I've made the decision to have this heavy weight altered a bit by rebarreling it to 40-70 SS. I talked with Shiloh about it and if I keep the same barrel length, style(octagon) and weight I can keep my original fore end and not have to replace it. I think I'm going that route and be able to enjoy it more. They told me they were getting ready to cut some more 30" barrels next week so I'll get in quickly on the rebarrel job.
Too Much gun
- Thread starter ColColt
- Start date
ColColt:
More weight would help--but changing that stock to one with a wider footprint will really help the recoil issue. Also, I note that you're using 2F. That's a faster burning granulation, and as such it will whomp the crud out of you. Try a few loads of 1F, and a recoil pad. Same charge weight and everything. You should notice a difference.
More weight would help--but changing that stock to one with a wider footprint will really help the recoil issue. Also, I note that you're using 2F. That's a faster burning granulation, and as such it will whomp the crud out of you. Try a few loads of 1F, and a recoil pad. Same charge weight and everything. You should notice a difference.
I have to think the shotgun style butt wouldn't have done to me what the steel crescent did. It's like getting bucked off a horse...you get "gun shy" of trying it again. I debated taking it out one more time but after looking at these bruises that I have now, almost two weeks now, traveled down my arm to within two inches of my wrist and around the back of my forearm the more I want to swap that barrel. No sense in getting beat up like that. Shooting's suppose to be fun, not painful.
The rifle weighs 11 pounds 8 oz which is about as heavy as I care to lug around. I even bought a Lead Sled Plus in hopes of taming the recoil but after it arrived and I put it together I looked at it and thought how dumb to have to use such a device to go the range. I may never use it. I bought two 25 lb bags of shot to go in the tray as they recommended so between those and the weight of the Sled you're talking 65 pounds to put on the bench in conjunction with the rifle. I also bought a LimbSaver and while it fits my Browning 45-70 perfect, it wont fit the curved butt plate of the Sharps very well.
i bought and received yesterday several pounds of Swiss 1 1/2 to try but think I'll just use it in the 45-70 and the 40-70SS when I go with the rebarrel. I hate doing that and feel disappointed in having to do so but I see little alternative. I doubt it will make me look like a truck hit me like the 45-90 has. They told me I could keep the 45-90 barrel to just let them know. Shiloh recommended the 30-40 Krag brass for the 40-70SS.
The rifle weighs 11 pounds 8 oz which is about as heavy as I care to lug around. I even bought a Lead Sled Plus in hopes of taming the recoil but after it arrived and I put it together I looked at it and thought how dumb to have to use such a device to go the range. I may never use it. I bought two 25 lb bags of shot to go in the tray as they recommended so between those and the weight of the Sled you're talking 65 pounds to put on the bench in conjunction with the rifle. I also bought a LimbSaver and while it fits my Browning 45-70 perfect, it wont fit the curved butt plate of the Sharps very well.
i bought and received yesterday several pounds of Swiss 1 1/2 to try but think I'll just use it in the 45-70 and the 40-70SS when I go with the rebarrel. I hate doing that and feel disappointed in having to do so but I see little alternative. I doubt it will make me look like a truck hit me like the 45-90 has. They told me I could keep the 45-90 barrel to just let them know. Shiloh recommended the 30-40 Krag brass for the 40-70SS.
Hunter Customs
New member
ColColt,
You are right shooting should be enjoyable; if you want to have your rifle barreled to a different caliber I can think of no reason why you should not.
I do think you should keep your other barrel, after all you paid for it.
I can't understand a company keeping parts that a customer has paid for, the part or parts is not the companies to keep.
Best Regards
Bob Hunter
www.huntercustoms.com
You are right shooting should be enjoyable; if you want to have your rifle barreled to a different caliber I can think of no reason why you should not.
I do think you should keep your other barrel, after all you paid for it.
I can't understand a company keeping parts that a customer has paid for, the part or parts is not the companies to keep.
Best Regards
Bob Hunter
www.huntercustoms.com
sc928porsche
New member
Drop the weight of that bullet. That will reduce the recoil. I find that the 530 grain in 45-120 is quite stout. The 405 grain is more pleasant to shoot. You may want to drop to 300 grain.
Get one of these. Rand Elite Recoil Shield. They are worth their weight in gold and really work.
http://www.buffaloarms.com/shoulder_recoil_pads_pr-4019.aspx
I use mine for not only my BPCRs but my other heavy hitters also, (458 Win, 375 H&H, 416 Rigby) plus I use them under my shooting jacket when shooting my steel but plate Vintage Military rifles.
Shooting is suppose to be fun, this recoil shield puts the fun back into the heavy hitters.
PLUS they are legal for use in the CMP's vintage rifle games, where the add on recoil pads aren't.
They are comfortable, and you don't notice you're wearing them until you find the lack of bruises some of those pictures show.
http://www.buffaloarms.com/shoulder_recoil_pads_pr-4019.aspx
I use mine for not only my BPCRs but my other heavy hitters also, (458 Win, 375 H&H, 416 Rigby) plus I use them under my shooting jacket when shooting my steel but plate Vintage Military rifles.
Shooting is suppose to be fun, this recoil shield puts the fun back into the heavy hitters.
PLUS they are legal for use in the CMP's vintage rifle games, where the add on recoil pads aren't.
They are comfortable, and you don't notice you're wearing them until you find the lack of bruises some of those pictures show.
tahunua001
New member
have you tried a shooters jacket? yes they would be miserable in the summer but a lot of the guys out here that shoot comp swear by them. you could also try trail boss powder. it simulates black powder and it is very light recoiling in everything I've tried with it.
We've seen a lot of opinions here over your problem, and I think you are probably taking the best approach in my opinion. Our guns are meant for fun and if they hurt us or if we have to go to unusual lengths to be able to shoot them....why bother? Your 40/70, or even a 40/65 would be a joy to shoot in that heavy rifle and you wouldn't have to carry pads, sleds, shot and all that other stuff to the range with you and grit your teeth when you pull the trigger.
I would suggest making sure of all arrangements with Shiloh beforehand. If you even ship it to them in a gun case, you will have it returned to you with a bill for it's shipping. Regardless of the case you send it in, they will sell you one of theirs for the return shipment. Shipping can add a lot of expense with them and you can figure on about 200 bucks in that dept. before you are done.
I would suggest making sure of all arrangements with Shiloh beforehand. If you even ship it to them in a gun case, you will have it returned to you with a bill for it's shipping. Regardless of the case you send it in, they will sell you one of theirs for the return shipment. Shipping can add a lot of expense with them and you can figure on about 200 bucks in that dept. before you are done.
ColColt,
Thank you for starting an interesting thread.
My father developed a formula for parabolic taper in a hydraulic cylinder for constant recoil force over a distance.
I figured out that recoil pads distribute recoil over time, area, and shape:
a) Time takes a thick pad to slow the rifle down slowly.
b) Area takes a tall wide pad.
c) Shape takes a pad soft enough to comply with the shoulder shape.
Pain threshold is ~ 20 psi on the skin. We need enough recoil pad to stay below 20 psi everywhere, and we can shoot all day.
The best I can do is the largest Limbsaver grind to fit, and then I do not grind it.
same image as below link
Thank you for starting an interesting thread.
My father developed a formula for parabolic taper in a hydraulic cylinder for constant recoil force over a distance.
I figured out that recoil pads distribute recoil over time, area, and shape:
a) Time takes a thick pad to slow the rifle down slowly.
b) Area takes a tall wide pad.
c) Shape takes a pad soft enough to comply with the shoulder shape.
Pain threshold is ~ 20 psi on the skin. We need enough recoil pad to stay below 20 psi everywhere, and we can shoot all day.
The best I can do is the largest Limbsaver grind to fit, and then I do not grind it.
same image as below link
Attachments
Jimmie Crickets, Wyosmith, is that a 1 bore?
Like a lot of other posters I wouldn't give up on the .45-90 quite yet.
I'd follw all the advise about lighter loads shoulder pads etc.
You also might want to look at shooting sticks instead of bench rest. Once you're off the bench recoil seems much less.
Like a lot of other posters I wouldn't give up on the .45-90 quite yet.
I'd follw all the advise about lighter loads shoulder pads etc.
You also might want to look at shooting sticks instead of bench rest. Once you're off the bench recoil seems much less.
I made it for a man in Illinois who is a collector or large caliber rifles. He doesn't hunt anything. He just likes to shoot big guns.
I am the first man in over 150 years to make a 2 bore hunting rifle for sure, and it's probable that I am the 1st man ever to make one. This doesn't count wall guns or whaling guns.
My old apprentice Colin Stolzer is now making a living producing huge rifles and he has made more 2 bore than anyone in history. He and several other men have done quite a lot of research on the subject and one man has now written a book on it. According to them they have never found a true sporting rifle made in 2 bore anywhere in the world until I made the one in the picture.
It's totally impractical. But sure is a show stopper when he brings it to the range.
You must load it to such a slow velocity just so the gun doesn’t seriously injure or kill you with recoil.
If we look at the scale of powder to ball weight in muzzleloaders starting at about 58 caliber and working up to an 8 bore, we get a general idea of what is necessary to give velocities in the 1400 FPS range.
Scaling up at this rate the service charge for a 2 bore "should be" about 1100 grains of powder but the recoil of such a load would be injurious or maybe fatal.
Some light pack howitzers made in the 1840s were about 2 bore and they weigh about 350 pounds when set up on the carriage. Recoil propels them back about 28" to 3 feet when fired with 1100 grains of cannon powder.
This rifle weighs only 24 pounds so you can do the math on that and see why I am not exaggerating at all when I say such a load would not be something you would fire from your shoulder.
So this gun is used with a charge of 300-400 grains.. Still…..it’s more power than you might think. My customer tells me that with 300 grains of powder the balls exit 10” elm trees. A heavy steel target which easily stops a 458 Lott cold, was taken off the target burm and placed back behind it about 6 feet.
Too much gun!
But fun if you can handel it.
I can't.
The owner of that gun weighs well over 300 pounds and it back him up a LOT when he shoots it.
I am the first man in over 150 years to make a 2 bore hunting rifle for sure, and it's probable that I am the 1st man ever to make one. This doesn't count wall guns or whaling guns.
My old apprentice Colin Stolzer is now making a living producing huge rifles and he has made more 2 bore than anyone in history. He and several other men have done quite a lot of research on the subject and one man has now written a book on it. According to them they have never found a true sporting rifle made in 2 bore anywhere in the world until I made the one in the picture.
It's totally impractical. But sure is a show stopper when he brings it to the range.
You must load it to such a slow velocity just so the gun doesn’t seriously injure or kill you with recoil.
If we look at the scale of powder to ball weight in muzzleloaders starting at about 58 caliber and working up to an 8 bore, we get a general idea of what is necessary to give velocities in the 1400 FPS range.
Scaling up at this rate the service charge for a 2 bore "should be" about 1100 grains of powder but the recoil of such a load would be injurious or maybe fatal.
Some light pack howitzers made in the 1840s were about 2 bore and they weigh about 350 pounds when set up on the carriage. Recoil propels them back about 28" to 3 feet when fired with 1100 grains of cannon powder.
This rifle weighs only 24 pounds so you can do the math on that and see why I am not exaggerating at all when I say such a load would not be something you would fire from your shoulder.
So this gun is used with a charge of 300-400 grains.. Still…..it’s more power than you might think. My customer tells me that with 300 grains of powder the balls exit 10” elm trees. A heavy steel target which easily stops a 458 Lott cold, was taken off the target burm and placed back behind it about 6 feet.
Too much gun!
But fun if you can handel it.
I can't.
The owner of that gun weighs well over 300 pounds and it back him up a LOT when he shoots it.
