Survival Rifle Scenario

L

lonegunman

New member
This may have been done already but...

Lets say you are about to dumped out into unknown territory, any where in the world.

You can have one rifle (not shotgun) and all the ammo you can tote.

You will have to fend totally for yourself, including finding food, and fending off man and beast.

What would you pick?
 
Thats easy........The "AK". In the situation you describe, I would only have 2 desires. 1. Super Reliability and "Combat Accurate" within 150 yards. I would run from anything further out than that.. he he
 
AK. Most common weapon in 3rd-world countries, seen them carried everywhere. Lots of ammo & parts available.

Rugged, dependable, don't need to baby them. Can hit what you want out to 100yards for hunting needs as well as to keep enemies' heads down while you "skedadle".
 
Why would you guys pick such a big caliber...

the scenario also (and more likely) would involve using the rifle to obtain food...

I was really thinking a 22 mag wouldnt be a bad choice, if hunting small game is also going to be done.
 
oh what the hey....

I'll play to...

Agree on the .22 comment. Likely, you'ld be eatin' a lot more squirrels, birds, and rabbits than deer and elk. As much as I like my M-14 clone better, I'd say a .223 with a .22 LR conversion. AR pattern, mini, or AK pattern depending on your preference..I'd likely go with the Mini for reliability's sake, but AR pattern makes a lot of sense to.

Or, if we can cheat and take a .22 pistol, then the AK sounds great... or better yet, an M1A :D


-K
 
Well ... somehow it sounds like you figure that unknown means south ... I think I'd go with the 7.62x51 (or maybe the 7.62x39) in any of the reliable semis. You can always take a squirrel with a light handload or a full power head shot, but those pesky big bears in the North wouldn't be too impressed by a .22! The reason I qualified the AK/SKS choice was that I'm not too sure that those beasts would be too impressed with them either, although at close range (I'm in the tree and he's shaking it!) a 7.62x39 would eventually get the message across ... and you CAN carry a LOT more 39's than 51's
 
I have played this game before...Springfield M6 Scout (22LR over .410) As long as I am not being dropped in the middle of African Safari country, I can take anything from birds to rabbits to deer with that.
 
Hi everyone! I am gonna cheat and say my pick would be the savage 24v in .223/12 ga. Ammo will always be readily available for either caliber/gauge, and if in a true survival situation,you are gonna worry way more about eating than about fending off human beings. Besides, the 12 ga. with buck or slugs, or the .223 round will be effective against human adversaries, should the need arise.

Pat Brophy
 
I'de pick a good 22 bolt action with a variable (6-24x) scope. My marlin could make headshots on game the size of rabbits out to 100 yards(in little wind) and chest shots on humanoids at 200 yards easily. Deer will fall if you place a bullet in there ear or eye socket, also aiming for the throat at the brown/white boundry at a broadside shot should place a round in that nice big brain feeding artery contained there, hemeraging to death should be quite quick. besides you can set traps for large and small game alike if you know how. ammo conservation would be high on your to do list if you were not going to be re-supplied. besides a good accurate 22, with human head shots will get you all the ak's you could want.
 
lonegunman has it nailed

Yes, this has been a thread topic several times before.
As I did before, I must again weigh in for the .22 mag.
The 22 mag is adequate for deer (as poachers have proven).
And the .22 LR is adequate for people (as execution squads have proven)

Thus with the initial post conditions of
"You can have one rifle (not shotgun) and all the ammo you can tote. You will have to fend totally for yourself, including finding food, and fending off man and beast. "
Click to expand...
As to the latter conditions, a wise brain can be more effective than a rifle in preventing the worst of those situations and even there a .22 mag could be adequate if appended to a decent intellect. As to the first condition I'm assuming you may be limited to "all the ammo you can tote". This argues heavily against the .223 or any centerfire with heavy brass.

20 rounds of 55 grain American Eagle .223 weighs 232 grams (278g w/box)
20 rounds of 55 grain Remington UMC .223 weighs 229 grams (271g w/box)
50 rounds of 50 grain Federal .22 mag weighs 236 grams (284g w/box)
50 rounds of 40 grain Winchester .22 mag weighs 210 grams (220g w/box)
50 rounds of 40 grain Aguila .22 LR weighs 168 grams (184g w/box)
The box of .223 occupies 270cc of space, the .22 mag measures 153 cc though they could be tightly packed like a box of Wolf 7.62x39
20 rounds of 122 grain Wolf 7.62 x 39 weighs 328 grams(336 g w/box)
and only occupies 135 cc of space - HALF that of the fancy boxes.
Soooo...
Six pounds of ammo without their fancy boxes would be:
240 rounds of 55 grain .223 or
580 rounds of 50 grain .22 mag or
650 rounds of 40 grain .22 mag
800 rounds of 40 grain .22 LR

But if you instead tote .223 reloading supplies to reuse that heavy brass.
(but how much does a simple reloader weigh? And the hassle in the field?)

Then again, the .22 conversion for the .223 rifle may be just the ticket
IF it is reasonably accurate with .22 LR.
Is there a .22 mag conversion?
Just what are the exact diameters of .22 LR, .22 mag, and .223?

If you're depending on finding more ammo - .22 LR and .223 would be best. But if your limited to what you can tote and still have an adequate hunting round then 22 mag is the best.

As to the rifle for .22mag
- either my bolt action Mossberg or my semi-auto Marlin. If I had to grab one or the other, it'd be the latter cuz I've scoped it (now if I could find hi-cap mags for it;-)
 
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.22's are fine for small prey. What if YOU become the prey?

And I don't mean just the four-legged kind.

I'd rather have the firepower and not need it, than to need it and not have it.
 
If we are the prey

Having lots of firepower would be the next best solution to not being there.
I'd prefer a 12 gauge with 3 1/2" magnums loaded with slugs or buckshot or
a full auto .308 with expanding bullets (screw conventions when TSHTF).
BUT
the original post posited "all the ammo you can tote".
If you can only tote
1000 rounds of 55 grain .223 or
400 rounds of 180 grain 30-06 or
2700 rounds of 40-grain .22 mag or
3400 rounds of 40-grain .22 LR

and if your needs are more than 400 rounds, your 30-06 is a club
and if your needs are more than 1000 rounds, your .223 is a club.
Similarly, the .22 is an awkward club when over 3000 rounds are gone.
Eventually you will run out of ammo.
Maybe a pellet caster and a hand-pumped pellet rifle would be better.
Maybe a bow and arrow would be better, or a spear.
Personally, I'd rather have a .22 rifle AND a spear and/or sword (depending on whether it's for hunting or fighting).

Actually, this whole idea of hunting for survival is a real stretch since there won't be enough game out there after TSHTF to survive on. A real sobering history lesson on this can be had by reading "Guns, Germs and Steel" or realizing that big game was nearly wiped out of Colorado during the gold rush days (and now we have a hundred times the population)
 
On foot, alone, in the middle of nowhere, anywhere on the planet?

I'd leave the Assult Toys at home. This calls for a real shootin' iron.

A 21" light weight accurized boltaction blackened stainless .308 with open sights, a rear peep, accepting stripper clips, a rugged scope in the range of 2-10x42 with an illuminated aiming point, and a good return-to-zero mount. Rifle, scope, sling, and mounts no more than 8 1/4 lbs. For foraging small game a chamber insert in .32 ACP. Ammo: a minimum of 200 rds of .308 and 100 rds of .32 ACP, but it'd really depends on what else I'd have to carry. -- Kernel
 
one more addendum and I gotta hit the sack

Here is a TFL thread on the .22 used as a sniper rifle
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=59079&highlight=.22+sniper

If you're dumped in AK-47 country (which is most of the world and even in the USA), then that would be a good choice. BUT a profusion of AK's would also likely imply an unstable political and survival situation. Personally, given my temperment and socialness, I'd get the heck out of there and find someplace in the backcountry where people are not so plentiful and combative. Out where a .22 report would not be noticed much.

Now what was this about a .32acp conversion for a .308?
the .32acp is .312 in diameter versus the .308.
Might it work with an AK-47 if its bore runs a bit large?

There are chamber inserts for 30-06 to take 7.62 x 39.

How about an over and under in .22 and .308?
Nah, that's cheatin'!
 
Survival Gun

I would go to one of the european gunmakers and have a O/U Rifle /Shotgun combo made. The rifle would be in 30-06 and the shotgun in 12 GA. This would be able to handle anything on the North American continent. Then I would have an insert barrel made for the 12 ga to fire .223 for small game.

Simple beak action gun made with the best materials and capable of shooting three very common calibers. The shotgun could fire slugs if you shoot something the 30-06 can't drop and it charges you :eek:


This of course would be pricey, about $8000:rolleyes:


Geoff Ross
 
I have to go with a M1A Scout type. Even if I had just 60 rounds I wouldn't waste any. One shot stops on everything and trust me as far as fighting men goes in the jungle, I'm still just one guy who will be doing rearguard retreat actions everytime I encountered some hostiles. Plus a couple of well placed 308 rounds at 400yd will probably dissuade followers ;) .
I think 3600 rounds of 22LR's is kind of moot because even with that volume of squirrel shot you couldn't stand off toe to toe with a fire team bent on your destruction. They would catch you in the middle of fumbling through reloding your magazine tube. :p
 
An AK is an exquisite bullet hose.... for most any other purpose you'd need a rifle for (excepting boat anchor) it's only slightly better than useless. It's to dang heavy, underpowered, unwieldy, and only shoots minute-of-barn-door. I'd feel sorely undergunned if I was forced to use an AK as a general purpose survival rifle.

For the .308 Win MCA Sports makes chamber adapters in .32 ACP, .7.62x39, .30 Carbine, .30 Luger, .30 Mauser, and .32 Short Colt/Long Colt/H&R Mag. I figure .32 ACP would be adequate for small game, low report (from a 21" barrel probably quieter than an Adult Airgun), and available worldwide. But what the heck, get one of each, .30 Russian and .30 Carbine are both near universal and the chamber adapters only weight about as much as one round of ammunition. -- Kernel
 
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