Taurus Judge .410 bore 2 1/2 in Federal 000 Buckshot

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Yeah, that new PDX1 is sweet! I'll have to add some of that to my ammo stockpile. Of course I still love the Federal Premium .410 handgun loads, talk about great patterns...
 
If I shoot someone at 20 yards, I'm going to jail. What the Judge, and the Federal OOO buckshot, is for is for the guy that is at most 5-10 yards away from you.
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In my house, the greatest distance I will ever have to shoot inside is 11 yards, from one side of the family room/kitchen to the other. Why debate the accuracy of any gun at a range in excess of its' intended practicality ?

In my vehicle, I might stuff my 3"X3" Judge with homerolled 3" loads of plated lead BB, which amounts to around 32 pellets, which at 3 yards is a load to be reckoned with.

Personally,I have a fear of a round or ball striking the unintended target down the hall or across the gas station lot, and most of us likely share that concern.

But the contention that The Judge is not perfect for some purpose is the same
silly arguement that is used for most other firearms at one time or another.

For sure, hitting the target with one or more projectiles of a given size at a given velocity beats the hell out of a miss with anything else.

I guess I will keep buying guns until I find the perfect one.
 
If I shoot someone at 20 yards, I'm going to jail.
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There's a 63 foot (21 yards) hallway that seperates the master bedroom from the back bedrooms in my house. So 20+ yards is realistic.
That's why I asked about the patterns at 20 yards but can't seem to get a straight answer. Hitting a pizza box at 5 yards or a 2 foot by 4 foot target at 20 yards doesn't tell me anything.

I have some 357 magnum loads with two 000 buckshot pellets. At 25 yards they hit about 12" apart from each other.

And if someone is shooting at you from 20 yards away are you telling me you won't shoot back cause you might get in trouble?

What the Judge, and the Federal OOO buckshot, is for is for the guy that is at most 5-10 yards away from you.
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So what do you do if he's standing further back... ask him to wait while you load some 45 Colt cartridges?

Jim

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about a 6 inch pattern at 20... If you don't believe me then shoot the dang thing using the PROPER BUCKSHOT.
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Lighten up Francis... so you're telling me all four 000 pellets hit within 6" at 20 yards? Each shot?
And I'd love to shoot one but have yet to see anybody with one at the range and I don't want to buy one only to find out it sucks, that's why I asked the questions from those of you who already own one.
 
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Do folks who argue that the spread of projectiles with a Judge, worry that they may someday have to make a precision shot in a HD situation?

So if there are family members around, one being grabbed by a BG, etc.?

I've had that scenario in training with a long arm, shotgun (interesting problem) and handgun (Glocks and snubbies). It's an interesting issue.
 
Congrats on your purchase! I myself would not have purchased it for defense for many reasons. You like it and thats what matters. These quotes were taking from another site and express what I think about this item (I really didn't want to type out the same thing with different words, lol) I tend to agree with them about this "novelity" firearm...

"I would like to have one, but not for self defense. That one falls into the toy category. There are much better options for self defense pistols and revolvers."

"For a gun nut to use as a play toy, it is one thing. For a homeowner to use as a working gun, it is a different kettle of chips. It may suit a few people right down to the ground, but a lot of other buyers will find it does not fulfill the marketing dream ."

"+1....you don't know how many people I have talked to that wanted this "thing" for HD. They eventually went with a better pistol, round, and manufacture after we discussed the issue of CCW and HD. Even talked about the "coolness" "novelty" "taticool" of certain firearms. I think they wanted the "coolness" of it shooting the shotgun shell out of it. It was like this is a NEW invention and never been thought of or made before. A firearm that can be able to shoot a pistol round or a shot gun shell. Needless to say, I have a Cobray double barrel derringer in 45/410 and would never use it for SD or HD. Its a cute novelty gun, like Greyone said "...For a gun nut to use as a play toy,..." , and was no where near my first pistol. The Cobray is interesting to shoot at the range, I must say lol.
For the price and size of the taurus, it is a just a novelty item and you can get much better for HD / SD / CCW imo. I won't even get into the manufacture of this "novelty item". "
 
Again I have shot it and seen how effective it is. It is effective.... I will continue to use it. You guys need to shoot one before you call it novelty. Because if a BG is staring down the barrel of my judge, I don't think he would regard to it as novelty.
 
I have shot one, my buddies pistol and he sold it a month later... he didn't care for it. And don't need to try a firearm to speak about it when you definitely seeing it just being a novelty......there is much better out there. Maybe, it might have a place in the a snake / trail gun category. If people wanted a pistol in a 45Colt round for defense, then there are much better pistols like the SW, Ruger, or Colt. If people wanted a 410 for home defense (I would at least use a 20gauge) then there are much better 410 shot guns out there. This firearm is what you wanted and you purchased it, would not be my choice for defense. To each their own, and again congrats on the purchase!
 
I'm sorry but shooting said gun and round at a target is not convincing as to its effectiveness in complex, real world usage.

Take my question of pattern spread and look at http://www.taurususa.com/hot_items.cfm at six feet or more from http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot41_2.htm
and
http://mcb-homis.com/judge/index.htm

Taurus advocates spread as a good thing. I don't particularly want it in a HD situation where I have no idea about what maybe be behind or next to the BG. I can't predict their location in a dynamic situation.

I want precision in an HD gun, I'm not hunting birds with it. I don't want pellets or shot wandering into a close by loved one or out the window.

When I've done shotgun or handgun,long gun hostage shots in training, it is difficult - you need to have a precisely patterned shotgun and good trigger skills for handguns or rifles.

If you image the Judge only being used when a BG appears in front of you and you shoot him, OK - good for you. But that's a limited utility in my opinion. In my home, it is not clear that all the good guys will be in back of me.
 
Shot placement is very important but not unless it can penetrate enough to reach the vital area you are aiming at. Birdshot to the stomach makes a disgusting large wound but does not penetrate enough to stop someone determined to get you. Your rib cage and skull are there to protect your vital organs from damage so you have to be able to hit bone and keep going straight or you will miss that vital organ. That is what everyone is screaming about with the Judge and the shotshell rounds used. Going to the range and using it is useless unless you are shooting at people. Watermelons, phone books, water jugs, etc. all look very impressive but none of them contain bone or tense muscle tissue as found in humans. There is no body of evidence yet that the rounds often talked about are effective in real life like there is for the 9mm, .40 and .45 as well as other bullets used enough to provide a larger enough statistical sampling of effectiveness when used on humans.

I am not anti Judge. I own a Governor but I load it with .45 Colt. I bought it for fun and because I have a Colt SAA in .45 Colt and no longer own a .45 ACP and therefore wanted a gun to shoot up the hundreds of .45 runds I have in my ammo boxes as well as provide some fun shooting. I would rather use the Federal 000 buck than the PDX1. I like the disc for their impact value but those pellets spread a lot very fast and will penetrate a drywall. Outdoors they can travel far and enter buildings, homes and innocent bystanders. If you recall the video of the pharmacist that killed a robber, ran outside to shoot at the one that got away and then came back in and got another gun to finish off he first one he shot you would be interested to know he initially used a Judge with shotshells. He was recently convicted of murder since he killed someone who was no longer a threat to him but one of the interesting things in the trial was the fact that he was shooting shotshells out of a Judge outdoors so that people had to find cover to avoid being hit by the pellets and that was viewed as an example of his reckless behavior and lack of regard for human life.
 
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every company, and magazine, touts a 12 or 20 guage loaded with buckshot as the ideal short range manstopper. yet no one ever says "the buckshot loads were not tested on bone, just simple gelatin so do the pellets have the ability to punch through bone?"

and to make it further, remingtons newest line of home defense shotgun ammo is just a load of BBs, really cant say they have the ability to punch through a ribcage and shred the internal organs..


you cant say it has anymore novelty then the 500 sw magnum does. whas the first thing the average 500 user does? sell it or switch to the '500 sw special" loads.


seriously, if you want super power in a gun fight, get one of those semi automatic 44 mag carbines from ruger. load THAT with 185 grain jhp and youll be king.
 
So many posts that ignore the effects of barrel length and rifling on a round never considered a good defensive round by real experts, even when fired from a 20" smooth bored barrel. Hey I have a Governor and use it as part of my home defene system. It is a basically fire from bed to bedroom door gun. If I leave the bedroom I have my 14 shot 9mm with +P Gold Dots. I have been shooting over 40 years and competed with a few well know shooters, one of which was recently on Top Guns who trains Homeland Security personnel and shot people with handguns, rifle and shotgun in Vietname. I am no expert but neither am I someone whose only experience is what they read on the internet and even then only accept that which supports their beliefs.

Doesn't anyone else find it strange that a gun originally marketed as a belly distance car defense gun using a round previously said to be a poor choice for defense even from a 20" smooth bore barrel, has suddenly become magically powerful from a 2-3" barrel with rifling that adversely affects buckshot. Goes to show that everyone will ride the money train until it stops.
 
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No experience with the Judge. I do have a lot of experience with a .410 single shot derringer.

They are great for snakes in an allumin John Boat. The bird shot won't put a hole in your boat.

A slug is accurate to 50 ft and exploads a gallon jug of water.

buck shot spreads out and won't hold on a silloute target at 50ft.

A handload of 3 30cal 100 grain speer plinkers will place a 1 to 1.5" triangler group in the 10 ring at 50ft. The same load out of an old HR shotgun prints the same at 75 ft,

A load of rock salt will permantely discourage wandering cats and dogs from using your flower bed as a litter box.

In short the derringer is not my prefered self defense weapon, but it will do in a pinch.
 
The OP's experience does not match mine....

Trigger pull was heavy enough that a weak handed user would have problems getting any accuracy at all from the piece....the wife of a friend had to use two fingers, to get it to fire...

Buckshot loads designed for the Judge by Federal, failed to penetrate 1" fence rails at 15 feet. The spread was a uniform 6" at that distance, but I don't recall the size of the shot.

.45 Colt "Cowboy" action shooter loads keyholed at the same distance but did penetrate the fence rail previously mentioned...they grouped, if you can call it that, into 3".

The friend who brought it out to the farm for an initial try-out sold it off for about the same money he had in it...and bought a Smith Chief's special for his wife with grips that fit her hands.

Rod
 
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