Were shrouded hammers just a fad?

[tulsamal]

They certainly serve a purpose and work in their dedicated way. I do not care for them as I do not like having a revolver that can not be thumbcocked for single-action fire.

1) I agree that single action is nice for a range gun. But I just don't see it as a requirement for a CCW gun. Everybody wants to quote the stats that the "average gunfight" sees 2.7 rounds fired and takes place at less than 7 yards. How does single action capability fit into that? Even worse, the "average" criminal attack takes place in a very short period of time and in dim light. This is not the conditions you need for "precision aimed fire." It would be a _very_ rare civilian shooting where a precise shot in single action would be the appropriate action. It is _far_ more likely that the civilian will cock the hammer "because he does that at the range" and then fire a shot when he didn't mean to do so. Or at least that is what the attorney for the deceased will say at the civil trial.

2) And single action fire doesn't have to be any better than aimed double action fire anyway. If we went to the range and got out the sandbags and 25 yard targets, I'm willing to bet my five shot groups out of my 6" Ruger Security Six will be the _exact_ same in single or double action. I've used that double action thousands of times and "the feel" is very well known to my trigger finger and brain. I've made some amazing shots with that revolver in double action even with single hand unsupported. I even won a small bet one time by cleaning the hostage targets we had set up at 50 feet with it standing, one hand unsupported, _weak hand._

DA is all you need for personal defense. It is safer under stress. Single action can actually be a liability. And DA is capable of wonderful accuracy if you spend the time mastering it.

Gregg

 

[XavierBreath]

DA is all you need for personal defense. It is safer under stress.....

I will have to respectfully disagree with you. DA may be all you feel you need for personal defense, but others may feel differently. Some people like options. This statement is dangerously similar to "all an honest man needs is ten rounds in his magazine," I'm sure you recall that one, Bill Ruger's contribution to the AWB.

If you are holding someone at gunpoint, whether in SA or DA, I hope you have a badge. As a civilian, it becomes a non-issue because the gun should not be drawn unless the criteria for lethal force are met.

Now back to the discussion.....Are shrouded hammers just a fad?

 

[tulsamal]

I will have to respectfully disagree with you.

That's fine but remember you aren't just "disagreeing with one guy in Oklahoma." There are a heck of a lot of professionals out there that have decided DAO is really the best way to go.

And you didn't address my second point. If there is even a _possibility_ that single action capability can actually be a liability, it only makes sense to retain it if there is _some decent chance_ it adds to the utility of the CCW revolver. And that utility just isn't there in one shooting out of a thousand. Especially when you consider DA aimed fire can be just as accurate as single action. It just takes some dedicated practice. A lot of dry firing at the TV can help both you and the action of the gun.

Gregg

 

[tulsamal]

If you are holding someone at gunpoint, whether in SA or DA, I hope you have a badge. As a civilian, it becomes a non-issue because the gun should not be drawn unless the criteria for lethal force are met.

And what EXACTLY is this supposed to mean?! If I stop a bad guy from killing me, I'm only allowed to either kill him or let him go?! No "holding him" for the police unless I AM the police? What about some bad guy I find in my house? It takes the sheriff at LEAST 20 minutes to get out to my house. So I should just go ahead and shoot the bad guy or let him go? That's my two choices?

The latest issue of Combat Handguns has a case where the woman sat there and held a bad guy at gunpoint for an HOUR before the cops showed up. She had them on the phone but it took a long time for the good guys to show up. Guess they had something more important to do. The lady didn't have a badge so I guess she should have just let the intruder leave?

That's not the way we do things down here in Oklahoma!

Gregg

 

[Tacoma]

Jeez, I was hopeing that somebody with a 638 would join in and praise it so much that I would need to go order one this week! Anybody?? Please?!?!

 

[Detective_Special]

M38

Don't have a 638, but I do have a Model 38 Bodyguard. Small, light, reasonably powerful, accurate, shoots at POA. It also has a more comfortable grip due to it's shroud which lets you grip the gun a little higher. It's also a take anywhere type of gun. I'm sure that the 638 is just as good, if not better.

 

[harbinger]

I have the Model 38 Bodyguard as well. It's one of my favorite firearms. That fact was reinforced 20 minutes ago at the grocery store when my wife and I were loading up the car and some odd looking guy just came up to us and made conversation about my beat up Jeep and where I could get parts for it real cheap. Was quite comfy with one hand in my jacket pocket, hanging on to that little humpback.

 

[XavierBreath]

That's fine but remember you aren't just "disagreeing with one guy in Oklahoma." There are a heck of a lot of professionals out there that have decided DAO is really the best way to go.

A lot of so called professionals also think the 1911 is a liability, and many so called professionals would like to see the civilian populace disarmed. I respectfully disagree with them as well.

I don't feel a need to argue your second point. I shoot DA just fine, but I also like the option of SA, if for no other reason than to see if my DA shooting is as good as it can be.

Holding people at gun point is very dangerous business, both legally and physically. I have held people at gunpoint, and as a civilian, I would either let them go or stop the threat. You can hold people at gunpoint if you choose, frankly, I don't care, as long as it's not me or my children.

This thread is being derailed by this argument, and I will not respond any further on this thread. If you want to argue these points, I suggest you start a new thread. You will find many viewpoints.

Good day,
XB

 

[FirstFreedom]

Yeah, I meant, are they getting less popular, as opposed to either standard (open) OR *fully* enclosed, like a centennial. So. LAK, SA is still possible if the hammer is just shrouded. Like people say, versatile.

 

[Catbird]

Tacoma commented:

Jeez, I was hopeing that somebody with a 638 would join in and praise it so much that I would need to go order one this week! Anybody?? Please?!?!

Hopefully, I'll be able to accomodate your request in a couple of days. I've been wanting a 638 for a long time. My dealer got a couple of them in and is selling them for $400 each. A tad more than I want to pay, but oh, what the heck!