Topping off your mag...good idea or bad?

[sterno]

I'd like to top it off, but I just can't figure out how to get that extra bullet in my revolver?

 

[gordo_gun_guy]

inveterate non-topper-offer

I don't usually top off; at work it's due to the administrative hassle of the extra round, and at home due to reliability concerns and--I'll admit it--laziness.

With my 1911, I carry an eight rounder cocked and locked, with two 10rd CMC spares. As for statistics, it's not a matter of how many fights were stopped with nine rounds; it's how many more fights were stopped at the ninth round than at the eighth.

I do rotate the top round frequently, and check for bullet setback. However, in eleven years of carrying CCW, I only once had a round shortened by frequent cycling, which was a 115 gr 9mm Win Silvertip in my P-11.

Thanks to unit-funded Mag-Pull rebuild kits, I load 30 in my 30 rounders with zero malfunctions to date--except when initially chambering a round without seating the mag hard and when, for grins, I've tried topping off. I think, due to the longer skirt on the Mag-pull follower, there's more pressure when seating a full 30 against a closed bolt. Carrying Army style, chambering a round when leaving the wire, I'm totally comfortable with 30s. If I ever have to carry my M-4 with Air Force rules ("bolt-forward load!"), I'll probably stick with 29 or fewer to be safe.

I NEVER top off my P-3AT; it just won't run with 7.

 

[chris in va]

The *only* thing I can think of is what happens to my Sig 220. With one chambered, a full mag is fairly difficult to click in properly. I found this out the hard way first time I carried it. Got home to check things over like I usually do, the mag wasn't fully seated. It would have been a single shot pistol.

Note: Just so everyone knows I've never had a problem firing it with a full mag.

 

[warrior poet]

From Gordo:

Thanks to unit-funded Mag-Pull rebuild kits, I load 30 in my 30 rounders with zero malfunctions to date--except when initially chambering a round without seating the mag hard and when, for grins, I've tried topping off. I think, due to the longer skirt on the Mag-pull follower, there's more pressure when seating a full 30 against a closed bolt.

Wow. When is the USMC going to get funds for stuff like that? Oh yeah, I forgot... we have to beg the Navy for money.

 

[workingstiff]

+1 Revolver

I'd like to top it off, but I just can't figure out how to get that extra bullet in my revolver?

Sterno, it's easy. Flip,the cylinder open and put one in the pipe. I've carried this way for years and thankfully, have never had to use it. I always remove the +1 round before I practice at the range because they don't allow rapid fire there.

 

[wyocarp]

JohnKsa, I understand the process thank you very much. I was commenting that I noticed no difference in the amount of pressure needed to insert a new magazine either way in my G20.

 

[mountainclmbr]

I practice what I shoot. If there are problems I might change before getting a different gun. But, maybe not. I have not changed from full capacity yet.

 

[IdahoG36]

I always load my first mag to capacity and then chamber a round, and my spare mags are loaded to one less than maximum capacity. It is less stress on the mag springs and helps them to last longer and perform reliably.
For all of you that state the "need" for that extra round in a SD handgun, the average self defense shooting is over in three rounds or less fired.
I used to be in that camp. I felt the need to carry 25-30 rounds for my CCW. Then I realized a few things-
A)If I need 25-30 rounds of handgun ammunition in a SD situation, I am in over my head and should have brought a rifle.
B)Shot placement is king.
C)We don't have roaming gangs of criminals where I live.
D)Zombies aren't real.
My winter carry gun is a Springfield XD .45acp Compact, and for summertime carry, a NAA Guardian .32 acp. 10 rounds and 7 rounds respectively.
It took me a while to overcome this "need" to carry a ton of ammunition for my CCW, but I looked at my surroundings, the community I live in, and the low crime rate, and realized that I am well armed with 7 or 10 rounds.

 

[Wuchak]

Yes, always. The P-3AT is the only semi I carry and I want the extra round of .380. I shoot it this way at the range so I know it's reliable. Mag springs are made to be under compression. If the extra little bit of pressure on the top round from having the mag in the gun is a concern then it's time to change to better magazine springs.

 

[Boris Bush]

Wuchak

I carry my P32 the same way and always top it off at the range before I shoot. It has never failed me. I agree on the mag spring thing too. I will add, the engineers that make them probably expect the mags to be fully loaded and in the mag well locked.

FWIW I had an older SIG P226 that was a tight fit fully loaded, and I got a newer machined slide one and it worked fine with a fully loaded mag inserted on a forward slide, with the same exact mags.......

 

[IdahoG36]

I should have clarified in my post, I will top off my single stack mags, but not my double stack. My NAA Guardian .32acp has a mag capacity of 6 rounds, so I chamber a round and top it off. I just don't top off my double stack mags.

 

[JohnKSa]

wyocarp,

You said:

I just got out my G20 and noticed absolutely no difference between having a bullet down the pipe or not when locking a fully loaded magazine in place.

"Having a bullet down the pipe" means that a round is chambered. Whether or not a round is chambered has no effect on how much effort it takes to lock in a fully loaded mag. Is that not what you meant to say?

. I was commenting that I noticed no difference in the amount of pressure needed to insert a new magazine either way in my G20.

Ok, just to refresh my memory I snagged one of my brand new G20 hi-caps (never been loaded) and filled it up. Then, with the slide forward (i.e. not locked back) I locked the mag into place in a G20, removed the mag, stripped a round out and locked it into the G20 again. BIG difference--it's significantly easier with the magazine downloaded by one. Dunno what else to say 'bout that...

 

[nemoaz]

Never heard of any federal agency, state/local LE agency, or any military that teaches carrying one less round than capacity in a pistol Nor any experts. Lotsa independent testing and shooting going on, yet no one suggests carrying less than full capacity in a quality handgun. I'll keep doing what the real experts recommend, carrying my pistols at full capacity, 12+1, 15+1 whatever.

Longarms- many teach to carry less than full capacity. My UMP and AR mags are two rounds down. Never heard of a problem with a pump shotgun carrying its capacity.

 

[JohnKSa]

..yet no one suggests carrying less than full capacity in a quality handgun.

As I pointed out earlier, Beretta suggests it in their 92/96 pistols. They don't fit into one of the categories of groups you list, but it's hard to totally discount what they say about their own firearms in the owner's manuals.

If you read this article you'll find another company that recommends downloading their pistol mags by a round. http://www.handgunsmag.com/featured_handguns/HG_1207_07/

From a practical standpoint, if you have a gun like my G20 where it can be hard to seat a fully loaded magazine, downloading it by a round makes it much less likely that you'll bobble a reload by failing to seat the magazine.

Again, I'm not saying it's a must/should kind of thing, but clearly in some cases manufacturers seem to believe there's a benefit and it's not hard to see how it could help in certain guns and certain situations.

 

[Creature]

I do rotate the top round frequently, and check for bullet setback.

Wouldn't crimping prevent setback? Maybe this is a whole other topic, but what causes set back and why is it such a big deal?

 

[David Armstrong]

Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. The basic rule is that for double stacks I download. Some older studies showed that the most likely malfunction for double stacks was with the first round in a fully loaded mag. Don't know if that is still true after 30 years, but I'll take probable reliability over probable need for 1 more round. Browning used to (again, 30 years ago) recommend 1 round down in their Hi-Power mags. If I don't have at least 1/4" of compression left I will also download a round for ease in seating the mag.

 

[Mannlicher]

yes, I always chamber a round, then remove the magazine, and top it off. Just no reason not to do it.
My 1911 guns, and my CZ guns don't seem to mind a bit.

 

[BloodyBucket03]

Topping Off Mag

I never top of my mags. You will end up stressing out the springs in your magazine and when you having to use your weapon in a situation a chance of having a jam can occur. So what I do is I load my mags at half capacity + 1 in the chamber and every couple weeks I rotate my mags around.

 

[JohnKSa]

what causes set back and why is it such a big deal?

Setback is when the bullet is pushed back into the case. It can happen to a round during chambering if it is not crimped properly or to a round that is repeatedly chambered, even if it IS crimped properly.

Setback reduces the case volume which, in turn, increases chamber pressure upon firing. Some calibers/loadings are particularly sensitive to setback (notably the 180gr .40S&W) and in a round that is sensitive to setback the pressure increase can be sufficient to cause damage to the firearm.

So what I do is I load my mags at half capacity + 1 in the chamber and every couple weeks I rotate my mags around.

Underloading by two rounds is pretty conservative--underloading by half AND rotating your mags every couple of weeks is overkill.

 

[shiky]

and its also harmful to the springs in the mags. Keeping springs compressed does not wear them out...thats just an old wives tale. constantly compressing and depressing them will.