Bob Lee Swagger
New member
Have none of you guys seen Reservoir Dogs? 
Wanted to know about dealing with carjackings...
- Thread starter Epyon
- Start date
Johannesburg is the carjacking capital of the world. I worked in Johannesburg and often drove a car at night, doing shifts. I was always armed.
The carjackings became so frequent that many hospital staff members were taking specialized 'anti-hijacking' courses (that's what they call it in SA, hijacking). The perpetrators are called hijackers, but I call them goblins.
I completed one of those courses in 2002. They had a vehicle on the range, and we fired from inside the car and from outside. This was done with a driver only and also with a passenger.
Here is what I found:
1) As another poster said, it is better not to stop somewhere where you can be surprised, boxed in or made to drive the vehicle where it is in a vulnerable position. This means you need good following distances, you are better off in an outside lane, and it is good practice to 'time' the traffic lights so that you catch them green.
2) A goblin can approach the car in the driver's blindspot. By the time the driver sees the goblin, it is too late and the goblin has the drop on the driver. The cure for this is to get one of those small blindspot mirrors and place that on the lower inside corner of the side mirror. Check all of your mirrors frequently!
3) Whether you are wearing a seat belt or not, it is very difficult to draw quickly from an IWB holster (that's the only one I personally tried). Another trainee found it difficult to draw from an OWB holster. Any draw that has a rearward elbow movement can be impeded by the car seat.
4) If you're going to draw, you either have to do it very early in the encounter (before he gets the drop on you) or very late (as you are getting out the car or unclipping the seat belt). If you think you can out draw the goblin who is already at the driver's side window and has the drop on you, think again. If he is at the window already, and he has his gun drawn, you are in big trouble. You will be better off gunning the engine than trying to draw and pop the goblin.
5) If the goblin is experienced (and you have to assume that he is), then if you make any move whilst in the vehicle that doesn't fit in with a dude trying to take off his seat belt and get out of the car, you are going to get shot. In South Africa that means any kind of reach on the right hip, since the driver sits on the right and his seat belt release is on the left hip side. You have no business reaching low right, low centre or high left. The only logical place therefore (according to my experiments) to have the gun is low left.
6) I found that the best method of securing the gun was under my left thigh. yep, almost sitting on it. Only the grip is exposed on the left. If the goblin looks sharp and he has the drop on you, you might actually decide to ditch the gun between the seat and the centre console as you undo the seat belt and move to get out. You've still got the option to draw it after you release the seat belt, but I guess it would depend on whether you thought you could win or not.
7) In South Africa, I am resigned to left hand draw and fire and I practised that on the range, from within a vehicle. It wasn't my vehicle. The only practice I had in my vehicle was drawing and pointing. On one occasion I drew for real but didn't let the pedestrian see the pistol.
8) I found that the first time I fired from inside the car, with a passenger who was also firing (left hand seat, right side ejection port) I was distracted by brass landing on the roof and rolling down the windscreen.
9) If the goblin hasn't drawn level with the driver's side window yet, you can move pretty quickly and get out and shoot if you can't move the car. This is the sort of scenario where you have come home, the car is parked in the driveway and then the goblin makes his move.
10) in SA many hijackings happen when pulling out of the driveway or stopping at the gate when coming home. Many homeowners cut down hedges and bushes near the gate, or made sure they had an electric opener and didn't have to stop at all. There is a lot to be said for having good visibility of your yard, and of course good lighting in your driveway and outside your house on the street. Remember, goblins are like roaches and prefer to do their dirty deeds in the dark.
11) If you are really extreme, you can get a Blaster-type system, but I think in many places you will get into trouble for cooking someone like that, even if he is a goblin with a gun at your window.
If you take a car on the range and go through some scenarios, then take my advice:
a) Expect massive bruising on the underside of your right thigh (if it is a right hand drive vehicle) if you do a lot scenarios where you have to get out of the car in a hurry. When we were finished that course, we all had massive bruises and the pain was pretty good the next day.
b) Do not be tempted to rest your bare forearms between the windshield frame and the door frame when the vehicle is stopped and the door is open, and you are firing a Ruger Super Redhawk. That rubber on the windshield and door seal may look soft and feel soft at first, but it can cause serious scratches
The carjackings became so frequent that many hospital staff members were taking specialized 'anti-hijacking' courses (that's what they call it in SA, hijacking). The perpetrators are called hijackers, but I call them goblins.
I completed one of those courses in 2002. They had a vehicle on the range, and we fired from inside the car and from outside. This was done with a driver only and also with a passenger.
Here is what I found:
1) As another poster said, it is better not to stop somewhere where you can be surprised, boxed in or made to drive the vehicle where it is in a vulnerable position. This means you need good following distances, you are better off in an outside lane, and it is good practice to 'time' the traffic lights so that you catch them green.
2) A goblin can approach the car in the driver's blindspot. By the time the driver sees the goblin, it is too late and the goblin has the drop on the driver. The cure for this is to get one of those small blindspot mirrors and place that on the lower inside corner of the side mirror. Check all of your mirrors frequently!
3) Whether you are wearing a seat belt or not, it is very difficult to draw quickly from an IWB holster (that's the only one I personally tried). Another trainee found it difficult to draw from an OWB holster. Any draw that has a rearward elbow movement can be impeded by the car seat.
4) If you're going to draw, you either have to do it very early in the encounter (before he gets the drop on you) or very late (as you are getting out the car or unclipping the seat belt). If you think you can out draw the goblin who is already at the driver's side window and has the drop on you, think again. If he is at the window already, and he has his gun drawn, you are in big trouble. You will be better off gunning the engine than trying to draw and pop the goblin.
5) If the goblin is experienced (and you have to assume that he is), then if you make any move whilst in the vehicle that doesn't fit in with a dude trying to take off his seat belt and get out of the car, you are going to get shot. In South Africa that means any kind of reach on the right hip, since the driver sits on the right and his seat belt release is on the left hip side. You have no business reaching low right, low centre or high left. The only logical place therefore (according to my experiments) to have the gun is low left.
6) I found that the best method of securing the gun was under my left thigh. yep, almost sitting on it. Only the grip is exposed on the left. If the goblin looks sharp and he has the drop on you, you might actually decide to ditch the gun between the seat and the centre console as you undo the seat belt and move to get out. You've still got the option to draw it after you release the seat belt, but I guess it would depend on whether you thought you could win or not.
7) In South Africa, I am resigned to left hand draw and fire and I practised that on the range, from within a vehicle. It wasn't my vehicle. The only practice I had in my vehicle was drawing and pointing. On one occasion I drew for real but didn't let the pedestrian see the pistol.
8) I found that the first time I fired from inside the car, with a passenger who was also firing (left hand seat, right side ejection port) I was distracted by brass landing on the roof and rolling down the windscreen.
9) If the goblin hasn't drawn level with the driver's side window yet, you can move pretty quickly and get out and shoot if you can't move the car. This is the sort of scenario where you have come home, the car is parked in the driveway and then the goblin makes his move.
10) in SA many hijackings happen when pulling out of the driveway or stopping at the gate when coming home. Many homeowners cut down hedges and bushes near the gate, or made sure they had an electric opener and didn't have to stop at all. There is a lot to be said for having good visibility of your yard, and of course good lighting in your driveway and outside your house on the street. Remember, goblins are like roaches and prefer to do their dirty deeds in the dark.
11) If you are really extreme, you can get a Blaster-type system, but I think in many places you will get into trouble for cooking someone like that, even if he is a goblin with a gun at your window.
If you take a car on the range and go through some scenarios, then take my advice:
a) Expect massive bruising on the underside of your right thigh (if it is a right hand drive vehicle) if you do a lot scenarios where you have to get out of the car in a hurry. When we were finished that course, we all had massive bruises and the pain was pretty good the next day.
b) Do not be tempted to rest your bare forearms between the windshield frame and the door frame when the vehicle is stopped and the door is open, and you are firing a Ruger Super Redhawk. That rubber on the windshield and door seal may look soft and feel soft at first, but it can cause serious scratches
I had a really cool custom mustang in Hawaii. What I learned was if the locals weren't trying to steal it, the cops were writing bu...... tickets for speeding. It came down to either a very good alarm, which I had, and was the only reason I had the car, or I needed someone to ride shotgun, and watch the car while I did anything I wanted to do.
In other words, I agree with the above, that a nice car is a target, and, if you can't afford someone to ride shotgun, you can't afford the car.
Have a beater, and, for nice drives, and nice places, a nice car...
In other words, I agree with the above, that a nice car is a target, and, if you can't afford someone to ride shotgun, you can't afford the car.
Have a beater, and, for nice drives, and nice places, a nice car...
Odd Job,
Thanks for some good tips, boet. I live in Dar es Salaam, which is probably one of the safest and most peaceful major cities of sub-Saharan Africa, but we do have some goblins here as well (although not nearly as many as Jo-burg or many other places). I met a guy some years back who worked fitting shelves for pick and pay/checkers etc in Jo-burg, who claimed to have been hijacked seven or eight times and had been shot twice. I asked him why he didnt leave, to which he replied that that was the reason he came up here.
I do like most of you: Drive an old clunker, keep my eyes open, stay out of trouble spots and try to maintain a safe distance. Traffic being somewhat aggressive here, its not always easy to keep far enough behind the car in front of you without some motorhead squeezing in right in front of you, but I try not to get upset and figure its better getting home a few minutes late than not at all. Likewise, I avoid the overtaking lane as much as I can. Too many cars driving in the opposite direction there.
One thing I dont have is air conditioning, which means I drive with the windows down (African AC: two speeds - one window down or both). A lot of people have pointed out how foolish this is, and I suppose they are right in a way. On the other hand, the open windows allow you to hear, smell and "feel" whats going on around you in a way you dont get sitting in an air conditioned cocoon with the radio on. Beggars, even aggressive ones, can be spoken to and reasoned with. You can easily start talking to someone else on the street and explain the problem you are having with the guy who wont get out of your way/wont stop washing your windscreen/tried to reach into your car. And if something really nasty happened, like a shooting/hijack, I dont think a window being up or down would make much difference.
As for carry (if and when I do carry), I sometimes take it out of the 3:30 o'clock IWB and put it on my left, where the seatbelt unfastens if I think trouble is brewing, but I would hate to try shooting right handed, towards the right, sitting in the right hand drive vehicle. Very awkward indeed, I should think.
My night watchmen know the sound of my car and I live on a street where there are precious few cars, so they normally have the gate open when I get there.
B.A.
Thanks for some good tips, boet. I live in Dar es Salaam, which is probably one of the safest and most peaceful major cities of sub-Saharan Africa, but we do have some goblins here as well (although not nearly as many as Jo-burg or many other places). I met a guy some years back who worked fitting shelves for pick and pay/checkers etc in Jo-burg, who claimed to have been hijacked seven or eight times and had been shot twice. I asked him why he didnt leave, to which he replied that that was the reason he came up here.
I do like most of you: Drive an old clunker, keep my eyes open, stay out of trouble spots and try to maintain a safe distance. Traffic being somewhat aggressive here, its not always easy to keep far enough behind the car in front of you without some motorhead squeezing in right in front of you, but I try not to get upset and figure its better getting home a few minutes late than not at all. Likewise, I avoid the overtaking lane as much as I can. Too many cars driving in the opposite direction there.
One thing I dont have is air conditioning, which means I drive with the windows down (African AC: two speeds - one window down or both). A lot of people have pointed out how foolish this is, and I suppose they are right in a way. On the other hand, the open windows allow you to hear, smell and "feel" whats going on around you in a way you dont get sitting in an air conditioned cocoon with the radio on. Beggars, even aggressive ones, can be spoken to and reasoned with. You can easily start talking to someone else on the street and explain the problem you are having with the guy who wont get out of your way/wont stop washing your windscreen/tried to reach into your car. And if something really nasty happened, like a shooting/hijack, I dont think a window being up or down would make much difference.
As for carry (if and when I do carry), I sometimes take it out of the 3:30 o'clock IWB and put it on my left, where the seatbelt unfastens if I think trouble is brewing, but I would hate to try shooting right handed, towards the right, sitting in the right hand drive vehicle. Very awkward indeed, I should think.
My night watchmen know the sound of my car and I live on a street where there are precious few cars, so they normally have the gate open when I get there.
B.A.
"Johannesburg is the carjacking capital of the world. I worked in Johannesburg and often drove a car at night, doing shifts. I was always armed."
The most frightened I ever have been in a car was when I was working in South Africa for 5 months and driving around lost in Johannesburg at 5 am. It was dark, and I was the only white face around. I wasn't about to stop and ask directions. Fortunately, I had a compass on my watch and knew from a map that I had to drive south. Either I would find my way back to the highway and to the airport or I would be found as a skeleton at some dead-end street. I found a convenience store and they directed me to the highway.
The rules I learned:
Keep windows up and doors locked.
Leave enough room between you and the car in front so that you can dart out even if you have to run the traffic light (robot in SA).
Leave nothing of value or that may look valuable on the seat.
The worst part for me was that just when I needed a firearm the most, I could carry one.
I will shortly be off again to SA for a few months, but this time in a rural area in Northwest Province. And again, I won't be able to be armed.
Ron
The most frightened I ever have been in a car was when I was working in South Africa for 5 months and driving around lost in Johannesburg at 5 am. It was dark, and I was the only white face around. I wasn't about to stop and ask directions. Fortunately, I had a compass on my watch and knew from a map that I had to drive south. Either I would find my way back to the highway and to the airport or I would be found as a skeleton at some dead-end street. I found a convenience store and they directed me to the highway.
The rules I learned:
Keep windows up and doors locked.
Leave enough room between you and the car in front so that you can dart out even if you have to run the traffic light (robot in SA).
Leave nothing of value or that may look valuable on the seat.
The worst part for me was that just when I needed a firearm the most, I could carry one.
I will shortly be off again to SA for a few months, but this time in a rural area in Northwest Province. And again, I won't be able to be armed.
Ron