johnhoward
New member
You win Double Spy. I just can't debate with someone who does not have even a rudementary understanding of the laws of physics and biology.
What .223 for hogs?
- Thread starter rburch
- Start date
What Double Naught Spy said. Not all good deer killing bullets are good hog killers. i've killed wild hogs with the .223. The .223 is marginal for hogs and shots must be picked carefully.
A friend killed several 150-200 pound wild hogs graveyard dead with a .223 and then one ran off like nothing happened. i killed that hog. The hog had a heavy coat of dried mud that caused the bullet to blow up.
i've had several wild hogs drop like rocks at the shot, only to get up in 15 seconds to two minutes and run off. If the hog lies there and screams like a banshee shoot it again because there's a good chance it will run off.
A friend killed several 150-200 pound wild hogs graveyard dead with a .223 and then one ran off like nothing happened. i killed that hog. The hog had a heavy coat of dried mud that caused the bullet to blow up.
i've had several wild hogs drop like rocks at the shot, only to get up in 15 seconds to two minutes and run off. If the hog lies there and screams like a banshee shoot it again because there's a good chance it will run off.
johnhoward
New member
Thullub
You and double spy are talking "Individual experience" and I am talking science. We are not even talking the same language here, but you guys don't seem to be aware of that.
For example; I am saying things like, "The law of gravity is universal and constant and pulls equally on all objects". You guys are trying to counter with arguments like, "I felt lighter yesterday, so I guess that means that there was less gravity"
Your are pitting your individual experiences against the established universal laws of physics, such as Mass, Density, Inertia and Velocity.
There are many factors of chaos that can occur on a hunt that are outside the realm of predictability and may effect the outcome, resulting in the varying experiences of individual hunters. But these factors of chaos do not negate, subvert or overrule the established laws of physics.
If that last statement left you confused, let me give you an example of talking about.
Let's pretend for a moment that you posted a question asking if a 300 WinMag was a good round to hunt Axis deer with. Let's pretend that someone came on here and stated the technical power specifications and capacities of a 300 Winmag. Then, let's say that I came on and recounted my real life experience where I tracked an Axis deer that had been wounded by a 300 WinMag (by another hunter) and the deer did not die for three days, and I used that as evidence to make the statement that a 300 WinMag was not adequate to hunt Axis deer with.
That would be irritating right? Everyone here knows that a 300 WinMag is way more then enough power to kill a little Axis deer. But if I were to insist, based on my own experience, that it was not, you would be irritated by that, because I am not dealing with facts, I am judging reality by my own personal subjective experience.
When it comes to killing pigs, you need a bullet that has both good expansion and penetration. The PowerMax is better in this department then a lot of other soft point 223 ammo because of the bonded technology that keeps the jacket from separating from the lead core, like it does in regular soft point ammo. These factors are not effected by what type of animal you are shooting. It is the simple laws of physics in control; Mass + Velocity = Inertia. If a bullet can retain it's mass upon entering an animal, this will give it more inertia to travel farther, thus providing deeper penetration. It simple science, and science ALWAYS trumps "Individual Experience".
Of course if you want to ignorantly argue that because the box that the ammo came in does not contain the word "HOG" that this somehow changes and subverts the laws of physics (like Double Spy did), go ahead and join that group of hicks that are convinced the world is flat, the sun revolves around the earth and man never walked on the moon. But I think you are smarter then that, so I doubt you will do that.
You and double spy are talking "Individual experience" and I am talking science. We are not even talking the same language here, but you guys don't seem to be aware of that.
For example; I am saying things like, "The law of gravity is universal and constant and pulls equally on all objects". You guys are trying to counter with arguments like, "I felt lighter yesterday, so I guess that means that there was less gravity"
Your are pitting your individual experiences against the established universal laws of physics, such as Mass, Density, Inertia and Velocity.
There are many factors of chaos that can occur on a hunt that are outside the realm of predictability and may effect the outcome, resulting in the varying experiences of individual hunters. But these factors of chaos do not negate, subvert or overrule the established laws of physics.
If that last statement left you confused, let me give you an example of talking about.
Let's pretend for a moment that you posted a question asking if a 300 WinMag was a good round to hunt Axis deer with. Let's pretend that someone came on here and stated the technical power specifications and capacities of a 300 Winmag. Then, let's say that I came on and recounted my real life experience where I tracked an Axis deer that had been wounded by a 300 WinMag (by another hunter) and the deer did not die for three days, and I used that as evidence to make the statement that a 300 WinMag was not adequate to hunt Axis deer with.
That would be irritating right? Everyone here knows that a 300 WinMag is way more then enough power to kill a little Axis deer. But if I were to insist, based on my own experience, that it was not, you would be irritated by that, because I am not dealing with facts, I am judging reality by my own personal subjective experience.
When it comes to killing pigs, you need a bullet that has both good expansion and penetration. The PowerMax is better in this department then a lot of other soft point 223 ammo because of the bonded technology that keeps the jacket from separating from the lead core, like it does in regular soft point ammo. These factors are not effected by what type of animal you are shooting. It is the simple laws of physics in control; Mass + Velocity = Inertia. If a bullet can retain it's mass upon entering an animal, this will give it more inertia to travel farther, thus providing deeper penetration. It simple science, and science ALWAYS trumps "Individual Experience".
Of course if you want to ignorantly argue that because the box that the ammo came in does not contain the word "HOG" that this somehow changes and subverts the laws of physics (like Double Spy did), go ahead and join that group of hicks that are convinced the world is flat, the sun revolves around the earth and man never walked on the moon. But I think you are smarter then that, so I doubt you will do that.
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Double Naught Spy
New member
No sir. You have extrapolated an extremely limited amount of testing on the wrong animal type (deer) and proclaimed the results valid for application on a different animal type (hogs) with absolutely no actual knowledge of how it will perform on hogs. If you want to call that science, then it is poor science.
Come back after you have shot some hogs, preferably a variety including some big boars.
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Hogs aren't near as hard to kill as people think. I did it with .223 but, I got close and picked my shots. Most of them with a mini14
Now, I don't hunt at my point in life, right now. I moved a couple of years ago and I will hunt in the future.
I plan on returning to pig hunting in the future.
I've built an upper for when I return to pig hunting, It is 6.8. Many consider hunting pigs with .223 unethical, I do not think it is unethical if you do it properly. I only built the upper to be operate above the magic .24 caliber threshold. In other words, I'm doing to make others feel better about it, not me.
There's lots of ways to hunt and shoot improperly, there's lots of calibers that work if you hunt properly with the caliber.
I hunt close, I don't need a bigger gun. People that hunt at a distance need a different gun.
It's fairly simple; hunt with your chosen cartridge, hunt well with your chosen cartridge, you are ending a life, do it respectfully. Work within the parameters of your gun and you, it will work.
Now, I don't hunt at my point in life, right now. I moved a couple of years ago and I will hunt in the future.
I plan on returning to pig hunting in the future.
I've built an upper for when I return to pig hunting, It is 6.8. Many consider hunting pigs with .223 unethical, I do not think it is unethical if you do it properly. I only built the upper to be operate above the magic .24 caliber threshold. In other words, I'm doing to make others feel better about it, not me.
There's lots of ways to hunt and shoot improperly, there's lots of calibers that work if you hunt properly with the caliber.
I hunt close, I don't need a bigger gun. People that hunt at a distance need a different gun.
It's fairly simple; hunt with your chosen cartridge, hunt well with your chosen cartridge, you are ending a life, do it respectfully. Work within the parameters of your gun and you, it will work.
I could list a bunch of calibers I've shot hogs with, from muzzleloaders to old Winchester calibers and on and on. This one was with a plain old 55 gr. fmj out of an AR-15. Placement seems to be a major key with these smaller calibers, but putting the shot into this shoulder area seems to take them right down. A guy can site all the scientific evidence he wants, but good shot placement and experience seems to work for some of us. The majority of mine are shot with a 6.5 lately, but I would not think twice about hauling out a 223 again...without any fancy bullets in it.
I don't know if I'd consider them to be thin skinned really, but the skin is maybe a little tougher than deer and such. More of an obstacle is probably the muscle around the shoulders and upper areas....these guys are pretty serious about getting out and working for a living and get pretty buffed. Given the small diameter of the 223 and speed of it, penetration is not really an issue.
Model12Win
Moderator
I personally prefer a 7.62 NATO or 7.62 Russian for hogs, but if I HAD to use a .223/5.56 I'd use a bonded heavy weight bullet.
Sure Shot Mc Gee
New member
Other than a FMJ anything bullet weight 223 is capable of downing hog with a single well placed shot in my estimation.
Sure shot, I am having trouble with your wording, are you saying FMJ .223 is not going to take down a hog? If so check out post #27 and see two of the many who have fallen to a fmj at Stony's place. Other than my 300 Blackout rifles that is the only .223, bullet I use on hogs.
CombatDiver
Inactive
300 AAC BLK is the caliber of choice for me but like many have already said, anyone size stone will work if thrown straight and hard enough.