Survival Gun
- Thread starter BarryLee
- Start date
stephen426
New member
As already mentioned, survival can be interpreted in many ways. If South Florida got hammered by another hurricane like Andrew, survival would probably be my neighbors blocking off the entrances to our communities and checking IDs for people coming in. We would probably have our AR-15 with a large sidearm on our hip.
If you are talking about lost in the woods, I would say a .357 magnum or .44 magnum would deter most critters in North America. If you are talking about food, .22 LR would get you some small game without scaring everything away.
On an interesting note, some survivalists say that higher powered air rifles are the best for hunting small game since ammo is VERY cheap, A LOT of it can be carried (no propellant or shell casings to worry about), and it is much quieter than a firearm. My parents' house was getting over run with iguanas. They were tearing up all the vegetation and crapping all over the place. I started popping them with a .22 air rifle but moved up to a .25 caliber Benjamin Trail NP XL. This thing has some serious punch and is pretty quiet. You could probably pop squirrels one after another and not spook them.
If you are talking about lost in the woods, I would say a .357 magnum or .44 magnum would deter most critters in North America. If you are talking about food, .22 LR would get you some small game without scaring everything away.
On an interesting note, some survivalists say that higher powered air rifles are the best for hunting small game since ammo is VERY cheap, A LOT of it can be carried (no propellant or shell casings to worry about), and it is much quieter than a firearm. My parents' house was getting over run with iguanas. They were tearing up all the vegetation and crapping all over the place. I started popping them with a .22 air rifle but moved up to a .25 caliber Benjamin Trail NP XL. This thing has some serious punch and is pretty quiet. You could probably pop squirrels one after another and not spook them.
Unlicensed Dremel
Moderator
Guys, he did specify, in a roundabout way, that he meant "subsistence survival", with no or essentially no self-defense element (he said "wilderness") - so although that's a good topic, why don't we focus on what he asked - strictly subsistence (i.e. game getting) survival. I stand by my answer above (Savage 24) until I can afford "my" 3 barrel drilling, which is of course THE ultimate subsistence survival gun.**
**Each barrel is 22" long.
--Bottom center barrel is 12 ga 3.5", with multiple choke tubes.
--Upper left barrel is .223 rem, 1 in 8 twist with the first 17" rifled at .224, and the last 5" of the barrel opened up to about .320, with "straight rifling", to un-spin .22lr and .22 mag shotshells fired with chamber adapters
--Upper right barrel is in .280 AI, 1 in 8.7 twist
--front bead and halfway bead for wingshooting; QD scope for the other uses.
Most versatile gun ever made (if it was made). Birdshot, buckshot, forster slugs, .223 rem heavy bullets, .22lr, .22l, .22s, .22 shot, .22 mag, .22mag shot, .280 rem, and .280 AI - it will chamber and shoot all those, effectively and accurately, with just two chamber adapters (which I already have). Birds to buffalo, it will git 'er dun.
**Each barrel is 22" long.
--Bottom center barrel is 12 ga 3.5", with multiple choke tubes.
--Upper left barrel is .223 rem, 1 in 8 twist with the first 17" rifled at .224, and the last 5" of the barrel opened up to about .320, with "straight rifling", to un-spin .22lr and .22 mag shotshells fired with chamber adapters
--Upper right barrel is in .280 AI, 1 in 8.7 twist
--front bead and halfway bead for wingshooting; QD scope for the other uses.
Most versatile gun ever made (if it was made). Birdshot, buckshot, forster slugs, .223 rem heavy bullets, .22lr, .22l, .22s, .22 shot, .22 mag, .22mag shot, .280 rem, and .280 AI - it will chamber and shoot all those, effectively and accurately, with just two chamber adapters (which I already have). Birds to buffalo, it will git 'er dun.
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Pond James Pond
New member
It's hard to choose which I'd go for. For me the alternative scenario to "survival" gun is the old favourite: "if you could only keep one" gun.
I have a candidate for each category listed. Admittedly, the .22LR in a rifle has enough power to drop a person, small game or even a deer. Lb for lb, you can carry stacks of shots: 1000rds or .22lr would be about the same as 200 rds of 9mm, although reloading is not possible.
In the handgun category, it is really tough: I have a choice of SP-01 in 9mm where I have ease of reload, capacity and availability, levelled at the clout, mechanical sturdiness and reloading flexibility of my .44Mag. Hard to chose, but I think the hunting potential of the Redhawk, with a shoulder stock grip would be a pretty awesome piece.
For the other category, I have a choice of shotgun or centrefire rifle in .223 or .308. As much as I love my .308 bolt gun, I think the .223 AR is sturdy enough, with sufficient range and with ammo that is portable enough to make it the better choice.
Now which would I choose? No idea.
But I will say that Daryl Dixon makes a strong case for the arrow: you can carry ten and, as long as they don't break or get lost, you have a 1000!
I have a candidate for each category listed. Admittedly, the .22LR in a rifle has enough power to drop a person, small game or even a deer. Lb for lb, you can carry stacks of shots: 1000rds or .22lr would be about the same as 200 rds of 9mm, although reloading is not possible.
In the handgun category, it is really tough: I have a choice of SP-01 in 9mm where I have ease of reload, capacity and availability, levelled at the clout, mechanical sturdiness and reloading flexibility of my .44Mag. Hard to chose, but I think the hunting potential of the Redhawk, with a shoulder stock grip would be a pretty awesome piece.
For the other category, I have a choice of shotgun or centrefire rifle in .223 or .308. As much as I love my .308 bolt gun, I think the .223 AR is sturdy enough, with sufficient range and with ammo that is portable enough to make it the better choice.
Now which would I choose? No idea.
But I will say that Daryl Dixon makes a strong case for the arrow: you can carry ten and, as long as they don't break or get lost, you have a 1000!
22-rimfire
New member
Survival....
My answer is it depends. If it is a matter of a few days, no firearm is needed or if it makes you feel better, something practical for self defense.
If it is a matter of a few weeks, my choice would be a handy bolt action rifle in 22 WMR. I doubt you're going to be burning up much ammo short of a self defense situation. A 100 rounds of 22 mag would be all that is needed and that is probably more than 2x what you need.
A few years.... better get the survival "wheel barrow" out.... I'd want far more than I could carry. I'm staying home.
My answer is it depends. If it is a matter of a few days, no firearm is needed or if it makes you feel better, something practical for self defense.
If it is a matter of a few weeks, my choice would be a handy bolt action rifle in 22 WMR. I doubt you're going to be burning up much ammo short of a self defense situation. A 100 rounds of 22 mag would be all that is needed and that is probably more than 2x what you need.
A few years.... better get the survival "wheel barrow" out.... I'd want far more than I could carry. I'm staying home.
Pond James Pond
New member
And another thing...
I've just read up on subsequent posts and the reference to subsistence living, then .22LR is the clear choice.
However, if I am able to carry a rifle on my shoulder, I'm able to carry a gun on my hip.
I can play by the rules of the poll and say .22LR, or I can speak honestly: If I was going to be stuck in a tight spot, I'd grab my .22LR, stuff a brick in a bag and wear my Redhawk on my belt with a box of 50 rds in said bag.
Enough to cover all bases for anything up to a month, IMHO, and still be in the realms of realistic burden.
I've just read up on subsequent posts and the reference to subsistence living, then .22LR is the clear choice.
However, if I am able to carry a rifle on my shoulder, I'm able to carry a gun on my hip.
I can play by the rules of the poll and say .22LR, or I can speak honestly: If I was going to be stuck in a tight spot, I'd grab my .22LR, stuff a brick in a bag and wear my Redhawk on my belt with a box of 50 rds in said bag.
Enough to cover all bases for anything up to a month, IMHO, and still be in the realms of realistic burden.
If your survival depends on stopping people from harming you, I would agree. Otherwise, not so much.
Just out of curiosity, anyone actually hunted small game with a service pistol?
I find it tough enough with a .22 pistol.
Now, SHOT shells in a service pistol make some sense, but you will have better accuracy, and way more shots for the same bulk of ammo with a .22.
A 9mm+p+ JHP will do a lot, but if its only squirrels about will anything but a head shot be worth it? And can you and a service pistol make that head shot?
2" at 25yds can be a clean miss on a squirrel.
Forget, for a moment, easy to pack, if you are talking about food to live on, a rifle is better than a pistol, unless you are an excellent pistol shot. And a .22 is better because you can have more ammo. You WILL miss. Count on it. PLAN on it.
For most survival situations, you would be better off using trapping skills for small game than hunting them with a gun.
The Combo guns like the Savage 24 are tough to beat for utility. Camp gun, something packed in the plane or the boat, for emergencies, something capable of taking about anything you run across (with the right ammo), until you get found, or walk out, pretty good choice.
So is the USAF survival combo .22/410 (not sure what the current maker calls them), and is even smaller and lighter than the savage.
Maybe, this MIGHT be a useful niche for the .45/410 guns like the Judge. Assuming you accept the drawback of bulky ammo...
SALT might just be a vital thing. How much of a deer are you going to eat before its rotted? Being able to salt and smoke meat might be of great benefit, as well.
A deer gun when there are no deer is so much useless weight. A couple of deer SHELLS for a small game gun is much less burden, and still useful if you get lucky.
A .22 is about the most useful I can think of, particularly when mated with a shotgun. Also think about some flare shells for the shotgun. The old "3 shots in a row = distress" signaling works for searchers ON FOOT. The guys trying to find you from a helicopter won't hear them. Sending up a flare (or tracer?) stands a better chance of being noticed.
However, be prudent, certainly someone will notice the forest fire you might start, but may NOT notice you...also, if you DO burn down the north woods, to signal for help, you will be expected to pay for it.
I voted for "something else" --- which would be the Sterling Mark 4 {L2A3} Type 2, 9mm carbine, because it is a compact carbine that can fully function with the stock folded, the ease of acquiring 9mm ammo and it's 34 round magazine.
Do not use STEN magazines in the Sterling, due to a risk of premature detonation.
I was fortunate to buy a Sterling Type 2, before the Maryland gun ban came in.
The welds on some Sterling magwells are a weak point...so it is preferred not to put hand excessive hand pressure on the magazine; while it is inserted into the magwell.
The two tiny stock pins {that connect the buttstock to the receiver} should be LockTighted in, so as to keep them from sliding out.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qw5_QEBWg6g
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xB-IzdsenQ
Do not use STEN magazines in the Sterling, due to a risk of premature detonation.
I was fortunate to buy a Sterling Type 2, before the Maryland gun ban came in.
The welds on some Sterling magwells are a weak point...so it is preferred not to put hand excessive hand pressure on the magazine; while it is inserted into the magwell.
The two tiny stock pins {that connect the buttstock to the receiver} should be LockTighted in, so as to keep them from sliding out.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qw5_QEBWg6g
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xB-IzdsenQ
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I stand by my Savage or Stevens O/U, though I might opt for a .222 over a .410 in lieu of a .22 LR or .22 mag. Why? Having a handy dandy Lee portable loader for one and better ballistics for game (food) taking.
When I think survival weapon, given my 63 years of age, I lean more towards survival in remote woods, more so than surviving a nuclear holocaust or a coup in this country.
When I think survival weapon, given my 63 years of age, I lean more towards survival in remote woods, more so than surviving a nuclear holocaust or a coup in this country.
USMC 77-81
New member
Kel tec SU 16.
I wasn't thinking EMP - more along the lines of a hurricane or tornado, since we've actually experienced those in my are before. The bottom line is that I would have to get the family out of town for a minimum of a month if our residence is actually impacted.
During Charlie, we had no electricity for 2 solid weeks at my house; no generator, and even if we had a generator, it wouldn't have mattered much. I had to drive 2 hours just to buy a chainsaw. Trees were down everywhere - many houses were damaged or destroyed and my yard was a swamp for about 2 weeks.
We had a huge influx of roofers, tree trimmers, etc. into our area looking for work, or at least that's what they claimed. One pulled up into my driveway with a shotgun laying in his passenger seat and yelled "hey buddy, if you pay me $1,000, I'll take all that debris away...". No thanks!
Looking back, we would have been a lot better off getting my wife and kid out of town and leaving me to deal with house. This is one reason we now have a place to go if this were to happen again.
When hoards of people are traveling the highways trying to get out of the way of a natural disaster (or just looking for gas, supplies, chainsaws, etc.), I think you better be thinking personal protection primary and then hunting, etc. secondary. This is why I choose a pistol over a rifle - way more practical.
Hurricanes, floods and tornadoes are a much more real problem for me than EMP attacks or the like. If the latter were to occur, I would see no reason not to simply stay put. But, trying to recover from a Hurricane struck area is a major pain in the butt. Just 2 weeks in sweltering, swampy heat with no electricity with a toddler and I learned to really appreciate cool, dry shelter away from all of the chaos.
Very sound advice.
Traditionally when we talk of a wilderness survival gun, the focus is on the greatest utility as a game getter for the size of package (gun & ammo).
Wilderness survival means you are out there all on your own. Alone usually, or with other survivors of what ever disaster put you there (plane crash, etc)
Having to defend yourself during flight from disaster is a different matter. Maybe having to fight to get to that wilderness is a much different matter, and the survival/living off the land game gun isn't the best choice possible there.
Also, if everybody and their uncle Max, and their little dog too is in the woods with you, it may be wild, but its no longer "wilderness", to me.
If you are pack camping and get lost, if your truck breaks an axle, if your light plane crash lands, your horse breaks a leg, or is eaten by predators or runs off, or your boat gets broke, miles and miles from anyone, and you have to survive (eat) long enough to walk out, or to be found, the game gun is the right choice for a gun.
If the threat is two legged, a different gun is called for, and having both would be best.
OhioAmerican
Inactive
2 of them
I will take a Ruger 10-22 for small games and a Glock 17L for side arm.
I will take a Ruger 10-22 for small games and a Glock 17L for side arm.
Something Else: 12 Gauge Shotgun
If I could only have one gun, it would have to be the above. Self defense against just about anything. Hunt anything from birds on up. The variety of ammunition loads for various game is almost unlimited. It is a common ammo with availability and easy to reload. The only possible negatives are range and bulk of ammo.
If I could only have one gun, it would have to be the above. Self defense against just about anything. Hunt anything from birds on up. The variety of ammunition loads for various game is almost unlimited. It is a common ammo with availability and easy to reload. The only possible negatives are range and bulk of ammo.