Topping off your 1911

Glenn E. Meyer

New member
So the other day, I was loaded up a gentleman for a match. If you shoot a 1911, standard procedure is to insert a mag and chamber a round. Then you insert a fully loaded mag. The mag used for the first round is stowed as your Barney mag.

This guy racks open his 1911 and drops a round into the chamber and then closes the slide overhand.

I recall being told that this is a bad idea because of the potential of a bad thing going boom, if the round wasn't firmly seated and might jiggle into the extractor for instance.

Truth to all this? It made me quite uncomfortable. The gentleman also kept the round in his mouth until he opened the gun.
 
It can and will break an extractor. Ive seen it happen personally, twice.

1911's are meant to feed from the mag. If you want to upload, you do it from a mag, then top off the mag and reinsert.
 
That's what I thought. Next time, if I'm dealing with this gentleman, I will try to help him out.
One of the weaknesses of the human condition is that they cannot accept being told they are wrong...it causes negative emotions. It would be much safer to just let him bend/break a few extractors. :)
 
One of the weaknesses of the human condition is that they cannot accept being told they are wrong...it causes negative emotions. It would be much safer to just let him bend/break a few extractors.

Yeah. I don't have this particular bad habit (single loading rounds) but if I did I might react like dahermit mentioned above if somebody told me about it, (corrected me) at the range.

Yet, "discovering" this item by myself here on the forum I'm taking ownership of the information and will use it like it was my own idea.

(Shrug)

Strange thing being human.
 
Another thing that is misunderstood about racking the slide without the magazine is that if you have had custom trigger work done to your 1911 that the inertia from the slide racking is that it will ruin the work done. Something to do with the kinetic energy and the sear.
 
Ran in to a guy at the range who had hurried quickly out of the house and forgot his magazines, so he asked if he could borrow some 1911 mags if we had some and we did. He invited us over to check out his two 1911 pistols and both were nice-- one of them was a Wilson Combat.

He offered them up to see and we asked if we could dry fire and try out the very nice trigger and he was fine with that but insisted we use a snap cap, which he dropped in the chamber and slammed the slide closed over.:eek:

On all pistols, oh yeah -- bad way to treat an extractor. On a 1911, it usually means that you'll soon have to learn how to tune an extractor.

Tried to pass the word in the friendliest way possible, but his Wilson would be better off in the long run if he threw his snap caps in to the weeds rather than ever dropping the slide over them (or live ammo) ever again.
 
I learn something new every day. I have always chambered a round from the magazine and not sure why other than it must be an old but good habit. Maybe a good instructor taught me to do so back in my Army days where I first fired a semi-auto in the form of a M1911A1.

It could be I was afraid I would swallow the round. Then we could start a thread on whether the round still fired after recovering it. :)
 
If a live round gets swallowed, is it considered a nutritional supplement?
Probably have to be careful what else gets eaten along with it.
Definitely no broccoli.
The consequences could be deafening.
 
When I was competing in uspsa i would top off from another mag (always carried many more than ever needed) then load from whichever mag I wanted to start with.
 
Two questions

Does it make a difference if your 1911 pistol has an internal extractor or an external extractor?

If, when you put the round into the pistol, you place it such that the extractor engages the extractor groove on the cartridge, then ride the slide (all the way) home gently. This particular manipulation may not be easy to do, but it is doable. Probably more trouble than it's worth, though.

Lost Sheep
 
Yeah, not so much a problem of things going boom, but of breaking an extractor is the big problem. I think the biggest threat of things going boom would be swallowing the round, waiting a while and then dropping a deuce in a freshly dug outhouse with a rocky bottom! Now THAT would enhance a rapid bowel movement!!!:eek:
 
Does it make a difference if your 1911 pistol has an internal extractor or an external extractor?

This was answered above. I'll just add that's it useful to simply treat all guns the same. Much simpler than trying to remember what guns you can do what with as the decades, guns and designs pass by. Load them all the same.

The 1911 was designed for the fresh round to feed from the magazine under spring pressure by sliding upward just behind the extractor claw so the claw engages the semi-rim of the case. The semi-rim does not ride over the face of the extractor in regular practice. But it does do this when first loaded into a chamber and then the slide is dropped on it. The latter is where undue wear can take place.

If you want to have a fully loaded mag in the gun plus one in the chamber: With the slide locked back insert a full magazine. Lower the slide to load a round in the chamber. Eject the mag and load a fresh round in it to top off the mag. Insert the mag in the well.

If you have developed the habit of dropping a round in the chamber of a semi, loose the habit. Except in an emergency there is no reason to do it and it's sloppy. Yes, I know small hideout tip up Beretta's and some others are built to be loaded by dropping a round in the chamber, and many guns it's no problem mechanically to do so, but as a matter of simplicity and ease...simply load them all the same.

tipoc
 
I have an instructional video hosted by Jeff Cooper, and he does some gun manipulations. Afterwards, he drops the previously ejected round in the chamber and closes the slide on it.
I think he was one of the foremost advocates of not letting the slide slam shut on an empty chamber as a means of protecting a trigger job, and of not loading the gun by letting the slide slam shut on a loaded chamber, to protect the extractor.
But, the extractor is designed so it will snap over the rim of a loaded round, and if your gun is inertia-feeding, with the round getting out ahead of the slide, your extractor might be snapping over the rim with every shot.
If the extractor cannot deflect enough for the rounded or angled tip to get over the rim without the extractor binding against the tunnel wall, you risk breaking it.

Corrected last sentence so it makes sense. :)
 
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Glenn,

It's never good to do this. The extractor on an M1911A1 battle pistol isn't meant for such abuse. Best to convert mag 1 to a Barney mag as you say, and load from the magazine.
 
For my 1911s with external extractors, I've found a good way to put one in the pipe without having to feed it from a mag (and exposing the round to set back from multiple chamberings). I simply drop the round in the chamber, gently ride the slide forward until the extractor touches the rim of the cartridge, then squeeze the rear end of the extractor so I lift the hook over the rim. The round simply slides into place at this point.

I find that by loading this way, I can make SD rounds last longer without having to change them or shoot them off. I never allow any of my SD loads to be chambered more than twice. Of course, there's no way to do this with 1911s using the traditional internal extractors.
 
So no need to ride the extractor, well how bout me Sig or Smith and Wesson? Until I saw those weapons had an external extractor I had some interest. After I heard or learned I dropped to zero. So Don't chamber load.
 
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