Thanks, Heizer Defense...

G

gbclarkson

New member
Is this the fallout from the wildly successful, utterly devastating, combat handgun known as the Heizer Defense Pocket AR? I am joking, of course. Is the article, also?:confused:

http://news.yahoo.com/us-considers-banning-type-popular-rifle-ammunition-082315307--politics.html

Has there been an epidemic of police offers shot shot from AR pistols that the media has, somehow, neglected?

Would an non-M855 .223 NATO round be significantly less devastating?

This reads like yet another ban devoid of solid logic.

The article contains an email address that offers to "accept public comment".
Should I comment? Am I putting myself on an ATF watchlist? Am I too paranoid? Would my comment be fruitful? Has anyone ever commented on a government site such as mentioned in the article?

Thoughts?
 
Lawmakers admit that no police officers have been shot with this ammo. Between lobbying my elected officials, submitting witness slips on pending legislation and membership in several pro-gun organizations, I'm pretty sure I'm on that list already.
 
The Heizer single shot 2.23 has not even made the market yet. There has been AR 15 pistols for decades. Obamas back door attack on gun control.
 
The Heizer single shot 2.23 has not even made the market yet. There has been AR 15 pistols for decades. Obamas back door attack on gun control.
Click to expand...
Heizer is such a failure it can't even take credit for a bad rap!:D
 
The Heizer pocket AR is the most advanced, most devastating combat warfighter tactical covert spec ops elite weapon system ever devised.

But it certainly wasn't the first .223 Remington handgun.
 
It is supposed to be just a single shot pistol off the Double tap. the Heizler HAS NEVER MADE IT TO MARKET<<<NO ONE SELLS IT.
 
Last edited:
The Heizer pocket AR is the most advanced, most devastating combat warfighter tactical covert spec ops elite weapon system ever devised.

But it certainly wasn't the first .223 Remington handgun.
Click to expand...

It maybe the last tho. I mean what room is there to improve on such a groundbreaking weaponsystem?
 
You or I can think what we want, but the existing LAW bans armor-piercing handgun ammo. So who is to blame - ATF for enforcing the existing law (which we always say they should do) or the gun makers who know the law and deliberately make AR-15 "pistols" knowing the result will be to get ammo banned? I wonder if those guys are really working for Obama.

Jim
 
"So who is to blame - ATF for enforcing the existing law (which we always say they should do) or the gun makers who know the law and deliberately make AR-15 "pistols" knowing the result will be to get ammo banned?"
Well, considering the law's intent was never to ban ammunition designed and intended for rifles that happened to have a pistol chambered for it at some point, I'd say the fault is with congress for not insisting on that language, and the ATF for reaching like a giraffe to make the claim. The latter is to be expected from G men, so the real flaw lies in the bill that was passed.

BTW, single shot and derringer pistols (non auto loading) have historically not been grounds for restricting cartridges. Open your eyes, folks; this is all about the AR15. Always has been, always will be. It is so painfully obvious. The rifle is our capital ship in this little naval battle we're fighting (theirs is teaching about guns in school, or NYC --not sure which is more symbolic) which makes it the biggest and brightest target. Its loss would not necessarily break us, but the inability to defend it would indicate eventual defeat.

TCB
 
That's the problem. It isn't the law as it reads and hasn't been since it was written in '86. It is an additional two part "framework" that they propose to add to it from what I read in the email sent to me by texaslawshield. If this ammunition were meant to be banned in the original law it would have been stated so within thirty years ago. Please correct me if I'm wrong but I believe chopped up ar15s existed then also and they knew about them then as well when they wrote the law. I even read some material which quoted the two congressmen who wrote the law themselves as stating in their own words " ammunition designed for or primarily used in rifles". According to that it doesn't matter if they make pistols chambered in a round post-facto or not, it was designed first as a rifle round and still is primarily used as such according to the intent of the law as stated by the men who wrote it according to what ive read.
 
", the ATF has proposed a two-part framework that they believe will meet their primary goals of protecting law enforcement officers and preventing an undue burden on the firearms industry and gun owners:

Category I provides an exemption for .22 caliber projectiles: A .22 caliber projectile that otherwise would be classified as armor piercing ammunition under 18 U.S.C. 921(a)(17)(B) will be considered to be primarily intended to be used for sporting purposes under section 921(a)(17)(C) if the projectile weighs 40 grains or less AND is loaded into a rimfire cartridge. (ATF Framework, pg. 12).

Category II deals with all other caliber projectiles: Except as provided in Category I (.22 caliber rimfire) projectiles that otherwise would be classified as armor piercing ammunition will be presumed to be primarily intended to be used for sporting purposes under section 921(a)(17)(C) if the projectile is loaded into a cartridge for which the only handgun that is readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade is a single shot handgun. ATF nevertheless retains the discretion to deny any application for a sporting purposes exemption if substantial evidence exists that the ammunition is not primarily intended for such purposes. (ATF Framework, pg. 12)."
 
"We are looking at additional ways to protect our brave men and women in law enforcement and believe that this process is valuable for that reason alone," White House Press Secretary Josh Earnest said. "If there are armor-piercing bullets available that can fit into easily concealed weapons, that it puts our law enforcement at considerably more risk."

Read more: http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2015...-ban-unnecessary/3551425517494/#ixzz3TWjoRzZr
These brave men and women are also equipped with ar15s, automatic shotguns, body armor, riot shields, tear gas, flash bang grenades, supercharged vehicles, military tanks and acps. They are in essence a military force, and who are they protecting with all of this? Not you and I, the average citizen. This also comes about when obama announces he wants to federalize local police departments. Coincidence?
 
Yeah, I don't think I'm going to place even .01% of the blame on Heizer. All 100% of the blame goes to the Obama Administration on this.
 
Yeah, I don't think I'm going to place even .01% of the blame on Heizer. All 100% of the blame goes to the Obama Administration on this.
Click to expand...

I did not mean to blame 'Heizer' in my earlier post either...

However, there are a number of AR type weapons that are classed as 'Handguns'...

A bugger to conceal, but nonetheless are indeed technically handguns...
 
My take-away from the linked article: Wow - I didn't realize that the steel tip was as large as it is (based on dissection of bullet). Is it armor piercing? I don't know - but there is one way to find out rather than citing to statutes. Why doesn't someone just take a soft bullet-proof jacket (without plates) and test a standard 5.56 round from the same gun and same distance against the steel tipped bullet? If they both penetrate - then there is no difference. If one penetrates but the other doesn't, then there may some validity to the claim.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top