Third Circuit Weighs In on Scrutiny for Second Amendment

[Aguila Blanca]

I'm also quite sure that the law treats guns that never had a serial number becuase, when manufactured, there was no requirement that they have a serial number, quite differently from guns that were manufactured with a serial number that was subsequently removed.

I believe you would be correct. It is extremely difficult to obliterate, obscure, remove or alter something that never existed.

 

[Aguila Blanca]

Selling stolen firearms with obliterated serial numbers is not a lawful purpose.

And such are not normally possessed by law-abiding citizens.

An interesting ancillary question that I would like to see questioned is the portion of the Federal law regarding possession of firearms with removed or altered serial numbers that provides for the purpose of that law that the person found in possession of the firearm is presumed to be the person who performed the removal or alteration. So if a serial number on a firearm manufactured in 1969 was removed in 1970, the gun was subsequently sold six times, and you are found in possession of it in 2010 ... the law says you are guilty of removing or altering the serial number. Period.

To me, that seems highly unconstitutional.

 

[44 AMP]

Presumption of guilt?

So if a serial number on a firearm manufactured in 1969 was removed in 1970, the gun was subsequently sold six times, and you are found in possession of it in 2010 ... the law says you are guilty of removing or altering the serial number. Period.

It does seem to be a presumption of guilt.

But if the serial number was removed in 1970 (or at any time), how do you determine the gun was made in 1969?

With pre-68 guns, which never had a serial number, it is fairly simple, as those guns will not have a place where the serial number was removed/altered/defaced.

Now, consider this one; suppose the gun was made in 1950, with a serial number, and the number was removed in 1960? Legal at the time? or not?
After all, the serial number was not required until the GCA 68, right?

I believe that even before 1968, obliterating an existing serial number was a criminal act. I'm not certain, but I think it was. What the GCA 68 did was require serial numbers on all new made firearms (along with a lot of other things).

 

[Aguila Blanca]

But if the serial number was removed in 1970 (or at any time), how do you determine the gun was made in 1969?

I have no idea -- I chose that to make a point. Maybe it was a model that was first manufactured in 1969.

Now, consider this one; suppose the gun was made in 1950, with a serial number, and the number was removed in 1960? Legal at the time? or not?
After all, the serial number was not required until the GCA 68, right?

I think that's part of the catch 22. I don't know if removal or alteration of a serial number was legal before 1968. Let's assume that it was, so in 1960 someone removed a serial number from a firearm that was manufactured in 1950. Even if the removal was legal when performed, the current law makes no exception for removals that might have been legal when performed. Further, it doesn't care when the removal was performed or by whom, it clearly states that whoever is found in possession is presumed to be the party who did the dirty deed.