Vancouver WA PD, I am ashamed of you.

This seems to be the NIMBY crowd.

Let's take a firecracker (black cat, whatever) that comes on a string and compare it to an M80, which is another type of firecracker. One is CLEARLY more dangerous. Now, lets compare the M80 to a mortar. Again, on is CLEARLY more dangerous.
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By this logic anyone can argue that .50 caliber weapons should be banned. Lets see... compare a .22 to a .38. One is CLEARLY more dangerous. Compare a .38 to the .50 BMG. Again, one is CLEARLY more dangerous.

Trapp said it pretty well...

Pro gunners against fireworks.....And yes a time and place "It's called INDEPENDANCE DAY"....Maybe we should call it "DEPEND ON THE GOVERNMENT DAY".....Guns are far more dangerous than fireworks, but most people don't want them banned. Get earplugs if its too loud. Do you anti's really justify to yourselves that they should be illegal?
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And for this:

Except for the fact that they, at any time, are the equivalent of tossing a molotov cocktail or grenade at someones house or property
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What a load! Not even comparable. You have no right getting angry next time you read a sensationalized anti-gunner editorial. A grenade of all things. :rolleyes:

I don't know what experience you all have here with fireworks or rockets. I have spent many hours making rockets from scratch ranging in size from bottle rockets to "D" size rocketry motors. I have made rockets, mortars, and black match fuse.

Rockets and fireworks are less dangerous than firearms... CLEARLY. Yet why is everyone here justifying their removal from society? I would guess and say that you have little experience with them. Doesn't it annoy you that your neighbor likes to shoot off some aerial repeaters on his own property? Doesn't it annoy you that your neighbor likes to shoot rifles on his own property?

Not to mention you've got to be 21 to buy any. Wow, imagine that! An item one must be 21 to buy gets in the hands of children and is used irresponsibly by a SMALL number of people. Sounds familiar huh? How would you like it if authorities searched your local range for examples of illegal calibers?

Let's end the hypocrisy.
 
Like everything else, the misuse and irresponsible handling of fireworks is leading to "crackdowns" by those charged with curtailing such behavior. The cops also go to extra length to catch DUIs and shooting firearms into the air on New Years. so we shouldn't be surprised by them going to such lengths...

I enjoy fireworks, but only shoot them in such fashion and time that my neighbors are unaffected and local ordinances remain intact.
 
Pro gunners against fireworks.....And yes a time and place "It's called INDEPENDANCE DAY"....Maybe we should call it "DEPEND ON THE GOVERNMENT DAY"....
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I don't want to depend on the police to handle it. I just don't want your **** to land in my yard. I want you to be responsible for problems you cause others without the police having to make you be responsible. If you can't guarantee that, or you don't sign an agreement to pay big in the civil suit if my yard catches fire, keep them away from my property.
I smoke but I don't light off fireworks.

Does one cancel out the other or should I expect a smiggen of wrath?
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Flip your butts in my yard and you should expect a smidgen of wrath. Just like if you had shot fireworks into my yard.

We often talk about responsible firearms ownership. A gun has to be handled by a person to do damage. Fireworks, once lit, have a mind of their own and cannot be stopped the way you can point a slam-firing semi-auto in a safe direction. So, if you are in my neighborhood setting off fireworks, be prepared to catch them and hold them until they go out if they start heading my way. If you are unwilling to do that, take them outside the city limits where it is legal to shoot them since there is less property held at risk.

Your right to pursue happiness ends where it infringes upon mine. My pursuit of happiness includes a clean, uncharred lawn.
I enjoy fireworks, but only shoot them in such fashion and time that my neighbors are unaffected and local ordinances remain intact.
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And I thank you for that.
 
Difference between my weapon handling and knuckleheads firing off fireworks:
I can control where my weapon points and shoots. Don't see too many turds controlling the bottle rocket as it launches into the air onto my house, dried lawn, etc.
 
By this logic anyone can argue that .50 caliber weapons should be banned. Lets see... compare a .22 to a .38. One is CLEARLY more dangerous. Compare a .38 to the .50 BMG. Again, one is CLEARLY more dangerous.
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And, just like fireworks, if you spend an evening randomly firing a .50 BMG up and down my street, you're going to jail. That goes for the .38, too.

LawDog
 
I can control where my weapon points and shoots. Don't see too many turds controlling the bottle rocket as it launches into the air onto my house, dried lawn, etc.
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Sure, you can control where you point it, but it still can be dangerous to bystanders. Suppose you're at a range and there are people on either side of you and you have a Kaboom and fragments of your receiver embed themselves in your neighbor's bodies?

Nail the idiots who are using fireworks irresponsibly, but leave those of us alone who are handling them safely. To even suggest otherwise on a gun forum, of all places, smacks of hypocrisy of the worst sort.
 
And a meteor can crash on my house. We can "what if" on both sides. The point everyone is trying to make is that most kids using fireworks tend to use them in a fashion that disrupts the lives of other people. No one is even remotely talking about you blowing up the bullfrog in your backyard. We are talking about damage caused to our private property from irresponsible use of fireworks.
 
So how is that different from damage caused to your private property from irresponsible use of matches?

Why is a special set of laws and possession bans needed to address the issue, instead of taking advantage of a long list of existing laws such as reckless endangerment, malicious destruction of property, disorderly conduct, arson, etc, etc, etc?
 
Why is a special set of laws and possession bans needed to address the issue, instead of taking advantage of a long list of existing laws such as reckless endangerment, malicious destruction of property, disorderly conduct, arson, etc, etc, etc?
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You have a very good point. I think the answer is money. Possession is cut and dry, while you would have to prove reckless endangerment, the most likely charge. Most cities don't want to have to pay for the more drawn-out court case that would be likely in the reckless endangerment case.

One could try to draw a parallel between fireworks bans and gun bans (trust me, I did to make sure I wasn't being hypocritical), but a person who waves a loaded handgun around at a crowd without provocation (reckless endangerment) or shoots his neighbor's mailbox for fun (malicious destruction of property) was doing something wrong. The guy who nearly maims a toddler with his fireworks (reckless endangerment) or launches a rocket at my truck which explodes under the gas tank, setting my truck on fire (malicious destruction of property, see earlier post) was "just having fun" when something went wrong and will use the court case to try and weasel his way out of criminal responsibility.

Guns and fireworks are like comparing bananas and oranges; both have a peel, but that is the only similarity. I'm not allowed to discharge my handgun within city limits except in self-defense. I'm not allowed to discharge fireworks within city limits and it is highly unlikely I will use them in self-defense. Guns are tools with entertainment possibilities, fireworks are entertainment with no other uses.
 
Fireworks and kid fun

Born in the good old days! $.25 cent a week allowance, wouldn't buy many firecrackers, but a long way on a box of .22s, a single shot 20 guage and a .22 rifle, could hunt all over the area, knew everybody and they knew me. Could share the stock tanks for a swim with the water moccasins and catfish. Grownups were not too busy to be around when fireworks were being set off.

Little school wasn't bad, kin to two third of the kids there, bullies were there, they whipped you or you them and that was the end of it. Teachers busted your butt when you needed it and parents would too if they found out.

The invasion of the anti this and that, the bellyachers and don't step on my property came after WWII when we were invaded by people that served in the military and liked the women and the climate, and stayed or came back.

I thank God every day for living in a decent age so long ago and the freedom to be a real kid and have the fun my Daddy did and his Daddy when they weren't off fighting in
somebody's war. I need to thank HIM for not being a youngster in today's world!
 
City vs Rural

Oh OK I think I am starting to understand. I have had a problem convincing myself that you guys aren't the biggest hypocrites on the planet...until I thought re-read the title of this thread.

Vancouver=City....much more interdependant. I live in the sticks and will be darned if any one complains about what I do (ok there are some exceptions I'll admit so don't even start)! Actually all my fellow rural landowners are shooters and firework users. However in a city I can understand a little more where these feelings are coming from. Which of course is why all true conservatives live in the sticks! ;)

Shawn
 
Nothing more annoying than the idiots with fireworks who set my Aunt & Uncle's field and shed on fire about 10 years ago.


"Pro gunners against fireworks....."

And the two are analagous... how?

"INDEPENDANCE DAY"

Actually, I call it IndependEnce day... But that's just me.
 
However in a city I can understand a little more where these feelings are coming from. Which of course is why all true conservatives live in the sticks!
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I long for the day when I can live in the sticks, where I can not have to listen to my neighbor's car alarm go off when the wind blows, where I can plow up a flat area 500 meters long and a backstop thick enough to contain .50BMG fire... :D
 
I have had a problem convincing myself that you guys aren't the biggest hypocrites on the planet
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*shrug*
Probably because it's true.....

Don't hold it against anyone though - everyone's a hypocrite about something. If they aren't, they're worm food. It's all a part of human nature.

BTW - welcome to TFL.
 
Fireworks.

I actually enjoy the sounds - smell - visual effects of fireworks, it all just goes with the celebration of Americas birthday.

Are there going to be idiots with fireworks? - why certainly - just as there are any # of idiots running around and discharging firearms in a unsafe manner,at all times of the year.

But we don't advocate the possession and use of firearms to be controlled and regulated - but fireworks are a different. Esp since the are basically used @ 2 to 3 days out of the whole year, while firearms enjoy year round use.

This P.C. bull**** has to stop somewhere. I thank God i grew up in a era where all this nonsense was taken for what it really was.

Now the WHINERS have taken control, how sad.

12-34hom
 
I think we should legalize hand held nukes and set them off on the 4th.

Reading some of the responses from the anything goes crowd reinforeces my sometimes broken decision to avoid these discussions.

Now back to selling guns.

WildinbetweenbothendsofthespectrumliesrationalityandmaturityAlaska
 
WildIonlywanttocontrolcertaindangerousbehaviorsAlaska-
Let's grant your concerns about public safety; then lets add to it 12-34hom's; then mine; then hal's and Capt Charlie's; and so on. When we finish the list, we can pass laws to "control" all these behaviors.

Oops, sorry. We've already done that, haven't we?
Why do I feel no "safer"?
Why did I not feel "unsafe" in the "Old Days"?

Perhaps because my "betweenbothendsofthespectrumliesrationalityandmaturity" becomes your persecution.

Not arguing that all fireworks should be freely available, but I DO see Both "Sides of the Spectrum" and, from what I'm seeing, you're hardly "between" those.
Rich
 
Wraith,

Lets go back to my first quote from you

There is absolutely nothing that makes bottle rockets and firecrackers more dangerous or annoying than most other devices.
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Alright, now, you made an analagous statement to different firearms, only to prove my point. (which had NOTHING to do with banning anything)

If I'm going to get shot with something, I'll choose a .22 over a 50 bmg. Why? The .22 penetrates less, has less mass, and does less damage... i.e. It's less dangerous. See how logic works?

Matches and flame throwers can both start fires, but which is more likely to?

Still think their equally dangerous? Set off a black cat in your open palm. Darn, that hurt, maybe burnt your hand. Now, lets set off an M80 in your open palm! You tell me which is more dangerous.


Now, I never said wether they should be banned or not. I just spoke to the allocation of police resources... because the original poster said that it was a horrible use of police to crack down on fireworks. My original point still stands. Yes, they have more important things to worry about, so if people stop breaking the fireworks law then the police can focus on the important stuff. The only way to get people to stop breaking the law is to enforce it. Then to go after what really matters!!
 
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