I don't carry a snub 38 but if I did, I'd lean towards the new 135 Gr +P Gold Dots... the 125 Gr Gold Dots seem to expand very poorly from 2" barrels... If I can't have fairly consistant expansion from a modern HP, I'd rather have a heavier bullet and would probably go with a 158 Gr with a flat point... either a LSWCHP or at least a LSWC.
The Best .38 Load For Snubbies?
- Thread starter Sulaco
- Start date
Personally,
I prefer to carry handloads in my Rossi snubbie too. None of the "speciality" loads out there gave me what I consider satisfactory accuracy. I found my best loads for it are 158gr LSWCs and 158gr Speer Gold Dots with 3.2gr or Red Dot Powder and 158gr Hornady XTPs with 3.4gr of Red Dot.
I prefer to carry handloads in my Rossi snubbie too. None of the "speciality" loads out there gave me what I consider satisfactory accuracy. I found my best loads for it are 158gr LSWCs and 158gr Speer Gold Dots with 3.2gr or Red Dot Powder and 158gr Hornady XTPs with 3.4gr of Red Dot.
Jeff Clark
Inactive
They are a hastle to load in a hurry, but I like to use inverted unjacketed hollow-base wadcutters. With that monster hollow pointed forward I get reasonable expansion, even with moderate loads.
Now for real fun I sometimes use hydraulic loads. You take the same hollow-base wadcutters and fill them with water and seat a plug in the end. An inverted gas check cap for a cast rifle bullet works well. A hydraulic load will expand to about twice the bore diameter even out of a snubnose.
Now for real fun I sometimes use hydraulic loads. You take the same hollow-base wadcutters and fill them with water and seat a plug in the end. An inverted gas check cap for a cast rifle bullet works well. A hydraulic load will expand to about twice the bore diameter even out of a snubnose.
I have heard such good things about +P 158 gr. LSWHP's! Which makes it all the more frustrating that none of the gun shops near me stock them! Who currently manufactures such a load, anyway?
No matter how good a load I were able to formulate myself, I would never even consider carrying handloads for defensive purposes. I would not want my gun's ammunition to be an ant-gun prosecutor's ammunition.
I, too, made the switch from Speer's +P 125 gr. GDHP's to their newer 135 gr. loading. I never quite got comfy relying on such a light subsonic projectile. After looking at a couple of reviews, the 135 does, indeed, show a great deal of promise.
If you are a velocity fiend, don't overlook the ultralight exotic frangibles such as Glaser's Safety Slug. It is only a 95 gr. bullet, but out of a 2 inch barrel you're getting about 1200 fps.(!) And terminal ballistics are devastating. Also, bullets of this type do not penetrate most buildng materials and usually do not ricochet. If you live in an apartment building with thin walls, or expect to employ the arm in a tightly populated urban environment, this could be a good thing for neighbors and bystanders if you miss the assailant. But, then, you would never miss, would you?
By the way, I am brand spankin' new to TheFiringLine, and am lovin' it!
No matter how good a load I were able to formulate myself, I would never even consider carrying handloads for defensive purposes. I would not want my gun's ammunition to be an ant-gun prosecutor's ammunition.
I, too, made the switch from Speer's +P 125 gr. GDHP's to their newer 135 gr. loading. I never quite got comfy relying on such a light subsonic projectile. After looking at a couple of reviews, the 135 does, indeed, show a great deal of promise.
If you are a velocity fiend, don't overlook the ultralight exotic frangibles such as Glaser's Safety Slug. It is only a 95 gr. bullet, but out of a 2 inch barrel you're getting about 1200 fps.(!) And terminal ballistics are devastating. Also, bullets of this type do not penetrate most buildng materials and usually do not ricochet. If you live in an apartment building with thin walls, or expect to employ the arm in a tightly populated urban environment, this could be a good thing for neighbors and bystanders if you miss the assailant. But, then, you would never miss, would you?
By the way, I am brand spankin' new to TheFiringLine, and am lovin' it!
(Welcome!)
Why the "FBI load" is difficult to find: The dealers tend to carry what folks ask for, and the gunrags have been pushing the "light & fast" genre of .38 spl load lately. All the major mfgrs still make 158-gr +P LSWCHPs - I had to special order a couple of boxes of Remingtons from the biggest store in the state when no store in ABQ proved to have any in stock.
You might check out the website of firearmstactical.com to get a different perspective on those Glasers. I was the world's biggest proponent of them when as a kid in the '80s I started carrying, but I soon learned of the work of ER physician Martin Fackler, who had some interesting things to say about the bad side of the Glasers' lack of penetration.
Nowadays I do criminal defense appeals, and I've done trial work for both the prosecution and the defense. In that work, I've worked on a lot of murder cases involving firearms over the last dozen or so years. I can tell you that - as far as handguns go - adequate penetration seems to be essential (along with shot placement) to actually stopping a human being with a handgun. Without both, the dude who got shot doesn't stop: he may (eventually) die, but he doesn't stop. Velocity is a component of penetration, but mass seems to be a lot more important (look at the wound channels in gelatin at David DiFabio's ammolabs or at Shawn Dodson's firearmstactical.com) for getting to those hard-to-reach areas.
Also, I've NEVER seen a prosecutor make an issue of the ammo used in a case. Not to say it couldn't happen, but I haven't seen it.
Why the "FBI load" is difficult to find: The dealers tend to carry what folks ask for, and the gunrags have been pushing the "light & fast" genre of .38 spl load lately. All the major mfgrs still make 158-gr +P LSWCHPs - I had to special order a couple of boxes of Remingtons from the biggest store in the state when no store in ABQ proved to have any in stock.
You might check out the website of firearmstactical.com to get a different perspective on those Glasers. I was the world's biggest proponent of them when as a kid in the '80s I started carrying, but I soon learned of the work of ER physician Martin Fackler, who had some interesting things to say about the bad side of the Glasers' lack of penetration.
Nowadays I do criminal defense appeals, and I've done trial work for both the prosecution and the defense. In that work, I've worked on a lot of murder cases involving firearms over the last dozen or so years. I can tell you that - as far as handguns go - adequate penetration seems to be essential (along with shot placement) to actually stopping a human being with a handgun. Without both, the dude who got shot doesn't stop: he may (eventually) die, but he doesn't stop. Velocity is a component of penetration, but mass seems to be a lot more important (look at the wound channels in gelatin at David DiFabio's ammolabs or at Shawn Dodson's firearmstactical.com) for getting to those hard-to-reach areas.
Also, I've NEVER seen a prosecutor make an issue of the ammo used in a case. Not to say it couldn't happen, but I haven't seen it.
Last edited:
Thanks for the info on the exotic ammo, Erich. I am always happy when I hear a good reason not to spend a lot of money - those cartridges can cost over two bucks a round!
I will say that I have seen the Glasers perform extremely well against phonebooks, although most of the phonebooks I have encountered have struck me as being unlikely to cause any trouble...
I will say that I have seen the Glasers perform extremely well against phonebooks, although most of the phonebooks I have encountered have struck me as being unlikely to cause any trouble...
plateshooter
New member
I've used the same load for years, 150gr SWC with 4gr Red Dot. Very accurate in my 2" revolvers.
I side with the heavy crowd. I like the 148 grain lead wadcutters - I even have an old box of Winchester 200-grainers with a lead roundnose. As mentioned by CastleBravo, I even like the 158 grain FMJ flatnoses in the longer barrel .38s and have some Black Hills +Ps of this very type.
dsgrntldPW
New member
After they were dropped from their line I picked up as many boxes of Federal Nyclad as I could find. This has been my favorite 'snubbie' round since S&W originally brought it out many years ago. Currently using 158 grn. +P's in my 638. They bite a bit, but not too bad.
I like the Federal Nyclad 158gr+P LSWCHP best, but since I can't get any more of it once my current small supply is gone, I'll also use any of the "major brand" 158gr+P LSWCHP (no nylon coatings) from Federal, Winchester, Speer or Remington as alternatives.
It's been my experience that most 1 7/8" barrel J-frame "snubbies" are regulated to shoot approximately to point of aim with 158gr+P loads, but do not do so with the lighter .38 Special cartridges using 125gr bullets. These lighter loads always seem to shoot too low for reliable accuracy.
I haven't tried the new 135gr Gold Dots yet, but I'll be interested to do so if I can find some.
It's been my experience that most 1 7/8" barrel J-frame "snubbies" are regulated to shoot approximately to point of aim with 158gr+P loads, but do not do so with the lighter .38 Special cartridges using 125gr bullets. These lighter loads always seem to shoot too low for reliable accuracy.
I haven't tried the new 135gr Gold Dots yet, but I'll be interested to do so if I can find some.
Tripplethreat
New member
Have not had a chance to try the new 135 speer load,but am anxious to do so. Primary load for me for a snubby has been the 158 +P lswchp for many moons simply because it's proven. I also sometimes use Corbon 125 +p,but it's a warm load. I would prefer the 158+P for control in fast shootimg as it seems mild to me compared to Corbon. The Speer 135,however,may become the load to beat in a snubby. We'll see as shootings with it are reported.