. “ He assured me that I did.

I guess we’ll find out.

At this point, I’m really just trying to find out where I should start, assuming the cartridge is even capable.

I am considering a bull barrel replacement for my sporter barrel.

As for the possibility of picking up a Barrett, Ha! I wish.

Keep ‘em coming, guys. I’m just over here taking notes.
 
The 06' is historically capable of 1000 yards.
Good enough for Carlos Hathcock.

Lead time for another barrel might set you back 12 weeks or more depending.
If you have a 243 Win you could get the job done with that.

Having shot 600 yard F-Class Open with factory Savage hunting barrel in 7mm-08 i can tell you that barrel's gonna be almost branding iron hot! Lol (seems that hot anyways).

Get a comfy recoil pad that is oversized for your stock, and DON'T cut it down!

Another bullet option may be the Sierra 155gr Palma Match. Haven't tried any myself, others may have.

Oh, and i'd be using your Viper! Get a solid, 1 piece base 20 MOA. And quallity rings.
I use EGW bases, there are others, and either Warne or Vortex rings.

Make sure you bed your stock.
 
Okay so no barrel replacement. This thing happens in about 8 weeks.

So far it looks like the majority favor 175-190 grain match grade projectiles.

And IMR4064/H4350/Varget
 
USSR has given good advice based on actual experience. Forget any bullet lighter than 175/180 gr and if you can get enough speed 190-215 might be better. But you reach a point where the heavier bullets with high BC's just can't be shot fast enough.

Your 22" hunting barrel is just fine for most hunting ranges, but will be somewhat of a handicap when you start pushing things to extremes. The 2900 fps USSR got with 190's in his 26" barrel won't be possible. Just a little over 2800 fps with 180's is pushing things in my 22" 30-06's. But with the right bullet that would get me to 1000.

Flat trajectory simply isn't a concern. You can always adjust the sights for bullet drop. Out to about 1000 yards a 150-155 gr bullet will shoot flatter than the heavier bullets. That is about the point where the better BC's take over. But the lighter bullets become unstable before 1000 yards and are blown around by the wind a lot more.

The 30-06 has been a good option for long range shooting in the past, and today's better bullets make it better than ever. But in 2018 there are simply better options and easier ways to get there.

I wouldn't spend money modifying the 30-06. Take it, use it and see what happens. I think it highly likely that you'll do OK. But you'll reach a point where you'll want to do better. The money spent modifying the rifle you have, and keeping it 30-06, would be better spent on something else more suitable. You might want to use the action and have it re-barreled to something else.

I think you might surprise yourself with the 2-10X scope you have. It isn't ideal, but I'd use it for a while. Once you know more, you'll have a better idea what you really need. I'd rather do that than spend money on something that you later find isn't going to do the job either.
 
After reading through this thread, i'm going to suggest you not handload for your 1K shoot and seek out some factory match ammo with advertised velocities . Reason being is the fact you don't have a known trusted load. If your asking us what bullet and what powder then that's telling me you don't have a current good load. A key factor to proficiently reaching 1K is your barrel's true velocity. If your off by 75 fps on your velocity it's no big deal at say 200 yards, if your off by 75 fps at 1000 yds you might not even be on paper. Do you know the complete courses of fire for this class ? What type of targets are you shooting at ? A standard NRA LR target has a black area that's 6 MOA or 60" in diameter at 1000 yds. If that's your target then a 10X scope will be ok, but if your shooting at smaller steel silhouette gongs and such a 10X scope will be a challenge. I think you will have more fun and be more sucessfull if you shoot factory ammo your first time out. Me personally would run the 20X scope, you can always dial down if you have too much magnification. When I shoot 1K I have a Sightron 8-32x and it's perfect for all types of targets at 1K. (My instructional 1K class at the Sig Academy had us shooting at spray paint rattle cans ) . That was TOUGH !
 
Go shoot with what you already have.

The only exception to that may be the scope base, you most likely do not have enough elevation to get to 1000 yards with your current glass/bases. The easy button to this is Leupold's LR bases, they have 15MOA of elevation built in, and are about the same price as standard bases last time I looked.

Depending on what you are shooting, 10X might be fine. I have shot steel IPSC targets at 1000 yards with a 3.5X PU scope from WW2. Military snipers used fixed 10X for years, and may still.

I have a somewhat under standing of the ballistic quality of the higher BC match bullet's but some how think that that higher BC works more for trajectory and wind drift and a well taught shooter could over come that?
Click to expand...
Well, to some extent. Like USSR said, trajectory doesn't really matter, on a surveyed range at known distance, you put on your dope and you are good to go. Wind is always the challenge, and while it is true a top shooter can overcome it, it is much more art than science, and takes a long time to learn to do well.

As to BC and how it works, the short\simplified\Sesame Street version, some bullets have more drag than others. The lower the drag, the better the bullet retains velocity, and resists the effects of wind. This is expressed at "Ballistic Coefficient" (actually a function of mass, diameter, and drag coefficient). Longer/heavier bullets generally have a higher ballistic coefficient than shorter/lighter ones.

This is why the big magnums are generally better at long range. It is not because of the velocity (but that doesn't hurt) it is just that they can shoot heavier, higher BC bullets.

There are also a few that are a good compromise, and punch above their weight, so to speak, such as the ~140+grain 6.5mm match bullets (and now a couple of recently introduced 7mm VLDs), which beat the ballistics of all but the heaviest .308" bullets, and do it in a non-magnum.

As I am sure you know, all bullets are effected by the wind, and at long range, you must adjust your aim to get a hit. The advantage of the the "better" rounds is you don't adjust as much. The added advantage is when you get the wind call wrong, and you will, you won't be off by as much.

At 1000 yards, You call the wind 60º at 8mph, it is really 90º at 12 mph. Here are a couple examples:

.308 Win, 190 SMK @ 2500 FPS your wind will be off by 4.8 MOA or 50 inches.
6.5-06 140 SMK @ 2900 FPS, your wind will be off by 3.9 MOA, or 40 inches.
.30-378 WbyMag, 240gr SMK @ 2900 FPS your wind will be off by 2.6 MOA, or 27 inches.
50 BMG, 750 AMAX @ 2600 FPS, your wind will be off by 1.7 MOA, or 18 inches.

If it was me, I would look at what is available from the major manufacturers in the 200grain area.

I wouldn't bother modifying the rifle, unless you are looking for an excuse to get a new gun, then go find a varmint type rifle in 6.5 Creedmoor. A couple of easy buttons:
https://www.cabelas.com/product/sho...ge-t-sr-centerfire-rifle/2464333.uts?slotId=2

https://www.cabelas.com/product/sho...dator-bolt-action-rifles/1872705.uts?slotId=0
 
Or a Warne rail with 20 MOA built in.

Shilen makes good barrels as does Criterion and those likely are good enough for that sort of shooting (its not tack driving its all those wind and shooter factors) - barrels are in the $400 range.

Savage action is plenty good for a build like that.

Better stock needed. Trigger pretty good, better if its an acu trigger.

Best power optic you have. I have shot 300 meters with a 30x and its a challenge.
 
30-06 will absolutely get you to 1k yards, relatively easy. folks do it with .308 at about 150 fps slower all the time.

You'll probably want to stick in the 165-168 gr weight class. Others will tell you to go as heavy as possible.
Click to expand...
Count me in the heavier bullet category. Heavier bullets (with a similar profile) = higher bc I'm a given caliber. Velocity is here and then it's gone. BC is like a diamond... It lasts forever (or until the bullet finally hits the ground lol). At least those 174s previously mentioned. There is a reason why it is used as match grade military ammo.
 
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