Training Idea

[BluesBear]

That's why I advocate the rid-cage theory. There are plenty of nice blood filled, squishy bits inside there to active a good hollow point.

There's no such thing as magic bullets. If there were then every police department in the country would be using them.
Choose a quality load from from of the major players and run with it.
As Charlie Petty says, "Devote less time to worrying about your ammo and more time learning to shoot better."
Unless you get a good hit the boiler room or the snot locker/brainbox you're just poling holes.

Now having said that (and here's where I will catch a whole lot of hell),
in warmer weather, I often carry Glaser Safety Slugs as my first two rounds. When they work they work unbelievably well! But they're just not all that good against really heavy clothing so I don't load them exclsively.

In cold weather I often carry a hardcast Keith style lead semi-wadcutter as the last round or two in case I need the increaded penetration.
I use a load that will hit as close to the point of impact as its preceeding hollow pointed brethren.
A sharp shouldered SWC will cut a nice hole. And getting the blood out and letting the air in is very important.

And in some of the smaller calibers a deep penetrating SWC can work better than a hollow point.

 

[FM12]

JoeBlackSpade: Where can I get me a set of sights the size of those in your previous post. I think at my age even I could see those!

 

[JoeBlackSpade]

JoeBlackSpade: Where can I get me a set of sights the size of those in your previous post. I think at my age even I could see those!

That about made me spit out my coffee! Tell you what, that's our little 10 million dollar invention. P.M. me later and we'll talk about getting a patent on it. Gotta think of a name for them...

How about:

Cannon Ball Optics (?)
Castle Moat Sights
USS Kitty Hawk Sight System
CS4S (Can't See 4 S***) Sights





Bear: So you take the same approach with your handgun that I take with my Mossberg 500- sequence your rounds in a custom order. I load 2 buck, 2 slugs, 2 buck.

Curious, but how many guys do you think are packing their mags with several different types of ammunition? I'd wager the man who does is few and far between, but it really makes sense, although I was hoping you'd expound on the hot weather/cold weather aspect, when it comes to the Glaser. Is the coating/filling subject to substantial changes in its break-up properties in extreme temperatures? You said you want them in hot weather, so I assume that means they're softer in such conditions.

Also, what about a Magnum Glaser? Can custom loads like that be made, to get the penetration of a magnum with the expansion of a Glaser?

 

[Night Watch]

Mostly in the wintertime I alternate JHP and FMJ in my magazines.

Sometimes I've been criticized for doing this; but, my year's of shooting at all different sorts of targets have convinced me that JHP's and, either, winter clothing or barricades can be a problem. If you're worried about what's behind your target, either kneel before firing or move to a different position and engage the target from another angle.

Don't forget any bullet that misses can be a huge potential problem; and, I'll just bet that bystanders are in far greater danger from the multitude of rounds that frequently miss than from the comparatively few hits that will overpenetrate.

I don't see anything wrong with hitting low, either; after all, that's where Ayoob's, 'pelvic girdle' is located. By the way, from everything I've read Fackler has always hated the Glaser, 'Safety Slug'.

 

[BluesBear]

no big mystery

The Glaser is considered to be a "pre-fragmented" round. Instead of expanding it releases a large amount of very little birdshot (#12 in the blue & #6 in the silver) almost like a miniature fragmentation grenade.
It's designed to break up whenever it encounters a hard surface hence the "Safety" part of its name.

The same ball (except for colour) is used in the nose of both the Glaser Safety Slug and the Glaser Pow'R'ball bullets. It's planty tough.
Temperature has nothing to do with the ammuniton. It just alters the target.
So it's possible that if a GSS were to engountere a buckle or a heavy zipper pull or anything hard in the pocket of a jacket it could break up prematurely.
I have heard claims of it breaking up merely on heavy clothing but I've never been able to duplicate that in testing.
So that's the reason I usually don't use them in heavy coat weather.


Glasers are already loaded to a very high velocity. That's a must have with light shot since it tends to lose momentum very fast.


I strongly advise the same precautions if you're using Mag-Safe ammunition. Since the ultra light SWAT loadings by Mag-Safe have the scalloped edges of the jacket exposed it IS possible to make it fragment through heavy clothing.


Also the reason I don't load more than two* is that they might be semi-hard cover involved after the first few shots. By there very nature Glasers and Mag-Safes do not defeat hard cover. I figure my first two shots will be out in the open. I know I will be rapidly moving to a position of better safety so I must presume my opponent will do so likewise. If there is still a threat I don't want my fire thwarted by an overturned Starbuck's table.


Now to put this back in perspective with the thread topic...
And once again I appologize for contributing to thread drift.
This is another good reason to NOT use pre-fragmented ammo exclusively.
As fellow member Strong observed in his original post, IF your target(s) is covered with oversized baggy clothing as an attempt to disquise their body shape, it's sometimes easy to miss the vitals. And pre-fragmented ammunition just doesn't work well on the peripheral locations.
It will create a very nasty flesh wound but unless an artery is hit it's usually not fatal if promptly treated.
Glasers and Mag-Safes have their place in the toolbox. But they're not for everybody.
One huge drawback is you need a home equity loan to afford very many.
They can be extremely effective°, however, shot placement becomes even more critical.

The bottom line is, no matter what ammunition you use, there is no substitute for accuracy.
Accuracy is a skill, not a gift.
Practice Safe!
Practice Hard!
Practice OFTEN!




*In a magazine holding eight or more rounds I've been known to load two GSS in the mag and another in the chamber for a total of three out of nine+. However I'm a true dinosaur so I'm usually carrying a large bore revolver.


°(read Ayoob's book with the story of the restaraunt shooting where the good guy had a snub .44 loaded with six Glasers)