UK story and the always popular shoot em dead thread

What Martin did should be an object lesson to us all. He mouthed off about blowing the head off a burglar if he ever caught one, he illegally procured a shotgun without obtaining a firearms licence first, something that would not have been difficult for him to do legally as he is a farmer and has cause to use one in connection with his business, and then he lay in wait with it for an unknown number of nights waiting for the burglars. It is a disgusting travesty that he was convicted, but he was effectively hung by his own words and deeds prior to the shooting. You may also be interested to know that the weight of opinion in the British press is now behind his acquittal on appeal, in my opinion he is unlikely to succeed, but 10 years for killing a dirtbag isn't so bad, if he had been so convicted in Texas he would either have been fried or got one of those half witted 150 year sentences. Meanwhile the british press is countering our revulsion at the outcome of this case with detailed news of the 2 recent retirement homes shootings, "They may have Alzheimers but they still get to carry guns ....." etc etc.

Ne'er the twain shall meet methinks.

Mike H
 
Mike H- even if he had gotten a shotgun liscense, it would be illegal for him to keep it for self-defense. I'm not absolutely certain, but I believe they require you to keep it locked in a safe, and I know self-defense is never a "reason" to own a gun there.

I can't imagine how he would have been convicted in Texas. More likely, he would be considered a hero.

Being prepared for a criminal attack does not mean you want to commit murder. He had been burglarized before, and was just taking precautions, as most of us probably do. Wearing clothes in bed does not equal lying it wait to commit murder on helpless home invaders.
 
BTR,

You are quite correct when saying that personal defence is not a justification for firearms ownership in Britain, this being the case since the Gun Control Act of errrm 1954 I think, and yes shotguns must be kept locked away and unloaded. But my point in this respect was that by procuring one ILLEGALLY, he showed intent to use it for an illegal purpose as opposed to shooting crows or foxes, in which case he would at least have had a legal right to have the gun in his hands that killed the intruder assuming he had a genuine requirement to defend himself.

As for getting the chair or 150 years of never picking up the soap in the shower in Texas, that hallowed seat of civilization, the reference was to their draconian sentencing arrangements compared to the comparative slap on the wrist Mr.Martin received in Britain and it assumed that he had been wrongly convicted of any murder in that state. In this specific case, I agree that he probably would have been made Governor as opposed to being prosecuted.

As for him lying in bed, the ballistics evidence clearly showed that he was lying in wait downstairs and did not shoot from his bedroom as he claimed in his statement. We also know that he had made earlier statements in front of a meeting room full of witnesses that he would blow the head off a burglar, and would like to machine gun gypsies, he had illegally procured a firearm for that purpose, and then he had indeed carried out his threat by killing said burglar, before fleeing the scene (as opposed to phoning the police).

My point is not that he was not justified, because invasion of home to me represents crossing the line in the sand, but rather that his actions and statements both prior to and following the shooting were bound to support a conviction.

As a footnote, it now appears that the jury had been intimidated during the trial by the criminal family members of the dead man, there thus remains the prospect of an early mis-trial. My hopes for one are with Mr.Martin, injustice recognizes no national boundaries.

Mike H

[This message has been edited by Mike H (edited April 23, 2000).]
 
Mike,

“... his actions and statements both prior to and following the shooting were
bound to support a conviction.”

I agree. And it’s a shame. Me? For the record, I would have been terrified if
someone broke into my home. That’s for the record, okay?
-----
Oh. Wait a minute.

(Dennis puts on the white Stetson his daughter gave him for Christmas.)

I’m startin’ t’wonder who tole y’all ‘bout Texas. Musta been some
carpetbagger we shooed outa here. Do believe y’all been misled.
(spit tobacco juice)

C’mon down here ‘n sit a spell afor ya get them opinions set hard, ya hear?
(spit) I’ll keep a Shiner cold for ya.
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(I *warned* you!
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)
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Glenn,

“Farmer Tony Martin ... found guilty of murdering a 16-year-old burglar ...
(and) of wounding another intruder ... Both were majority verdicts of 10-2.
Earlier, the jury had cleared Martin of attempting to murder Mr Fearon and of
possessing a weapon with intent to endanger life.”

1) Good grief! It sounds like he was cleared once so they tried him a second
time!
2) 10-2 verdicts. I wonder if that means 20% of Britains are against the
current gun-phobic government.



[This message has been edited by Dennis (edited April 23, 2000).]
 
Makes you think about our jury system. It would have been a hung jury. Some poll shows that the UK public favor this guy.

Personally, I don't favor shooting unless your life is threatened but that is a decision I make and don't drop on others.

I would have voted to let this guy go.

Although he is a lesson to shut up!!

Many guys on lists like this proclaim that they will blaze away, blah blah.

They might see their posts in court like this schmuck's ramblings.

I could suggest some folk but that would be rude.
 
Moral of the Story#1) For God's sake, avoid spouting Rambo stories about what you're gonna do to any (insert your favorite ethnic slur here) that tries to steal your stereo.

Moral of the Story#2) Thank heaven I live in Georgia, where state law stipulates that I have no need to pat down a BG caught in my house to see if he is armed and then quiz him about his intentions (Excuse me, Mr. Goblin, are you here for the silverware or did you intend to engage in any rape or murder?) before using lethal force to defend me and mine. If you have an intruder in your house in the middle of the night here in Georgia, you may assume he is inclined to harm you if given the chance and react accordingly...

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Tamara's House o' Weapons: If we can't kill it, it's immortal.
10mm: It's not the size of the Dawg in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog!
 
A little rambling story here guys...

Coupla years back I read a story of some farmer in Greece(?) that was confronted by 3 armed ner' do wells in his house.

Here grabbed his shotgun, took out BG #1 then grabbing BG #1s pistol shot BG #2.
Can't quite remember what happened to BG #3 but he prob'ly still has nightmares<g>
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Anyways, what happened to the poor old farmer I hear you ask?
He was applauded as a HERO & given a medal I think !
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With the English guy, right attitude
WRONG Country
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"The Gun from Down Under !"
http://www.para1911fanclub.w3.to/
E-mail hotshot_2000@hotmail.com
ICQ # 68806935
 
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