Taurus 38+P vs 357 - pressure handling

I remember Skeeter Skelton writing about doing this very thing "back in the day." He had .357 guns, and bags full of 38 brass from the police training range. So he loaded low end .357 loads in the 38 brass. Probably wore the brass out pretty quick, but I doubt he cared about that.

No, I wouldn't do it. I'm not all that fastinated with shooting .357 ammo. I've got 100 rounds of the factory stuff I've had forever and have no idea when/if I'll ever shoot it.
 
I have no idea what percentage of guns fail in the proofing process, but I highly doubt Taurus proofs their .38s at the same pressures as their .357s.
 
Elmer probably had a cigar,a hat and a room full of guns and replacement parts... but I don't think he had a lab and pressure testing equipment. He didn't even have a chrono.
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That just means the things he did were foolish and dangerous too.

The fact others do or did things doesn't make those things wise nor safe.
 
There is nothing wrong with experimenting, but those who do so without a solid understanding of the issues involved and the possible ramifications can expect to have experiments go wrong. Fortunately, a blown up gun is not in the same category as a bio experiment that lets nasty bugs out in the air, but it can harm the experimenter or anyone close to him when things go awry.

Also fortunately, most modern guns are way over designed, capable of taking a lot more pressure than any responsible hand-loader would ever call on them to contain. But that does not mean they can't blow. But if one has safe test facilities and the money to write off a few guns that failed, I say go to it.

Just remember that because a hot load in, say, .38 S&W, is OK in an S&W M&P Victory Model, doesn't mean it will be OK in an old breaktop revolver with cylinder walls the thickness of printer paper. So "spreading the word" about some super-hot load could mean a trip to court when someone loses a hand or eye trying to duplicate the results.

Jim
 
Elmer probably had a cigar,a hat and a room full of guns and replacement parts... but I don't think he had a lab and pressure testing equipment. He didn't even have a chrono.
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Bet he damaged more than a couple guns in his day, and ran his tests in a way that he was shielded from potential damag as well.
 
Totally agree, and the OP is not Elmer Keith, but the world is not black and white, there is a place for experimenting in this hobby.
 
As far as loading 357 magnum type loads in 38 special cases, the Lyman bullet # 358156 was designed to do just that. It is a gas checked semi-wadcutter that has TWO crimp grooves, placed exactly far enough apart to be used for reloading 38 special loads in 38 brass or 357 magnum loads in 38 special . This is the bullet Skeeter used.
I have done it myself for years. 38 special brass was plentiful, picked up hundreds each trip to public range. Few reloaders then. Didn't see many 357 magnum cases back then. But I had a 357 Ruger Blackhawk and being young wanted to shoot magnums...so I got that mould and gas checks.
It works perfectly, and can use that one bullet for 38 special and 357 magnum. No danger in it.
Gary
 
But I had a 357 Ruger Blackhawk and being young wanted to shoot magnums...so I got that mould and gas checks.

It works perfectly, and can use that one bullet for 38 special and 357 magnum. No danger in it.
Gary
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Of course there's no danger in super hot 38 loads in a 357 revolver

The OP wants to do them in a 38 Spcl
 
with strengthened cases (i.e. trimmed 357), any reason why you can't push the pressure on the 38+P revolvers ?
i personally think there is no reason to limit a modern Taurus 38 to 18k of pressure. I am sure it can handle loads easily in to the 9mm territory.
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I don't believe there is any difference between the heat treating or tempering of 38 special and .357 Magnum CASES. As for trying to shoot ULTRA hot 38 special ammo in your Taurus, I see no reason to so so.But understand if you do so this COULD shorten the life of your revolver.

For information only the original load for the 38/44 heavy duties was 12 – 12.5 grains of 2400. Which gave a muzzle velocity of 1,100 FPS
 
I wondered when somebody would remember the .38-44 HV.

I note that Colt "rated" ALL their .38 Special revolvers for it, all the way down to the little Police Positive Special. I guess they figured you would get tired of shooting it before the gun wore out prematurely.

S&W only listed the .38-44 for the Heavy Duty, Outdoorsman, and .357 Magnum; NOT the M&P.

Consider what design the Taurus revolvers are based on.

Y'all be careful, now, you hear?
 
I guess reading the thread was to time consuming
It works perfectly, and can use that one bullet for 38 special and 357 magnum. No danger in it.
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what the op wants t do is OBVIUOSLY not safe. it doesn't mean he can't do it safely with a ransom rest and long string, but he didn't sound he like he was willing o bow up his revolver, nor does he seem like he has lots of extras laying around. of course there is place for experimentation, but these "experiments" occurred many decades ago and thats why gun are chambered in what they are chambered for. the factory did the "experiments" for us and then kindly stamped the results on the side of the barrel
 
thanks for all the comments.
the bottom line is i like to know the physical limits of something even though i'll potentially not get close. it's the knowledge of where that red line is etc.
i'm in I.T. and tend to like knowing how something works under the hook so to speak.
 
I have a Taurus 82 (38 Spl) built in 1994 and it looks like it can take anything. But it wasn't until 1997 that Taurus started making their 38 Spl's to do 38 Spl +P's. While it might be possible to do +P in this gun, I would not take the chance of ruining such a beautiful firearm. It is not the cylinder that you have to worry about but the crane that will warp and distort under the additional pressures and really mess up the timing of the cylinder as well as messing up the forcing cone.

If you will look at the new 38 Spl's that Taurus is coming out with, they all have a full (reinforced) under barrel guide that provides extra strength for the revolver to handle +P loads. And I believe that they are marked 38 Spl +P.

You can do what you want, but I would not do so for a revolver made for 38 Spl's only.

Just my take on the matter.
Jim

 
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