UK story and the always popular shoot em dead thread

Glenn E. Meyer

New member
http://www.guardianunlimited.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,3604,212021,00.html


4.15pm update
Farmer jailed for life for
murder of teenage
intruder

Profile: the gypsy-hating loner who shot to
kill

Ros Taylor
Wednesday April 19, 2000

Farmer Tony Martin has been jailed for life at
Norwich crown court after being found guilty of
murdering a 16-year-old burglar who broke into his
Norfolk farm house.

Martin, 55, was also found guilty of wounding
another intruder, 30-year-old Brendan Fearon, with
intent to cause grievous bodily harm. Both were
majority verdicts of 10-2. Earlier, the jury had
cleared Martin of attempting to murder Mr Fearon
and of possessing a weapon with intent to endanger
life.

Fred Barras, who died almost immediately of
shotgun wounds, and Fearon had broken into
Martin's isolated farm near Emneth in Norfolk, on
August 20 1999, intending to steal antiques they
believed to be inside.

Fearon was seriously wounded in the upper thighs,
but managed to escape and reach a neighbouring
farmhouse to call for help. The two intruders had a
total of 114 burglary convictions between them.

There was a loud cry of "yes" as the verdicts were
read out in the crowded courtroom. The jury of six
men and six women took nine hours and 36 minutes
to return the guilty verdicts. As well as the life
sentence for murder, the judge, Mr Justice Owen,
told Martin he must serve 10 years for the wounding
offence and 12 months for the possession of an
illegal firearm. All the sentences will run
concurrently.

The bachelor farmer, who admitted possessing a
shotgun without a certificate, opened fire after
confronting Barras and Fearon, both of Newark,
Nottinghamshire, on his property. He was arrested at
a hotel in Wisbech the next morning. Bleak House,
the farm inhabited by Martin, was "booby-trapped"
and had a home-made security system, the court
heard.

Rosamund Horwood-Smart QC, prosecuting, said
Martin had rigged up his own electricity system and
lived in near darkness. She said he had also taken
security measures and created a "booby-trap" on his
staircase by removing the top and bottom steps.

"He also installed iron bars inside his doors and
windows on the ground floor," she said. "He would
also sleep entirely clothed wearing his boots in
contemplation of something happening."

The roofs of outbuildings had ladders on them and
Martin had set up a "lookout post" in a tree which
had four long ladders lashed to its branches.

Martin denied that he had booby-trapped the
house. He said the stairs were in a state of disrepair
and that he used the ladders for trimming his oak
tree and cleaning a chimney.


3.30pm

A gypsy-hating loner who
shot to kill

Tony Martin, the man found guilty of the
murder of a teenage boy who broke into
his farm, is a volatile character who has
shown no remorse for his victim, writes
Audrey Gillan

Farmer jailed for life for murder of teenage
intruder

Wednesday April 19, 2000

Eccentric, outspoken, loony, highly-strung, a pain in
the arse: all words used by friends and neighbours
to describe Tony Martin, the farmer convicted today
of the murder of a 16-year-old boy who broke in to
his isolated farmhouse one night last August.

Many locals in the villages near Emneth in Norfolk
believed the farmer to be harmless. But others - who
had heard him espouse his hatred for burglars and
what he would do if he caught them - had taken to
giving Martin a wide berth.

Aside from thieves, Martin's pet hate was gypsies.
Norwich crown court heard that he had talked of
putting gypsies in the middle of a field and
machine gunning them. Fred Barras, the boy he
killed, was both a gypsy and a thief.

Martin lived alone in the appropriately named
Bleak House. Run-down and dilapidated, the house
had to be cleared of rubble and booby traps to
make it safe for the jury to visit.

Upstairs, antiques were locked away in two rooms
while their owner slept, fully-clothed, in another,
with his pump-action shotgun by his bedside.
Waiting.

Born into a farming family in 1944 in the
Cambridgeshire village of Wisbech, Martin was a
loner from an early age.

At 35 he inherited Bleak House from relatives.
During his time there, he became convinced that
the house was a target for burglars. He told the court
that, over the years, various items had been stolen
and that he had become frustrated by police
"inaction". Privately, police sources say they are not
sure the burglaries took place.

He was involved in a number of incidents with guns.
In June 1976, the farmer is alleged to have gone to
a friend's house brandishing a revolver. In
December 1987 he had an argument at his brother's
house and is said to have used a shotgun to smash
windows. In 1994 he had his shotgun certificate
revoked after he found a man scrumping for apples
in his orchard and shot a hole in the back of his
vehicle.

Emneth has policing difficulties because of its rural
location on the borders of Norfolk and
Cambridgeshire: making it a target for the travelling
criminal.

Farms around Norfolk have long attracted travelling
people, who come to pick the fruits of the season.
To Martin, they were all "light-fingered pykies" and
"bastards". Martin is not alone in his views. Speak to
some locals and there seems to be a deep-seated
hatred for the travelling community.

After the incident last August, more than 300 locals
crammed in to Emneth village hall to complain to
police about response times. The feeling that a
man should be allowed to protect himself in his own
home reverberated around the country and the
farmer received hundreds of supportive letters.

There was no sympathy for the dead Barras. And
from Martin there has been no remorse. In an
interview with the BBC, he said: "We are supposed
to live in a civilised society. It's not the way I have
been treated. People are not aware of what it's like
in the countryside. Criminals prevail. It can't be
right." He never mentioned Fred Barras once.

• The above is an excerpt from a fuller article by
Audrey Gillan which will appear in tomorrow's
Guardian newspaper.
 
Wow, this guy needs to move to TEXAS!

Also, did anyone else think it odd that the UK has a problem with 'traveling people' (aka gypsys)??? Not something I would associate with the UK!
 
There appears to be a misprint: "There was a loud cry of "yes" as the verdicts were
read out in the crowded courtroom." That should have been, "baa, baa".

" The two intruders had a total of 114 burglary convictions between them ."
I bet they got the point now, after 114 times. Looks like there won't be a cumulative 115.

I thought our newspapers were bad -- what a crock. They make the guy out a looney and then follow up with one of the best hatchet jobs I have seen in a long time.

I am flushing the UK down the toilet -- they are totally beyond redemption.

------------------
The New World Order has a Third Reich odor.

[This message has been edited by Oatka (edited April 19, 2000).]
 
There was a loud cry of "yes"........

Unfortunately this is a public bulletin board so I am unable to express my true feelings about that statement, specifically those who uttered it in the "courtroom ? " that day.
 
"Yes!" they said in sado masochistic bliss (of a somewhat detached voyeuristic nature) Not knowing (or caring) that they too might easily be in such a predicament. Verily perhaps even engineering such an event more likely to occur. If this is not a lover of misery I cannot name another
wink.gif


[This message has been edited by Zensho (edited April 19, 2000).]
 
Oatka - Don't give up on the Irish and the Scots, they just happen to live too close to the English. John
 
What happened to Mr. Martin is a shame, but at least we're not reading a story about two wayward youths who accidentally slit his throat with an appropriated kitchen knife while innocently seeking shelter.

I suppose that's next...

Thanks, Glenn, I was already having a crappy day.
rolleyes.gif


SA Scott
 
The UK is a fascinating study for us as they always argued that they wanted to save their sports and gave away defense.

That's why I'm really down on the tool analogy as I think it leads to the UK scenario. However, then I argue for various
strategies that are seen as compromises and I am too soft in some eyes.

Such is life.
 
Had these two miscreants killed Mr. Martin during their little adventure I'm certain the local authorities would have sent them to some government run, tax supported institution for a brief stay where they could have been rehabilitated and returned to take their rightful place in civilized society.
pukey.gif
 
Obviously his daddy never told him about the three S's, Shoot Shovel & Shut up. As I have heard it said, if you are going to shoot a burgler, make sure you kill them so that there is only one story to be told.
 
Glenn:

No offense or disparagement intended. We somewhat hashed this out in the "defense of car" thread, and I generally agree with your position there (lethal force in protection of property).

I work redistributing federal tax dollars to low income people, so you won't find me at the Archie Bunker fan club meetings.

I suppose the demonization of self-defense in a blanket fashion frightens me, and that's how I read the media interpretation as presented. If Mr. Martin is as kooky as billed, then he gave us all a black eye.

SA Scott
 
SA Scott..
Not flaming nor trying to start a fight, however:
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>If Mr.
Martin is as kooky as billed, then he gave us all a black eye.[/quote]

Howso? The burglers were in his house. Martin didn't go out into the world and randomly pick someone to shoot. So Martin is a kook or a cranky old man, so what? Now we are to expect absolute conforming to a social standard of personality? Despite the hatchet job the paper did on him, they could only come up with 3 past incidents and only one where he actually shot.
He is a kook because he recognizes the facts that
1)his home is remote and vulnerable to thieves, so he has taken some actions to protect it...vis iron bars (horrors) and sleeps with his pants and boots on?
2) The police either can't or won't do anything about the obvious and known problem?

Sorry, nothing in this story convinces me that Martin is a murderer, nor what he did was the least bit unjustified.



------------------
"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes" RKBA!
 
DC:

None of Mr. Martin's actions seem to me more than a bit eccentric, except the "hatred for burglars" and "machinegunning Thieves" implications, as if to say he was looking for a fight.

IF he made those remarks, it was the type of injudicious language that feeds the crazy, violent gun-owner stereotype. Perhaps I overstated my point. In the act itself, I agree that he was justified.

SA Scott
 
One guy was 16 years old and the other was 30, between the two of them had 114 CONVICTIONS for burglary. You can only be convicted if caught. Guys, I am in the wrong line of work. I am going to England and be a thief for at least long enough to finance an extended vacation!!! Tremendous upside and little downside, unless you run into some criminal, gun-toting, psycho Brit, but that isn't bloody likely. Talk about easy pickings! What a bunch of sheep!
 
This is a sad story all around.

First of all, it's sad that the people of the UK have chosen the sort of society they live in. They've effectively banned self defense and put rural dwellers at the mercy of career criminals. Naturally, this has angered the victims and fostered an atmosphere of hate.

Secondly, it's sad that a couple of burglars with over a hundred convictions between them weren't behind bars. Assuming that they began their criminal careers at age 10, they couldn't have spent, on average, more than three months in jail for each conviction.

Third, it's sad that the situation made Mr. Martin a little unhinged. His record of irresponsible firearms usage and his statements of intent and desire to kill strongly suggest, to me at least, that he had some "issues".

Fourth, it's sad that the UK press has chosen to demonize Mr. Martin. Although I don't have much sympathy for him, I think the sinister depiction in the newspaper story is unfair. Really -- a missing step on a staircase is a "booby trap"?

Fifth, and most of all, it's sad to think that this could be a preview of things to come in the USA.
 
"Emneth has policing difficulties because of its rural location on the borders of Norfolk and Cambridgeshire: making it a target for the travelling criminal.

Farms around Norfolk have long attracted travelling people, who come to pick the fruits of the season. To Martin, they were all 'light-fingered pykies' and 'bastards'. Martin is not alone in his views. Speak to some locals and there seems to be a deep-seated hatred for the travelling community."


Interesting to see the segue from 'travelling criminals' to 'travelling people' and the 'travelling community'. Yes, just a bunch of nice folks, travelling from place to place, picking the 'fruits of the season' ... that is, stealing what they want.

I imagine that if I had spent literally decades of my life watching such b****rds stealing the fruit of my land, burlarizing my neighbors and attempting to burgle my home ... with apparently little interference from the police ... I might become a bit 'touched' as well.

Civilized? No, I don't think so. Socialized or communized ... I think that is more properly descriptive of this kind of environment. I reserve 'civilized' for a society where freedom and personal property are still respected fundamental rights. Otherwise, you might as well be in Zimbabwe, no?

Regards from AZ



[This message has been edited by Jeff Thomas (edited April 20, 2000).]
 
...sad that a couple of burglars with over a hundred convictions between them weren't behind bars.

Sad? It's the socialist manifesto in action. Real criminals are just "victims" of society. Notice how PC the article was about the GYPSIES. (There, I said it. The PC police should be knockin' at my door in a few minutes.)

OTOH, had this happened in the U.S., the shooter might be able to get off with an "insanity" defense. Obviously, in England, some animals are "more equal" than others....
 
Heed what I say.

You will notice that all new "crimes" that are invented are victimless.

Ever noticed that punishment for old-fashioned "victim" crimes are going down, and punishment for victimless crimes (saying the wrong thing, owning an unregistered firearm, etc.) are going up?


Battler.
 
Battler:

"Ever noticed that punishment for old-fashioned "victim" crimes are going down, and punishment for victimless crimes are going up?"


Sometimes things are so obvious that you miss them. You put it very succintly. I kinda wish you never pointed that out. I am feeling ill due to it's truth.




------------------
"Our cause has been aided by the deaths of all these children in all these schools, and in other settings. And I think we should pay tribute to them." - President Bill Clinton, dancing in the blood of children and pushing his irrelevant gun control laws, April 12, 2000, Scripps Howard News Service Interview
 
Well, Red Bull, get an air sickie bag because I hadn't finished explaining my assessment.

We're almost to the point to where we cannot distinctly identify theft as a (victim) crime. A burglar wants your possessions, he takes them, it is/was a crime. If he brings friends to help him with the looting, it's still a crime. If they have a bunch of criminal friends who also covet your stuff, and the criminal shares the loot with them, it is still a crime. Yet we accept the (ever-growing) redistribution (well, mostly extraction) of wealth by the collective.

Don't deny that it is taken by force. You pay taxes under threat of force - bad things happen to people who don't pay their taxes.

Oh; but you get protection for your taxes. Tell it to Mr. Corleone. If it's not voluntary, it's not voluntary.

Ironically, defense against this (victim) crime (not paying tax), is itself now a (victimless) crime - by not being robbed, you are a criminal - and the penalties of defending against taxation exceed that of being a burglar - for by keeping your own property, you have stolen from the "collective".

Currently, if you go into your private workshop and fashion a mechanical device from steel that functions in a manner prohibited by law (e.g. banned weapon) you have committed a crime. It is a victimless crime, yet the penalty far exceeds that of any (victim) crime short of murder.


So what am I getting at? In a true communist police state, any member of the population seeking individual freedom commits a victimless crime with severe penalties. All "victim" crimes (theft, torture, murder/execution) are committed by the collective/state.


Battler.
 
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