WA State Pistol Concealment Rules/laws

[Ishyid]

So im think of getting my first pistol and was curious about the rules or concealment laws in washington state. Is it legal to carry? Is it a open carry state? Can you get in trouble if someone sees the weapon? Any laws of weather it can be a loaded weapon? So pretty much the whole scope. Haha. So please let me know what you all know about anything about this.

Thanks,
Joshua

 

[alfack]

Washington is a "shall issue" state, meaning that if you pass the background check and cough up the $ they will give you a cwp. Open carry is also legal, but a good way to get harassed everywhere you go.

 

[RickB]

The laws of weather, is that it almost always rains.

 

[spacecoast]

http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/washington.pdf

 

[gearchecker]

Idaho resident with a Washington CPL

I'm living over near Coeur d'Alene and travel over to Spokane and Seattle quite a bit. My Idaho CWL isn't recognized in WA, so I had to get a WA Permit to carry there. It took about an hour to drive over to the Spokane City Hall and about a half hour to fill out the paperwork and give them my money for my CPL. I think it cost $60 or so. Another hour drive home and that was it. Somewhere around 4-5 weeks later I had my WA permit in hand and I laminated it that night.
Super simple, and not too time consuming. You'll be fingerprinted where you apply for the permit. Spokane is done on a computer scanning plate so no ink on your fingers. Seattle does it that way too last I heard. Some of the smaller population counties still use ink since the scanner for fingerprints is high tech by their standards, and pretty expensive too. The staff at the licensing offices are extremely polite and helpful from all of my experiences working with them over the past few years.

Hope to see a post soon that tells us you have your permit in hand.

Washington is an open carry state and it's not uncommon to see people carrying openly. Down on the piers in Seattle it's commonplace to see people carrying open/semi-concealed and concealed once you know what to look for. I've been traffic stopped twice while carrying in WA, and the LEO's just asked me not to make any sudden moves (duh!). I made sure thy knew right away that I was carrying loaded, so there wouldn't be any surprises later.
Both times they asked what I was carrying and where it was located. Other than that they never even mentioned it again.

I'm pretty sure you are required to let any LEO that pulls you over in a traffic stop that you are carrying. That is, if you are.

Regards,
gearchecker

 

[NavyLT]

Open carry is also legal, but a good way to get harassed everywhere you go.

Complete and total FUD! :barf:

So im think of getting my first pistol and was curious about the rules or concealment laws in washington state. Is it legal to carry?

Yes. However, it is illegal to conceal a gun on the person, without a CPL (Concealed Pistol License). It is also to illegal to carry a loaded gun in a vehicle without a CPL. Without a CPL, an unloaded handgun may be carried anywhere in the vehicle so long as it is not concealed on the person. Without a CPL, a loaded or unloaded handgun may be carried outside the vehicle, so long as it is not concealed.

Is it a open carry state?

Absolutely. And we have one of the strongest state preemption laws in the country. Local cities and counties are prohibited by state law from banning any type of carry/possession of firearms beyond what state law already does.

Can you get in trouble if someone sees the weapon?

Have a small minority of people been arrested simply because someone saw them carrying a gun? YES. Have those cases been thrown out in court? YES. Do almost all of the LEO's in Washington know that open carry is legal and will NOT harrass a person for only openly carrying, even if they get a MWAG call? YES.

The actual law states that it is illegal to carry a gun in a manner, under circumstances, and at a time and place that either manifests an intent to intimidate or that WARRANTS alarm. The WA Supreme Court has upheld and ruled that a holstered firearm does not WARRANT alarm. The WA Supreme Court has also ruled that even a gun carried in the hand is not in violation of the law IF all of the other elements of the statute are not met as well.

In other words, according to the WA State Supreme Court, a person can carry a gun down the street in their hand and NOT be in violation of the law if their finger is not on the trigger, if they are not at an unusual location at an unusual time and if the gun is not pointed at anyone. See State v. Spencer. (BTW, Spencer was a convicted felon carrying two rifles down the street in his arms on a Sunday afternoon and the WA Supreme Court found him NOT GUILTY of "brandishing" a firearm!)

Any laws of weather it can be a loaded weapon?

You cannot have a loaded handgun anywhere in a vehicle without a CPL. You cannot have a loaded rifle/shotgun anywhere in a vehicle with or without a CPL.
You cannot conceal a handgun on the person without a CPL, regardless of if the handgun is loaded or not.
Open carry, outside a vehicle, is legal without a CPL, whether or not the gun is loaded.

So pretty much the whole scope.

Pretty much the whole scope can be had by reading this:

http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=3385&d=1280151535

Here is more info:
http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?131-Washington

I'm pretty sure you are required to let any LEO that pulls you over in a traffic stop that you are carrying.

No requirement exists in the state law.

 

[Scattergun Bob]

Joshua

Welcome to the world of handguns,

I have lots and lots of people here on the east side of the state who ask many of the same questions. There are true gray areas in the interpretation of the RCW (revised code of the state of Washington). My stock response is as follows: Firearms ownership is a RIGHT and a RESPONCIBILITY, our forefathers codified the RIGHT, it is up to each of use to exercise the RESPONSCIBILITY to understand and live within the limits of reasonable men. I my humble opinion this means you must educate yourself to the things you can not due with your new handgun, anything else not specifically prohibited you are FREE to do.


I always recommend Dave Workmen's Book Washington Gun Rights and Responsibilities, the web site is below http://www.danddgunleather.com/pages/washington_gun_rights.htm

This is not a know all / end all reference since Dave is not a criminal lawyer, however he is very knowledgeable on our laws and spends considerable time in research. He is also very readable.


Here is the website for current Washington State Law, I value this site and use it frequently in my teaching. Self Awareness of what the code actually says is is in my mind a key to correct comportment.

Chapter 9.41 RCW Firearms and dangerous weapons
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=9.41&full=true

There are other places to look for additional laws and prohibitions, Dave spells those out in his book. As Navy LT noted there is also a body of decisions by the judiciary clarifying the RCW.

A last thought for you, if you do all of this work, you might know MORE than the rookie street officer. So please never argue with the cops about guns, comply and later you will have the time to prove your point.

Good Luck & Stay Safe

 

[alfack]

Originally Posted by NavyLT
Complete and total FUD! :barf:

Really? Barf? WTFE!. I guess that's easy for you to say, if you live in Oak Harbor. Try open carrying in Bellevue or downtown Seattle. You NEVER see folks open carry there.

 

[NavyLT]

Try open carrying in Bellevue or downtown Seattle. You NEVER see folks open carry there.

Have you ever open carried? My friends and I do all the time, in Bellevue, Tacoma, Spokane, Seattle, SEATAC <- yes, the airport, all over the state.

 

[NavyLT]

Hey! Look who's in the background? It's a group of Seattle's finest PD!

Seriously, alfack, you need to get out and try the water in the pool. There's nothing like a good taste of freedom.

 

[NavyLT]

OMG! Is he in a bank?!?

 

[alfack]

Ok, but I can count on one finger how many times I've seen someone open carrying around here and he was being harassed in Dennys. I'm glad you are exercising your rights. I'm all for it.

 

[oldkim]

Washington CPL

In Washington it's called a CPL - conceal pistol license.

Cost to get one is $55.25
http://www.dol.wa.gov/business/firearms/faconceal.html

The above link will give you the basics of how to apply, common questions and requirements. No class needed to apply (unlike some states that require some safety instruction).

For those new to conceal carry I strongly recommend this book that covers most common questions (from a legal standpoint).
http://www.danddgunleather.com/pages/washington_gun_rights.htm

You can purchase this book from most gun shops in the Seattle area.

If you have any questions let me know.

 

[NavyLT]

A last thought for you, if you do all of this work, you might know MORE than the rookie street officer. So please never argue with the cops about guns, comply and later you will have the time to prove your point.

I must respectfully disagree with this. There is no reason to allow a police officer to deprive you of your rights because THEY either do not know the law, or THEY are trying to get you to comply with what their opinion is. IF an encounter goes something along the lines of:

COP: "Hey you!"
LAC (Law Abiding Citizen): "Yes?"
COP: "What's that?"
LAC: "Ummm... a gun?"
COP: "You got a permit for that?"
LAC: "Yes."
COP: "Let me see that permit and your driver's license too."
LAC: "OK."
COP: "You can't carry that gun like that."
LAC: "Like what?"
COP: "Out in the open for everyone to see. People will get afraid and freak out. You have a CPL, you need to cover that up."
LAC: "OK."
COP: "Have a nice day, and don't let me see you carrying it that way again or next time I will arrest you."

So what has been accomplished by complying with the officer? The above encounter is the most common of the few that I have heard about in the last two years.

 

[Scattergun Bob]

NavyLT

And yet in your own example the contact ended in the individual walking free, If he chooses he can file with IA. He could ask for a meeting with the head of that department to get a clarification. He could also contact a lawyer and demand redress.

The point I am trying to make is that all of this could be done without wearing additional jewelry, becoming aware of the accommodations available in the back seat of a Crown Vic, or putting up with heaving drunks in the holding tank. I would rather argue the point out side of the focus of a street officer.

You and I in the past were at odds concerning this point, I truly respect your input, and determination to stand your ground. I am simply taking the easy path, don't fight with cops in the street, fight with the judge in a courtroom.

In Great Respect, Bob

 

[BluesBear]

If you are excercising your RIGHT of open carry in Washington State it does not matter one iota if you have a permit or not. NO permit is needed to carry openly. So when a Police Officer asks if you have a permit ask him/her for what? Unless you are driving you are probably doing nothing that requires a permit.

I have only been approached ONCE in five years of open carry and when asked if I had a permit I replied, "I don't believe a permit is needed for open carry is it officer?" His response was, "No". So I said why are you asking. He said, "Well if you have a permit you can cover that up." My reply was, "But I don't want to cover it up. Is that a problem?" He said. Of course not sir. Have a nice evening." This was in Pioneer Square, Seattle, August 2008. He was cautious but polite and once he figured out I wasn't some looney tune walking around he was okay with me.

My biggest hassle was in, of all places, Cabela's right off I-5. Several of us from OpenCarry.org attended their grand opening. I was there the second day they were open and no one said a word. Even with a heavy uniformed police presence for crowd control no one said a thing. However a week later I was there again and a salesman in the Gun Library approached me and told me I had to cover my tool. I informed him that open carry was legal in Washington. He said he knew that but company policy forbid it. I politely but firmly informed him that he was wrong. That Cabela's Cprporate policy was to follw state law. He said I would have to leave if I didn't conceal my revolver.
So, being the smartalec that I am, I reached into my pocket and produced a letter from the head of Cabela's Human Resources stating Cabel'a Corporate Policy regarding personally carried firearms in their stores. I asked him to call her office for me and inform her that he was telling me to leave so it would be official. (A member of store/corporate managment has to be informed for a tresspass order to be lawful.) He read it TWICE. The second time his lips were moving. He appologized profusely and said he would make sure that EVERYONE in the department was informed ASAP. I've never had a problem there since. Nor anywhere I carry openly. And I carry openly a while lot more than I carry concealed. And yes I open carry in my bank. But then again they do know me there. Actually I don't think they even realize I'm carrying.
I have found that most people don't pay attention.

Another funny story.
I was in the Aaron's Rental store in Everett, paying on my washer & dryer. I was leaning again the counter and a young man who had been looking at TV walked by and commented to his friend, "Look he's carrying a .38 and something sorta like a speedloader." I smiled at him and replied, "No... He's carrying as .44 and it IS a speedloader." His eyes got really big and all he said was, "Cool." The clerk glanced over the counter and went back to counting money and never said a word.

I have preached to several people in OpenCarry.org that it's HOW you carry that gets you in trouble. I know it's not right, but an older guy like me, carrying a revolver (usually) in a nice leather holster doesn't cause much alarm. However, if you prance about with a cocked and locked 1911 in a floppy nyon holster with no safety strap expect to scare some sheeple. When I carry any of my 1911 type pistols I carry them in a nice leather holster with a thumb break. For some reaspn no one gives me a second glance.
Now I'm talking open carry only. When concealed a thumb break may not be needed. But for open carry I want as much security against losing my tool as possible.

I guess I'm lucky living where I do. Since Everett issued their training bulletin a few years ago (2006?) it has trickled down to the smaller departments in Snohomish County. Seattle also issued a directive around the same time frame. I have heard that Tukwila PD can be rather abrasive about open carry. But that's to be expected.

 

[RimfireChris]

Cool link BluesBear. By the way, what is that, with the Greek? letters in your sig? I've seen it around several places, but don't know what it means.

 

[BluesBear]

RimfireChris, Don't want to hijack but it's pronounced Mo-lawn La-vay and means "Come and Take Them", In 480BC it was Leonidas' (The Spartans) reply to Xerxes (The Persians) request for surrender. Just Google the Battle of Thermopylae.

We now return to our regularly scheduled thread.

 

[Davey]

Being a life long citizen (well, minus the one year in Virginia) of Illinois those pictures blow my mind.

 

[Adamastor]

You Americans are blessed. Can do the open carry, has a wide variety of weapons at his disposal in the stores, wide range of ammunition of excellent quality and low prices. Gripe of laws restricting, but had to have some restraint!

I'm from Brazil and here is a huge bureaucracy to get a gun. You have no idea of the size of the constraints that prevail in my country, if you lived here for two days, you'll understand what your country allows you to do and to have!

If I do the open carry, I go to jail at the same time

Stop complaining people, you are blessed!

Sorry by the english