The most simple muzzleloader, will it work?

So, the idea of an electrically fired muzzle loader has been done before, including commercially. Check out this guy's pages:

http://www.ctmuzzleloaders.com/ctml_experiments/electric_ml/electricml.html
http://www.ctmuzzleloaders.com/ctml_experiments/electric_ignition/eignition.html

Your idea of a fuze-lit muzzle loader with a touch hole is actually how the most ancient firearms were used. They were called "handgonnes" and were basically a small cannon on a stick. They could be touched off with a fuse, a slow match, or a hot wire.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRKOoqJhCVE

Later, these evolved into firearms with actual lock/trigger mechanisms, with the most primitive being match locks, and then flint locks, etc.

Unless your "cartridge" extends beyond the muzzle of your "bore", you will never be able to extract it. The fouling in the bore will seal the cartridge in place.

Interestingly, the original Gatling used "cartridges" much like you are proposing. They were essentially single-bore revolver chambers, with a nipple for a percussion cap. However, these cartridges were inserted and extracted at the breech.

Your design has no provision for extracting or inserting the cartridge from the breech.

In addition, unless your "cartridge" is quite stiff/thick, it will fire-form to the "chamber" (bore) and again be stuck in there.

In fact, with your design you'd be better off making the "cartridge" basically a removable barrel, and the body of the gun (bore) being thin. Then the cartridge becomes a single-shot pistol and your "reloads" are just multiple pistols.

I would not want the touch hole pointing towards me, that's for sure. Better have a darn good blast deflector.

Steve
 
With your rear-hole design you might design the main body of the gun with a heating element "spike" in the bottom. So that when you put the cartridge into the bore, the spike passes through the touch hole into the powder. Then electrically the element heats to glowing.

Pw5DuRc.png


Thus it would be a thermally-ignited electrical system. You'd have to come up with an ignitor that withstood multiple firings though.

Steve
 
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I suggest browsing the "Track of the Wolf" online catalogue.

I'm not sure which volume,but there was a series of "Firefox" books about crafts and skills of Appalachian mountain folks.There is a pretty good lesson on building a "Poor boy" mountain rifle.A gentleman named Herschel House builds the rifle.

I certainly agree,its satisfying to shoot something you build yourself.

I'm not telling you to abandon your ideas.

I'm suggesting that building a Siler Lock Kit is good experience. Layout,drill press,drilling,tapping,eyebal torch heat treating,filing,finishing.

I think they have barrels with pre-fitted breech plugs.

Another good book is Ned Roberts "The Muzzle Loading Cap Lock Rifle"

Have fun.
 
maillemaker said:
With your rear-hole design you might design the main body of the gun with a heating element "spike" in the bottom. So that when you put the cartridge into the bore, the spike passes through the touch hole into the powder. Then electrically the element heats to glowing.

Pw5DuRc.png


Thus it would be a thermally-ignited electrical system. You'd have to come up with an ignitor that withstood multiple firings though.

Steve
Click to expand...
There are tungsten allows that should more than be able to withstand the black powder pressures.
 
Either the cartridge has to be strong enough to contain the pressure without any support of the barrel, this could be achieved even with a pretty thin cartridge with the right steel, depending on the load.

The other option is a thin brass casing that expand in the barrel but don’t weld in place.

I think a strong steel cartridge is the best option here.

Anyway, cartridges wont work with electrical matches without getting fiddly. The easiest and safest way to make the cartridge gun is a fast burning fuse through the muzzle, and a short barrel. There is quick fuses that burn 0.4 seconds per foot. With a short barrel pistol and such a fuse, the delay will be very short, but for a long barrel like a rifle or musket, fuse through the muzzle isnt a option.

So, a short barrel pistol, fast and short fuses, a storm lighter fixed to the pistol inline the fuse as a trigger/igniter, strong steel cases and the gun will perform fine, i think, easy to reload fast. If there is water resistant fuses, it would be even better.

With e-matches, the gun will take time to reload, like a ordinary muzzleloader without casings. What i try to achieve with e-matches isnt a gun that can be reloaded fast, but a gun that can be fired fast in succession, like a modern semiauto or double action revolver, or even a fullauto. This require multiple barrels, like a pepperbox, but since the gun doesn’t have to revolver, the main barrel doesn’t need to be cylindrical. The barrels can be placed in a handy way which will make the gun less clumsy with high barrel capacity.

(Like this, viewed from the front: https://imgur.com/iPF95zB)

I made some more fast ipad-sketches, just to show the simple basics of the gun
https://imgur.com/a/J144qaH

So, the single barrel cartridge gun and the multibarrel e-match gun, have different purposes, advantages and disadvantages. A mix between the both could also be made, imagine a .44 pepperbox with a 12 gauge in the middle, the .44 balls is fired with e-matches connected to a double action trigger, and the 12 gauge shot is fired through a fuse and can be reloaded through cartridges.
 
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"...will it work?..." For what? A tube with BP in it, a bullet and a way of ignition will always work. How accurate it will be is another question. Probably not at all.
There's nothing simple about that "design" though. The most complicated part is the trigger. Said trigger doesn't appear to actually do anything either. The 'fuse' will ignite the powder as soon as its burning gets to the powder. Not in the middle of the powder. AND you have no seal between the bullet and barrel. You'll lose most of the pressure.
"...strong enough to contain the pressure without any support of the barrel..." No cartridge does that.
 
With a strong enough cartridge it could, but it's clumsy, it's better with thin cartridges and a heavy barrel instead. If i want to make thin cartridges, what is my best option? Brass? Hard steel? Glassfiber?

I talked to a pyrotechnist, and it's not that easy to make e-matches connected to one trigger + safety and make it reliable, safe and compact. But it's possible.

Bullet and barrel will be sealed, a small slot just enough to contain either the wire of a e-match or a ordinary fuse will be made in the bullet. This slot won't leak more gas than a ordinary touch hole would. A shot could also be used instead of a bullet.

Here's some pictures of the cartridge pistol with ordinary fuse, ignited at the muzzle through a fixed lighter. Doesn't get simplier than that.
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I think trying to light off a black powder gun via a fuse dangling out the barrel is a non-starter.

One serious problem will be loading the ball. It's going to try and pull the fuse down with itself as it is driven down the bore.

Steve
 
Concur with maillemaker. A fuse = long lock time.

Why a slotted bullet? The British Brunswick rifle had a belted ball and it was a pain. The Russians did one step further and had a rifle that fired a ball that had two belts.
 
It think the whole idea was to have a whole bunch of preloaded tubes to put down the bore for rapid shooting so the problem of assembling such a tube is not that big an issue. The ball could even be loose enough to allow room for the fuse. Also, since the tube is only going to be shot once, grease in front of the ball is unnecessary. A quick match that burns past the round is very common in pyrotechnic mortar rounds.

Quick match fuses are the pyrotechnic equivalent of det cord used in blasting. The burn is so fast that the mortar round goes off nearly as soon as some one touches it with a burning flare or artilleryman's linstock. Timing is so important in professional pyrotechnic displays that they have to use quick matches for well synchronized shots. Amateur mortar rounds sold in fireworks stores use slow matches.
 
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