Vertical track
- Thread starter DasGuy
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I just watched that last night. Definitely seems like a valid variation of "2 in the chest 1 in the head". Not sure how many bad guys are really going to wear armor, but this seems to cover all the bases in case you encounter one that does. You're still getting rounds center mass, so it's not like it's hinging on getting the tricky headshot.
Not sure if it's THE technique, but does seem to be an effective option.
Not sure if it's THE technique, but does seem to be an effective option.
In the video he specifically states and demonstrates how it is different from the Mozambique.
Instead of placing a controlled pair in the chest, and pausing to place one in the head; it has you using the recoil of the gun to aid in drawing a line of shots vertically up to the head.
Instead of placing a controlled pair in the chest, and pausing to place one in the head; it has you using the recoil of the gun to aid in drawing a line of shots vertically up to the head.
3.Shot.Group.
Moderator
I think I would just try and get the hell out of there, and let the police handle it. That way I don't go to jail, and if I did have to shoot the guy/gal I only did so as a last resort to save my own life, not to defend my pride or ego.
g.willikers
New member
The vertical track technique seems to be more in agreement with the shoot 'em until they're down concept than the failure to stop (Mozambique) drill.
Doesn't the hesitation in the FTS drill offer up an opportunity to get shot?
Doesn't the hesitation in the FTS drill offer up an opportunity to get shot?
3.Shot.Group.
Moderator
If someone is shooting at me the first thing I'm going to do is take cover, the next thing I'm going to do is look for an egress and leave the area when/if I can.
Last resort is when there is no way out, and the shooter is coming for me, about to flank me where I won't have cover, then I'd have no choice but to shoot or be shot.
It's always better to leave than to stay and shoot it out, if you leave you likely won't get shot, if you stay and shoot it out there's a greater chance that you could get shot.
If you're running you're less likely to be hit than if you're standing/crouching still.
If you're behind cover you're less likely to get hit than if you're out in the open.
If you try to draw your SDW and take aim on a bad guy, you're both out in the open And standing still, and way more likely to get shot, than if you're running or hiding behind cover.
What would you do?
FrankenMauser
New member
That's the whole point. You're already past the "let's find a way out of here" phase. At the point in time that you have to implement the 'vertical track', you're in "shoot or die" territory, with some one running right at you.
Willie Lowman
New member
I have been practicing controlled pairs for some time now.
In a life or death situation I don't want my muscle memory confused by some idea of letting recoil help change my POA/POI. Seems like a good way to miss or accidentally limp wrist the gun.
I'll keep my controlled pairs, thankyouverymuch.
In a life or death situation I don't want my muscle memory confused by some idea of letting recoil help change my POA/POI. Seems like a good way to miss or accidentally limp wrist the gun.
I'll keep my controlled pairs, thankyouverymuch.
Wreck-n-Crew
New member
It's just changing point of aim not grip. The recoil naturally moves the muzzle in the direction of the climb. It's not changing muscle memory at all.
The ability to change point of aim quickly is necessary for real life active shooting. You don't change grip, just point of aim.
3.Shot.Group.
Moderator
Gunfights are dynamic, and no plan of action will stand up to reality, you have to ready to change your game plan second by second. So I'm not going to spend too much time working on a single course of action or trying to decide which one is the perfect one for an imaginary scenario. I'll develop a good technique and stick with it.
Anything is better than nothing, be a winner not a perfectionist, and you'll live longer.
Wreck-n-Crew
New member
Vertical track adds something missing in some training, outside of the center mass shooting including head and neck. Shoot until down doesn't necessarily go outside center mass aim. Most people train or aim center mass and many (if not most) SD shootings revolve around the center mass aim (not necessarily hit).
Absolutely and the Vertical Track should have been the first choice with an active shooter IMO.
There is a reason why Vertical track is not taught all the time or as a first option for all scenarios, I am sure many can imagine why, possible legal repercussions and all. Using the VM effectively getting a head shot in a SD shooting of an unarmed assailant might be frowned upon and have you facing a jury. Especially if you were taught it and discussed in on a forum.
I remember when the technique was called a Zipper. Then, it was later being discussed in training for instructors as 'vertical stringing', because nobody in their right mind wants to find themselves in front of a jury explaining why they were teaching a technique called a 'zipper'. 
Intentionally stringing shots vertically is probably best left to something introduced to at least intermediate level & experienced shooters, if not advanced.
Learning to ride the recoil impulses, controlling recoil and not letting it control you, while maintaining a solid grip, sight alignment and trigger press is one thing. Another thing is how a dynamic threat target may be moving, and how the neck/head is a really narrow and small target. I've seen shooters trying for intentional head shots on stationary paper threat targets put hits off to one side or the other of the head, above the shoulder.
A moving paper target, even if the movement is occurring within a defined & expected manner (or path) really increases difficulty ... and that doesn't even take into consideration potential shooter movement in any given situation or set set of circumstances.
When I've introduced vertical stringing to an intermediate, interested & experienced shooter, I've usually done so as a teaching tool, to better assess a shooter's skillset and mastery of technique basics. For example, does the recoil control the shooter in a new situation, or can the shooter automatically adjust and control the recoil while making accurate hits? Then, I slowly introduce shooter movement (forward/rearward, diagonal and lateral - starting from both left & right directions) while performing the drill, and changing the number of rounds being fired.
This is when most shooters start to realize that accurate fire means aimed fire, especially out beyond 3 yds. When even moderately experienced shooters start missing COM hits between 5-9 yds, while they're moving but the threat target remains stationary, it usually gets their attention (and not in a good way).
I remember listening to a cop who had survived an on-duty shooting during which he'd been seriously injured. The shooting was later determined to have involved distances between the lone cop and armed suspect of 5-100 feet. The cop said that after he'd been seriously injured, and hadn't hit the attacker after having fired 22-23 rounds ... and was loading his last hi-cap mag into his .40 duty weapon ... he realized he had to stop 'shooting instinctively' and start aiming. He did just that, hitting and stopping his attacker.
I also remember showing this technique to an experienced instructor and cop who had been involved in 2 shootings of his own (successfully stopping both suspects without being injured himself). The first thing he said after practicing the technique was that he wished he'd have learned it sooner ... but he's a very experienced & skilled shooter.
FWIW, I remember some years ago when one of the larger state agencies reportedly did a study of their on-duty shooting incidents covering a number of years. They supposedly discovered that in just shy of 65% of the shootings reviewed, both the officer and the armed suspect were in constant motion.
Bottom line? The totality of circumstances involved in any particular shooting incident can't be predicted. There's a reason these incidents have been referred to as unexpected, dynamic, rapidly evolving and chaotic occurrences.
"Head shots", and the neck/cervical spine, are going to be extremely difficult to make on even a close stationary threat target. Being able to get an adequate flash sight acquisition and not jerk the trigger under fast shot strings seems pretty hard for many shooters of casual training and experience. People miss more than they expect even under controlled range conditions.
Learn, train and practice hard to master the basics, and then periodically test them under increasingly more demanding drill conditions (supervised by an instructor). Try some IDPA or similar local competition venues.
Don't try to run before you can consistently & successfully walk over difficult and uneven terrain.
Remember that each and every shot fired is going to hit something, and bear in mind where the responsibility for the consequences of that bullet impact may be found to rest.
Just some thoughts.
Intentionally stringing shots vertically is probably best left to something introduced to at least intermediate level & experienced shooters, if not advanced.
Learning to ride the recoil impulses, controlling recoil and not letting it control you, while maintaining a solid grip, sight alignment and trigger press is one thing. Another thing is how a dynamic threat target may be moving, and how the neck/head is a really narrow and small target. I've seen shooters trying for intentional head shots on stationary paper threat targets put hits off to one side or the other of the head, above the shoulder.
A moving paper target, even if the movement is occurring within a defined & expected manner (or path) really increases difficulty ... and that doesn't even take into consideration potential shooter movement in any given situation or set set of circumstances.
When I've introduced vertical stringing to an intermediate, interested & experienced shooter, I've usually done so as a teaching tool, to better assess a shooter's skillset and mastery of technique basics. For example, does the recoil control the shooter in a new situation, or can the shooter automatically adjust and control the recoil while making accurate hits? Then, I slowly introduce shooter movement (forward/rearward, diagonal and lateral - starting from both left & right directions) while performing the drill, and changing the number of rounds being fired.
This is when most shooters start to realize that accurate fire means aimed fire, especially out beyond 3 yds. When even moderately experienced shooters start missing COM hits between 5-9 yds, while they're moving but the threat target remains stationary, it usually gets their attention (and not in a good way).
I remember listening to a cop who had survived an on-duty shooting during which he'd been seriously injured. The shooting was later determined to have involved distances between the lone cop and armed suspect of 5-100 feet. The cop said that after he'd been seriously injured, and hadn't hit the attacker after having fired 22-23 rounds ... and was loading his last hi-cap mag into his .40 duty weapon ... he realized he had to stop 'shooting instinctively' and start aiming. He did just that, hitting and stopping his attacker.
I also remember showing this technique to an experienced instructor and cop who had been involved in 2 shootings of his own (successfully stopping both suspects without being injured himself). The first thing he said after practicing the technique was that he wished he'd have learned it sooner ... but he's a very experienced & skilled shooter.
FWIW, I remember some years ago when one of the larger state agencies reportedly did a study of their on-duty shooting incidents covering a number of years. They supposedly discovered that in just shy of 65% of the shootings reviewed, both the officer and the armed suspect were in constant motion.
Bottom line? The totality of circumstances involved in any particular shooting incident can't be predicted. There's a reason these incidents have been referred to as unexpected, dynamic, rapidly evolving and chaotic occurrences.
"Head shots", and the neck/cervical spine, are going to be extremely difficult to make on even a close stationary threat target. Being able to get an adequate flash sight acquisition and not jerk the trigger under fast shot strings seems pretty hard for many shooters of casual training and experience. People miss more than they expect even under controlled range conditions.
Learn, train and practice hard to master the basics, and then periodically test them under increasingly more demanding drill conditions (supervised by an instructor). Try some IDPA or similar local competition venues.
Don't try to run before you can consistently & successfully walk over difficult and uneven terrain.
Remember that each and every shot fired is going to hit something, and bear in mind where the responsibility for the consequences of that bullet impact may be found to rest.
Just some thoughts.
FrankenMauser
New member
3.Shot.Group said:
The statements in bold are completely contradictory.
You're talking in circles.
It's a technique, nothing more. It's likely less valid than some in some cases and more valid than some in others. However, like all techniques, it has to be the one you practice, not just "oh, I'll try that if something happens."
If it's what you practice, then "muscle memory", "learning the recoil", etc is irrelevant because it's what you practiced.
If you're concerned about how your practiced technique makes you look in court, don't say "I used the SEAL Special Assassin method to neutralize the threat", but more along the lines of, "I was in fear for my life and used my gun to defend myself." The bullets made a perfect vertical line? Weird.
If it's what you practice, then "muscle memory", "learning the recoil", etc is irrelevant because it's what you practiced.
If you're concerned about how your practiced technique makes you look in court, don't say "I used the SEAL Special Assassin method to neutralize the threat", but more along the lines of, "I was in fear for my life and used my gun to defend myself." The bullets made a perfect vertical line? Weird.
3.Shot.Group.
Moderator
Sorry if my post wasn't linear enough for you, but I know what I'm talking about.
Vertical tracking
I first learned vertical tracking in a class I took from the Smith & Wesson Academy in the late 80s.
It is sometimes also called "the zipper".
It's application was if you were facing a single adversary and you had to burn him to the ground right now -- you began shooting as soon as you got sights on the target and then just rode the gun up in recoil along the center line of their body, hopefully delivering 3 to 5 rounds and ending (possibly) in a head shot.
It was hoped that all those shots along the center line would result in at least one hit to the CNS and stop the fight.
In my experience, it sounds really good and works on a static target on the range. If you try it in force on force with Simunitions or AirSoft you find that you're moving and the target is moving and it doesn't really work unless you're at VERY close range, and maybe not even then.
It's a neat theory, however
I first learned vertical tracking in a class I took from the Smith & Wesson Academy in the late 80s.
It is sometimes also called "the zipper".
It's application was if you were facing a single adversary and you had to burn him to the ground right now -- you began shooting as soon as you got sights on the target and then just rode the gun up in recoil along the center line of their body, hopefully delivering 3 to 5 rounds and ending (possibly) in a head shot.
It was hoped that all those shots along the center line would result in at least one hit to the CNS and stop the fight.
In my experience, it sounds really good and works on a static target on the range. If you try it in force on force with Simunitions or AirSoft you find that you're moving and the target is moving and it doesn't really work unless you're at VERY close range, and maybe not even then.
It's a neat theory, however
Double Naught Spy
New member
Pause? What pause? If the head is there you shoot it. The only pause is the transition time in going from the chest to the head.
As for riding the recoil up. I prefer to control my gun a little better. I take it to the target and not the other way around.
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