Velocity & Accuracy?

Z

ZVP

New member
Why is it that when I approach the 1000fps mark with revolvers in either .36 or .44 cal, Accuracy increases and Groups shrink? I have noted this at 7 and 15 yard targets.
I have noted that 600fps loads aren't quite as accurate. Do low velocity balls tend to wander due to an unstable spin?
ZVP
 
That's pretty much been my experience also but most folks swear up and down the powder puff loads are most accurate.
 
I happen to know the loads the top shooters shoot at Friendship and they
Are not the 1000 fps ones. They are not the powder puff 600 fps either.
 
Maybe 800fps then? LOL!
Please expand that clue you teased us with, OK?
Seriously, using Pyrodex, the closer I am to 1000 fps the better! I am too poor of an offhand shot to gauge 25 yard groups but if I had some sort of mehicanical rest to lock it into, I bet I'd find the same results!
Untill I get better "Puff" load groups I think I'll stick with the fast ones.
ZVP
 
My experience:

'Slow', low power loads are difficult to shoot accurately with any consistency, although sometimes I can do fairly well.

'Fast', high power loads are generally more consistent in terms of accuracy, although when you get to full chamber loads accuracy goes out the window pretty quickly.

If I don't want to play games with loads and I'm looking for the most accurate one that I can pretty much count on (like shooting a match) it's been my experience that 'moderate' loads are unilaterally the best.

All of the above does not, however, lead to any given muzzle velocity as 'the best'. A moderate, or better yet, optimum, load in a Walker is not the same as one in an 1860 Army or 1858 Remington.
 
I don't shoot for groups and despise punching paper period. I'm deadly on Coke cans at 25 yards tho and that's good enough for me.
 
What HAWG said.
Sure, clover leaf groups are cool. One big ragged hole is great. I shoot at 4X4 inch air gun targets at 30-50 feet, six holes in that, I'm happy.
With the 1858, they are mostly in the 7-10 ring. That works for me.
But, as with airguns, it is a whole lotta fun to pitch a can an unknown distance, and drop the hammer on it. Hitting em makes for a fun shooting experience.
 
My 1860's like to shoot faster, especially the Colt. I'd have trouble hitting milk jugs if I shot that one slow. Now the Walker..... it's happy with anything. It'll shoot as steady as I can hold it, using any load. :)

('Bout equal between shooting cans/paper for me)
 
And I despise shooting at Cans!
Click to expand...

That's your right and nobody is knocking you for it. I just like to see something happen. I shoot lots of stuff not just cans but I shoot more cans than anything else.
 
I shoot lots of stuff not just cans but I shoot more cans than anything else.
Click to expand...
Hmmm. A deep seated antipathy towards aluminum containers. Tell me, how do you feel about airplanes? Helicopters?
 
Some thoughts

I have never been to a CAS event and don’t know how they are scored. Hawg’s statement about powder puff loads I assume addresses the CAS loads. Hawg, correct me if I am wrong about that. Those shooters who report best accuracy in powder puff loads may be defining accuracy in a way that is different from ZVP. They may be referring to hitting roughly center of mass consistently on a non-stationary target. (Again…I do not know how CAS events are scored). Anyway, it appears that ZVP is referring to basic accuracy of the pistol and shooter system. Z, correct me if I am wrong about that.

Let me ask some questions about that system.

I have often wondered how much the revolver moves after the instant that the power in the chamber begins to ignite, but before the projectile leaves the muzzle. High speed camera videos might be helpful here (but I have not looked for them. I know there are some very good videos on the internet but most have more to do with the projectile hitting the target.) I think it is logical to believe that (all other things being equal) a heavier pistol will move less than a lighter one. I think those of us who shoot Dragoon’s or Walker’s have noted that the revolver seems to be very stabile in comparison to a .44 in 1851 pattern.

I would be happy to have your observations on that.

As regards velocity versus accuracy, it seems as though, the more time it takes for the projectile to travel from the muzzle to the target, the more time that the external forces will have to act on the projectile. Any force acting upon the projectile after it leaves the muzzle and not perfectly aligned with the direction of travel from the muzzle to the target (In a vector impacting windage or elevation) would seem to fall into the category of forces I am referring to. Gravity is a good example. I think we would all agree that if we fire a given revolver at a target that is seven yards distant, we get a smaller group than when firing that same revolver with the same load at a target that is fifteen yards away. Two things going on here. 1. A target that is further away is likely harder to aim at than a target that is closer. (That has nothing to do with Z's post). 2. A bullet traveling twice as far will take almost twice as long to get to the target.

Does any of this make sense?
 
I do shoot CAS, shot yesterday. Anyway, you just need to hit a 10"X10" square at 20' or less to play the game and shoot well.
In my experience a warm load tends to shoot better in a non-magnum handgun. By this I'm talking about 900 fps. My CAS load, carry load, hunting load is a 200 gr RNFP lead bullet at 920 fps. Seems real accurate in my SAA and shoots close to point of aim.
 
In CAS, the number of seconds needed to shoot the stage is your score with 5 seconds added for each miss. Low score is the winner.

A lot simpler than IPSC.
 
No Doc. I was referring to the ones that shoot 15-20 grains of powder out of .44's and rave about the accuracy. That lil dab of powder ain't worth wasting a cap on.:D
 
Hawg, I shoot my 1858 with 23gr of 777, still using up 100's of .451 balls, no wads and #11 CCI. I get results I'm happy with. What is your opinion on this load? What should I experiment with to improve accuracy?
As stated above, I enjoy shooting cans, plastic bottles or whatever. Do quite well, most of the time that is.
You really know your stuff from what I've read on here. Any input on other loads? I've messed around with loads, stopped when accuracy was good enough. But hey, I'm always trying to learn and get better.
 
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