Terrorized at the Canadian Border for having a CHL
- Thread starter Evergreen
- Start date
- Status
4runnerman
New member
Sorry to hear all that hassel you went through. I would have been as angry as you. I comend you standing up for yourself. I ( in years past) used to make 1 or 2 trips a year for fisihng trips. I never ran in to any hassel. I would send In a complaint just for my own comfort.
Dragline45
New member
Getting into Canada these days can be pretty strict. Ive been a couple times, once when I was a kid, and another when I was 18 as I could legally drink there 
. During both those times a passport was not required and getting in wasn't a problem. Times have changed though. I know of a group that went hunting in Canada, and my buddies girlfriends father was denied access because of a DUI in the States back in the 70's or 80's. I even hear they will sometimes go as far as to test credit cards, drivers license's etc.. for traces of drugs as people use them to cut up lines of cocaine and etc..
As far as him browsing through your text messages and such, I woulda told him to screw himself and not even bothered going into Canada. He had no right to search through your phone, that was a blatant abuse of power. Maybe next time have your buddy come visit you in the states, eh.
. During both those times a passport was not required and getting in wasn't a problem. Times have changed though. I know of a group that went hunting in Canada, and my buddies girlfriends father was denied access because of a DUI in the States back in the 70's or 80's. I even hear they will sometimes go as far as to test credit cards, drivers license's etc.. for traces of drugs as people use them to cut up lines of cocaine and etc..As far as him browsing through your text messages and such, I woulda told him to screw himself and not even bothered going into Canada. He had no right to search through your phone, that was a blatant abuse of power. Maybe next time have your buddy come visit you in the states, eh.
mississaugagunnut
Inactive
I'm a Canadian and I had a similar thing happen to me
About a year ago I went to my mailbox on the U.S side to retrieve a "ShotLock".
On arriving at the Canadian border I declared the item. The guard looked at me with surprise and asked what the item was and I told her, pull over for inspection was all she said.
So I pull over and get out of the vehicle. A young male and female (maybe in their 20's) come over to me and look at the slip I was issued. The male asks to see the item. I show it to him, it's in it's original packaging complete with pictures. He asks what is this for, Duh. I tell him, " this is to safely secure a shotgun". He asks, " Do you have firearms????". Now this is where I decided not to play along. I said, while checking myself for a holster, "Not on me now".
Well he goes nuts!!! I mean he freaks out! He asks me how many guns I have and what kind. I tell him I am a licensed firearms holder and that I compete in many disciplines. For 10 minutes he continues to ask me about my firearms and I refuse to comply. The female with him never says a word and looks at him in disbelief that someone is not complying with his commands. He takes my firearms license with him and disappears inside.
I wait about 15 minutes and he reappears with the female. Now he is calm, he tells me that as a border guard he has more authority than a police officer and he can ask any questions he wants. He says that by not answering his questions he is becoming very suspicious of me. He asks again, how many firearms do you have? I tell him, since you have taken my gun license I assume you have checked my records and now know how many "Restricted" firearms I have. Do you want to know how many "Unrestricted" I have as well? Give me a number he shouts!!!!!
Now I have been there almost half an hour and I am planning on shooting later that day so I figure I have had enough fun for the day. So I play along and provide him with a number after feigning a mental count several times. He was ready to scream!!!! He told me to get the hell out of here, no duty was collected on the item I declared and off I went.
About a year ago I went to my mailbox on the U.S side to retrieve a "ShotLock".
On arriving at the Canadian border I declared the item. The guard looked at me with surprise and asked what the item was and I told her, pull over for inspection was all she said.
So I pull over and get out of the vehicle. A young male and female (maybe in their 20's) come over to me and look at the slip I was issued. The male asks to see the item. I show it to him, it's in it's original packaging complete with pictures. He asks what is this for, Duh. I tell him, " this is to safely secure a shotgun". He asks, " Do you have firearms????". Now this is where I decided not to play along. I said, while checking myself for a holster, "Not on me now".
Well he goes nuts!!! I mean he freaks out! He asks me how many guns I have and what kind. I tell him I am a licensed firearms holder and that I compete in many disciplines. For 10 minutes he continues to ask me about my firearms and I refuse to comply. The female with him never says a word and looks at him in disbelief that someone is not complying with his commands. He takes my firearms license with him and disappears inside.
I wait about 15 minutes and he reappears with the female. Now he is calm, he tells me that as a border guard he has more authority than a police officer and he can ask any questions he wants. He says that by not answering his questions he is becoming very suspicious of me. He asks again, how many firearms do you have? I tell him, since you have taken my gun license I assume you have checked my records and now know how many "Restricted" firearms I have. Do you want to know how many "Unrestricted" I have as well? Give me a number he shouts!!!!!
Now I have been there almost half an hour and I am planning on shooting later that day so I figure I have had enough fun for the day. So I play along and provide him with a number after feigning a mental count several times. He was ready to scream!!!! He told me to get the hell out of here, no duty was collected on the item I declared and off I went.
I'm glad to finally hear from a Canadian, Mississauga... Wow, well I am glad to know it is not just American gun owners they terrorize.. 
I won't say for one second that many of these border guards are not on some type of crazed power trip.. The wild eyes the border guard had after I told him I had a CHL I feel was enough to send shivers down any RKBA minded American's spine. As a Canadian, maybe you are just use to this mentality.
Your experience was a bit like mine.. Except for me being very compliant at first, then getting vigilant later. You didn't mention if they searched your car.. They searched all over mine, took them about 15 or so minutes, I think..
As much as people rag on the American border patrol, I have heard more times than not, it was being suspects of illegal drug trafficking or terrorism. It seems like the Canadians care about these things, but are even more obsessed with guns.. I wonder how many American border searches are a result of people bringing guns into the country from Canada.. I could be wrong, but just haven't heard about the issue. Of course we have the BATFE/ATF to worry about, not the most friendly government organization.
I won't say for one second that many of these border guards are not on some type of crazed power trip.. The wild eyes the border guard had after I told him I had a CHL I feel was enough to send shivers down any RKBA minded American's spine. As a Canadian, maybe you are just use to this mentality.
Your experience was a bit like mine.. Except for me being very compliant at first, then getting vigilant later. You didn't mention if they searched your car.. They searched all over mine, took them about 15 or so minutes, I think..
As much as people rag on the American border patrol, I have heard more times than not, it was being suspects of illegal drug trafficking or terrorism. It seems like the Canadians care about these things, but are even more obsessed with guns.. I wonder how many American border searches are a result of people bringing guns into the country from Canada.. I could be wrong, but just haven't heard about the issue. Of course we have the BATFE/ATF to worry about, not the most friendly government organization.
Last edited:
I understand the anger and frustration, however, I have a hard time with your use of the word "Terrorism". No violence was used against you, and there were really no actual threats against you. Sure, based on what you wrote, you may have been singled out and harassed, but it does not appear that you were terrorized.
Mark, I have thought about the use of this word and some have criticized it, but all I have to say is this.. The border official struck "terror" in me, therefore I was terrorized .. I felt very worried, nervous and afraid.. There was a point of the ordeal when he was harshly interrogating me and talking about being put in handcuffs (in theory, if I was a criminal, he said) that I feared I may be arrested and not get to go home or see my family, etc. The experience became downright scary and I panicked. Sadly, I failed to read the manual on "How American Gun Owners Should Visit Canada" or "Visiting Canada as an American CHL Holder For Dummies". If they sell such a book, please send me the link so I can buy it and read it thoroughly. Considering, my experience, I would be more than happy to buy such a book.MarkCo said:
You say there was no threats against me?? Detaining a person is always a threatening act IMO, especially when you interrogate them and ransack (although done gently) their vehicle. Yeah, they were looking through all my stuff , underneath my seats going through all my belongings.. That to me is threatening, sorry, I guess we all have our definition of a threat.
The whole incident has caused me a lot of emotional distress and that is also a form of terror, IMO.. I'm still shooken up and trying to get the incident out of my brain. I now have a phobia of travelling to Canada, despite how much I want to see the country and experience its beauty.
I am still pulled in both ways if I ever want to visit that beautiful country that is just less than one hour north of my house ever again, because of the miserable experience. No, I don't have to go visit it.. I don't even have to leave my house.. I guess I just like having freedom to do things.. It's part of who I am..
To me, making a person feel scared, intimidated, harassed and force them into detainment is terrifying, hence why I say I was terrorized. That doesn't necessarily equate to being a victim of a terrorist attack.
Last edited:
Glenn E. Meyer
New member
Not guns - I was being interviewed by a Canadian university for a job in a month's time. However, the school was close to the border where we lived in WNY so my wife and I decided to take a look around.
At the border, the Canadian guard asked - Why are entering Canada? I should have said tourist or shopping but I said I have a job interview.
LOOKING FOR WORK IN CANADA - ALERT, ALERT
That ruined the rest of the day as we were taken to interrogation. We were finally spring by a supervisor who said - Oh, for God's sake he is a PhD and going to the university. He let us go.
At the border, the Canadian guard asked - Why are entering Canada? I should have said tourist or shopping but I said I have a job interview.
LOOKING FOR WORK IN CANADA - ALERT, ALERT
That ruined the rest of the day as we were taken to interrogation. We were finally spring by a supervisor who said - Oh, for God's sake he is a PhD and going to the university. He let us go.
You screwed up, Glenn!
If you had told the border guard that the university had contacted you, regarding a position, things would have been a lot different, probably....
We all have to remember that A)border guards/customs agents are trained to react to certain triggers of speech, appearance and behavior. Trip the trigger, and they do what they are trained and expected to do. Hold you and look for evidence of something, until and unless a higher level type makes a decision.
And B) some of them are idiots....
(not exclusive to any one profession, idiots are everywhere)
If you had told the border guard that the university had contacted you, regarding a position, things would have been a lot different, probably....
We all have to remember that A)border guards/customs agents are trained to react to certain triggers of speech, appearance and behavior. Trip the trigger, and they do what they are trained and expected to do. Hold you and look for evidence of something, until and unless a higher level type makes a decision.
And B) some of them are idiots....
(not exclusive to any one profession, idiots are everywhere)
Glenn E. Meyer
New member
44 - funny. Years later I was living in Portland and was invited up the University of British Columbia to give a talk. When I got to the border, they asked why?
I said I was giving a speech at UBC. Are you getting paid! NO - sez I (well,
)
I learned.
I said I was giving a speech at UBC. Are you getting paid! NO - sez I (well,
)I learned.
My wife has a friend that lives not far from Niagara Falls (which I've never seen), and we have occasionally talked about going there for a visit. But stories like this (and others from various Canadian border crossings) really make the idea lose its appeal.
I generally don't go where I'm not welcome. There are plenty of nice places this side of the border to go see.
I generally don't go where I'm not welcome. There are plenty of nice places this side of the border to go see.
It has been some years since I worked for this company, but I was inbound to Canada on a secured load (prototypes of the Military kind) that was being brought in for test and evaluation and the Customs agent asked in a joking tone any Guns, Grenades, Rocket launchers or Explosives on board...should have seen the look on her face when I said yes!...it actually made my day...but things did get a bit exciting when she hit the alarm....
But seriously, going to Canada and dealing with Customs, is usually painless, fairly quick and you are thru and on your way with relative ease, the thing to remember is be polite, patient, answer the questions honestly and don't volunteer any information not asked for and if you don't understand a question or if it seems to be going in a bizarre (to you direction) ask them the purpose of the line they are pursuing, it normally ends it right there.
There actually was a book available at one time an insider view on how to deal with Custom agents in various parts of the world, but I haven't seen a copy in years.
But seriously, going to Canada and dealing with Customs, is usually painless, fairly quick and you are thru and on your way with relative ease, the thing to remember is be polite, patient, answer the questions honestly and don't volunteer any information not asked for and if you don't understand a question or if it seems to be going in a bizarre (to you direction) ask them the purpose of the line they are pursuing, it normally ends it right there.
There actually was a book available at one time an insider view on how to deal with Custom agents in various parts of the world, but I haven't seen a copy in years.
Not sure if this relates to the thread, but on my last trip back home to France I had an interesting encounter. Doing the hipster thing by lounging in my favorite café in Paris, I made some quick notes on my laptop which has two very large and very noticeable stickers on it......NRA and "Don't tread on Me" stickers.
The only people who were shocked....were Americans. The French people around me didn't care less or know what the deal was about. The fact that a Frenchman espoused those beliefs really surprised and maybe even offended these American tourists. Otherwise I received no attention from police/security anywhere.
The only people who were shocked....were Americans. The French people around me didn't care less or know what the deal was about. The fact that a Frenchman espoused those beliefs really surprised and maybe even offended these American tourists. Otherwise I received no attention from police/security anywhere.
Glenn E. Meyer
New member
Not to divert but Niagara Falls is awesome to see, esp. from the Canadian side. The Maid of the Mist is great. Note the restaurants on the Canadian side are tourist traps. Toronto and Vancouver are also neat places to visit.
One has to decide if their lack of gun rights would keep you from seeing things. I've been to the UK and we know their general attitude but I enjoyed it.
Wouldn't live there but common sense on visits avoids most problems.
One has to decide if their lack of gun rights would keep you from seeing things. I've been to the UK and we know their general attitude but I enjoyed it.
Wouldn't live there but common sense on visits avoids most problems.
kilimanjaro
New member
Evergreen, if you want to file that complaint, you should do so. Zealous bureaucrats need to be calmed down by their superiors sometimes, and citizen complaints are a vehicle to effect that. To be frank, I would not be upset over the interrogation or the search, that's the job they have. I would complain about the manner and attitude of the officer.
The border has changed, used to be able to cross at Blaine or Sumas with just a simple question or two, and a wave-off. Now we have drug smuggling, gun running, illegal aliens, terrorists, pedophiles, all kinds of big issues there.
The border at Penticton used to be a yellow line across the asphalt road, with a little kiosk beside the road. You were supposed to stop and call the Customs office if you crossed the border after hours. Of course, we never did that.
The border has changed, used to be able to cross at Blaine or Sumas with just a simple question or two, and a wave-off. Now we have drug smuggling, gun running, illegal aliens, terrorists, pedophiles, all kinds of big issues there.
The border at Penticton used to be a yellow line across the asphalt road, with a little kiosk beside the road. You were supposed to stop and call the Customs office if you crossed the border after hours. Of course, we never did that.
I lived most of my life without the legal right to carry, so being gunless for a short trip wouldn't bother me all that much. I just don't want to deal with the unwarranted harassment a computer check revealing my CPL status might trigger. I get enough stress in my life, I don't need that crap.
leadcounsel
Moderator
I too have been reluctant to go to Canada. I live near Tacoma, and only 4 hours or so from some of the best snowboarding mountains in the world. Yet, I've been reluctant to go north.
I've heard horror stories of people being harassed and vehicles torn apart because of an American license plate, any US military veteran status, or an errant empty shell casing on the floorboard of a vehicle.
I also have heard - although it doesn't apply to me - that anyone with a DUI in his background is prevented from entering Canada.
Shame for Canada, I'd probably drop a few thousand dollars there but for their restrictive attitudes against lawful gun owners.
I would definitely follow complaints anywhere that would listen, and note all the money you WON'T be spending there in the future. The squeaky wheel gets the oil.
I've heard horror stories of people being harassed and vehicles torn apart because of an American license plate, any US military veteran status, or an errant empty shell casing on the floorboard of a vehicle.
I also have heard - although it doesn't apply to me - that anyone with a DUI in his background is prevented from entering Canada.
Shame for Canada, I'd probably drop a few thousand dollars there but for their restrictive attitudes against lawful gun owners.
I would definitely follow complaints anywhere that would listen, and note all the money you WON'T be spending there in the future. The squeaky wheel gets the oil.
62coltnavy
New member
This is so incredibly bogus. Yes, borders are different, but that doesn't mean that the customs officers have the right to be the "morality police" to see who gets to enter and who doesn't. OK, so owning guns makes you "suspicious"--but the only relevant inquiry is "do you have any guns?" To which the answer is "No, but you are welcome to search." If you have no weapons, then that should be the end of it. The number of guns you won, where they are kept, whether they are locked up or not, is all completely and totally irrelevant.
I would be really surprised if Canada can access records of every firearm owned by Americans. The federal government is prohibited from maintaining such a database, but even if it did, it would be incomplete. Not all states run NICS checks--and even if they did, that doesn't mean that a transaction was actually completed. Further, a huge number of computer databases do not communicate with each other--this was one of the big problems with reporting of felony convictions and involuntary commitments to NCIS was incompatible programming that would take billions to "correct"--and would be as successful as the attempt to create a national ID that failed so miserably despite all the money and time spent on it.
Border states may be different, but I have to question whether there is any sort of national database available to Canadian customs. Anyone have inside information?
I would be really surprised if Canada can access records of every firearm owned by Americans. The federal government is prohibited from maintaining such a database, but even if it did, it would be incomplete. Not all states run NICS checks--and even if they did, that doesn't mean that a transaction was actually completed. Further, a huge number of computer databases do not communicate with each other--this was one of the big problems with reporting of felony convictions and involuntary commitments to NCIS was incompatible programming that would take billions to "correct"--and would be as successful as the attempt to create a national ID that failed so miserably despite all the money and time spent on it.
Border states may be different, but I have to question whether there is any sort of national database available to Canadian customs. Anyone have inside information?
- Status