TV and Handgun advice...

I

IMTHDUKE

New member
Perhaps some saw this TV show about an "off the grid" family was trying to rescue a newbe family off grid in wilderness in Colorado.

At their homestead they have a bear problem, so one of the guys takes the woman of the homestead to the LGS to buy something to protect herself against bears...black bear I think. The woman had never fired a handgun and the guy recommended the .357mag wheel gun with a 4in barrel. Looked like a SW.

Now, my question to you and what I thought about, is that what I would recommend? She handled a .44Mag, she could not reach the trigger. I thought get the girl a 12gage with slugs. I would consider a .357mag a marginal weapon going up against a charging bear. Surprising was that the man helping the woman with the gun choice was an Alaskan who's father that was with them was a hunter guide in Alaska. What would you weapon other than a 155 self propelled howitzer going against a bear. Almost forget...yes shot placement is king and if you stab the bear with a sharp stick in the heart...all that ceded.
 
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I would recommend taking ALL tv shows with a large grain of salt. Especially anything in the so called "reality" genre.

She handled a .44Mag, she could not reach the trigger.
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This makes me curious, WHAT gun in .44 Mag could she not reach the trigger of??

I realize that with modern downloaded ammo, and only a 4" barrel, the .357 is far from its potential, but its still no slouch, and nothing to sneer at, even if you are a bear.

Also, I would point out that NO firearm is protection from a bear. The bear will no leave you alone because you have a gun, be it the mighty .44 or only the .357.

Firearms, PROPERLY USED are bear DEFENSE, not protection. Protection comes from using what's between your ears to not be attractive to the bear.

Or use the Miyagi defense, "No be there!"
 
Trying to learn anything useful from a tv show is really asking for trouble.
Surviving a bear attack can be compared to surviving an attack from any predator, two legged or four.
Choosing the gun is secondary.
First things first.
 
Should the need for a gun ever arise the best gun is the one you have on you or in arms reach. While I would much prefer a 12 gauge for bear (actually I would prefer something along the lines of a .375 Holland and Holland or even a .458 LOTT if I knew it was coming) to any pistol in case of bear attack I would prefer the pistol on my belt to the gun several yards away in the cabin even more.
 
Bear Problem?

I would have made a similar if not the same recomendation... Just my opinion but a .357 should be fine for a black bear. Keeping in mind that a handgun is always behind the curve in any case. A Rifle or Shotgun would be a much better choice. The handgun paired with a full can of bear spray would be the best combination IMO... but this is TV and the goal is to sell soap, not to give good advice.
 
1 load handgun
2 shoot tv
3 problem solved
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This is undoubtedly sound advice! I really should take it. My blood pressure would be better.

I would much rather she have a semiautomatic carbine in .223 than a .357 revolver in a bear encounter, or one in 30 caliber if she was comfortable shooting it. A semiautomatic shotgun would be a good choice. I would say a pump, but slugs in a pump produce more recoil than most novice woman shooters are able to tolerate. Any one of these long-guns would work fine for black bear, but if I knew I was going to be attacked by one, I'm with Lohman446; I will take a .375 H&H.
 
I suspect a 357 with a 158 grain hardcast or heavier bullet would be effective on black bear. Brown bear is a different matter.
 
.357 Mag 158 gr RN or JHP ...is not a great stopper for even a moderate sized Black Bear...you are going to have to make very good and accurate shots into vital areas of the chest or knock the shoulders out on him, to make that work. Its better than nothing ...but not a great first choice - and its going to be an "empty the gun" and hope for the best - and hope you have time to reload.

If a rifle is not an option ...then go at least to a .44 Mag...or .454 Casull or .475 Linebaugh ...to stop a bear. Small to average size Black Bear you're probably ok with a handgun ....big Black Bear or Grizzly or Brown Bear...not a great option ( but again, accurate shots to vital areas are really important ).

Black Bears, in general, are not usually dangerous and easy to deter / I've thrown rocks at them, yelled and waived my arms to drive them off, threw some fire wood at a couple of smaller bears on the cabin porch early one morning - even hit one in the muzzle with a cast iron frying pan that surprised me and snuck up beside me around a camp fire once while I was sitting in a lawn chair next to fire...( probably scared us both, scared me at least - but frying pan was laying right there on a rock at hand ... )... / but a Big Black Bear or a Sow with cubs can be bad news...and a Grizzly or Brown Bear is a whole different threat.
 
I'm thinkin that for the three people which on average are killed in North America each year by bears, no firearm would have been adequate to save them. Their luck was so bad that probably nothing could have saved them.:rolleyes:

Around 90 folks are killed by lightening in a year. Should they be packin a lightening rod.;) jd
 
I don't know how those people got killed with "lightening" maybe lightning?

:D

Your chances of getting killed by a bear are three times greater than winning the Powerball. I am telling my wife that if I get eaten by a bear she needs to go buy lotto tickets.
 
I don't know how those people got killed with "lightening" maybe lightning?
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Bill Dibble, I've gotta say that you have succeeded in making me feel like a doofus. :o Hopefully, I'll be able to return the favor some day. ;) jd
 
There are bears and then there are bears. Some of those giant browns in Alaska need a howitzer. However for most black bear I would feel comfortable with most anything I would shoot a good size person with in terms of caliber. I think my preference would be a wheel gun with hard cast bullets. In the case of your example, I think I would recommend bear spray backed up by a long gun or shotgun with 00 buck or buck/slug combo. In Alaska a handgun is really a last resort.

I have hiked around Colorado in bear areas with just my one of my Glock .40 which I always have with me. Had I actually planned hike before leaving AZ, I probably would have taken my SW .44 mag Mountain Gun. Its very light and smooth as silk. I love the gun and its one of those I have heard described as designed to be carried a lot and shot a little.

I have no interest in killing a bear and enjoy watching them. Having a bell on my pack is usually all that is needed. However, it you find yourself unexpectantly nose to nose with Yogi, the Mountain Gun will get it done.
 
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Recently P.Shoemaker had to kill a brown bear to protect his clients who were fishing in Alaska . 9mm ,Buffalo Bore ammo at very close range ! The first time in over 30 years he had to shoot a bear !! Yet it can be done but he had knowledge of bears , faith in the gun and ammo and his skill !
My choice would have been a 44mag mountain gun with premium ammo, BB or barnes all copper ,or hard cast SWC.
Never use OO buck , use slugs only for shotgun.
For african DG it's harder. A recent discription of a Cape Buffalo hunt -the heavy rifle bullet went through the animal end to end destroying heart and lungs but he kept coming.More rounds finally put him down.
Know what your hunting use an appropriate gun and practice often.:eek:
 
It would be interesting to know how many of those responding have 1) even seen a black bear, 2) own and use the kind of gun they recommend and 3) ever shot a bear of any kind with anything.

Jim
 
It would be interesting to know how many of those responding have 1) even seen a black bear, 2) own and use the kind of gun they recommend and 3) ever shot a bear of any kind with anything.
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1. I have seen a black bear.
2. No, I do not own a 375 H&H or a semiautomatic shotgun.
3. Have not even said a harsh word to a bear.
 
James, since you asked....

I grew up in Montana in 50's and 60's--- and in those days we hunted white tail deer, mule deer, elk and black bear. Not a lot of money --- but we hunted...and most years we killed two or three average sized black bear ( 200 lbs or so )...and my grandmother, who ran the family --- told us how many lbs of bear, venison and elk she wanted for family....

My grandfather and dad ran the hunting camp - but they respected her rules....she also supervised all the cutting and wrapping...and based on her recipe -- we ground 1 part bear to 2 parts venison into big patties, with spices, as a country sausage patty that she fried for breakfast usually - in bacon grease. It was great - and we ate a lot of it. Bear meat fat offset the dryness of the venison - and made great sausage ( I spent a lot of time cubing up meat and grinding it thru one of those old grinders on the back screen porch in the fall ). Grandpa, my dad, uncles, etc and i all hunted collectively -- and in our extended family of several households....we killed ( most years)....2 black bear, several deer and 3 or 4 elk.....and in those days your license allowed 1 elk, 2 deer ( either sex) and no limit on bear.

Occasionally Grandma would cook a black bear roast ...but I never liked it much. The sausage was great....but the roast was an acquired taste..even as a pot roast -- tender, but not great --- .like liver & onions and a few other things that I tried to stay away from .

I always carried a S&W revolver ( .38 spl or later a .357 mag ) in woods as a backup....but all the black bear I killed ( probably 8 or 9 ) were taken with rifles ( 30-40 Krag or 30-06). They were all 1 or 2 shot kills at relatively close range ( 50 - 75 yds ) usually when we were stalking deer as a bear happened to be in area or on a gut pile sometimes. But I have only killed black bear as a game animal....never in defense out hiking or camping etc ....and at the ranch we always had outside dogs that kept bears away from house and gardens or barns...

I have had to only kill one grizzly...an old, lame bear....near our hunting camp ....grandpa and I were together & tracked him / I had the .30-40 Krag and he had a 30.06 ...at about 75 yds, about 6 or 7 Rds between us, to make sure he stayed down...we turned carcass over to Fish & Game ( an uncle ) for inspection research & disposal...

I have never killed or never wanted to kill a black bear with a handgun....
 
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