I have have an old Bushmaster AR-15 with the removable handle. I currently have a standard scope mounted on top of the handle, and obviously it is too high to be comfortable. I would like to put a good optic on the flat top of the receiver. I have thought about a red dot, but I think I would like a little more precision than the dot offers, for shooting coyotes and varmints, etc. I would sure appreciate any and all suggestions, including red dots. Thanks!
Suggestions on optic for AR-15
- Thread starter waddy
- Start date
I have this Vortex 3x prism scope https://www.amazon.com/Vortex-Optics-Spitfire-Prism-Scope/dp/B00HYRGNLM/ref=sr_1_2?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIkorsqIDj4wIViZ6fCh2AzQntEAAYASAAEgKJTfD_BwE&hvadid=190492096245&hvdev=t&hvlocphy=9028740&hvnetw=g&hvpos=1t1&hvqmt=e&hvrand=15675153442567250384&hvtargid=kwd-310387129402&hydadcr=9656_9895527&keywords=vortex+3x+prism&qid=1564708295&s=gateway&sr=8-2 that works well.
There are better options by Burris, Primary Arms, etc that offer better magnification and battery life but the Vortex is what I have experience with.
Below is what the Vortex looks like on my AR
There are better options by Burris, Primary Arms, etc that offer better magnification and battery life but the Vortex is what I have experience with.
Below is what the Vortex looks like on my AR
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The best all around optic for an AR is a conventional scope with 1X or 1.5X on the low end. Something like a 1-4X or 1-6X is faster than irons or dot sights up close when on 1X, and 4X is enough magnification for at LEAST 300 yards. 6X will get you out to 500-600 yards.
They make them with illuminated reticles that perform the same function as a dot sight. I have one, but will probably NEVER turn on the dot. In low light you can see the dot, but it makes it harder to see the target. Without the dot turned on I have plenty of light. I killed a deer last season 5 minutes into legal shooting time. And could have done so 10-15 minutes before that.
The sky is the limit depending on your budget. Leupold makes a 1" tube 1.5-4X20 scope that sells for about $200. Or you could spend $1000+.
I like a 30mm tube for this, and have this one in addition to the Leupold and a couple of Nikons.
https://www.swfa.com/vortex-1-6x24-strike-eagle-30mm-rifle-scope-magpul-salt-kit.html?___SID=U
The Nikon
https://www.swfa.com/nikon-1-4x24-m-tactical-30mm-riflescope-179153.html?___SID=U
I've tried the straight up dot sights, don't like 'em.
They make them with illuminated reticles that perform the same function as a dot sight. I have one, but will probably NEVER turn on the dot. In low light you can see the dot, but it makes it harder to see the target. Without the dot turned on I have plenty of light. I killed a deer last season 5 minutes into legal shooting time. And could have done so 10-15 minutes before that.
The sky is the limit depending on your budget. Leupold makes a 1" tube 1.5-4X20 scope that sells for about $200. Or you could spend $1000+.
I like a 30mm tube for this, and have this one in addition to the Leupold and a couple of Nikons.
https://www.swfa.com/vortex-1-6x24-strike-eagle-30mm-rifle-scope-magpul-salt-kit.html?___SID=U
The Nikon
https://www.swfa.com/nikon-1-4x24-m-tactical-30mm-riflescope-179153.html?___SID=U
I've tried the straight up dot sights, don't like 'em.
I happen to be a fan of fixed low power prism sights at the moment. Vortex makes a decent one. I have a primary arms 2.5x. I like it, I personally think you get a lot of optic for the money. The acss reticle is... well it’s busy. I don’t mind it so much as the large outer ring works great with the bindon aiming concept. It’s when I’m trying to hit small targets at 300 yards that the reticle becomes somewhat of a cumberance.
Thanks for all the suggestions, I really appreciate them. I was going to remove the handle and just use the flattop receiver, but then I realized the front sight is in the way and it is not readily removable. I can use the iron sights through my present mounts, and the scope is a pretty fair scope with just a duplex cross hair. I may just leave well enough alone for the present. Still keeping your suggestions firmly in mind though!!
I am in the Vortex line of sight-I also have the 3xSpitfire on my AR-I have shot at 100 yards and it does pretty well-300 would be whole different story-standing in the back of our living room I can place the Patio size door completely in the sight-would make it a little hard to miss someone coming thru.
bamaranger
New member
what works for me
Though the red dot and all its guises is still quite the rage for an AR pattern rifle, I prefer a low power, variable like 1-4x, or 1.5-5x size, with a standard duplex reticle. Additionally, though 30mm tubes are all the in thing as well, I like a 1" tube, as they are generally a bit more compact and lighter.
Let me add right now that you not need concern yourself with the front sight tower on your rifle. Simple mount your conventional scope with one of the various ring sets or mounts that raise the scope off the rail a bit. An example of this mount is the Burris PEPR mount, or the Nikon (paired) P-series rings. Additionally, if your scope is tidy enough (another reason for 1" tubes) you can mount a simple BUIS rear under the ocular (rear) bell. In the odd event your tidy low powered variable fails, you can remove it with either the quick detach system for your base, or in the case of the P-series, with a hex key. I keep the correct hex key taped to my rifle. You may see a wee bit of the sight tower in your field of view on the lowest power setting of the scope, but not enough to distract or disturb aim. On the top end, the tower will likely not be visible at all.
A dot is very fast at close range, but I feel I do not give up much speed with a low power conventional scope. As I am not doing entries in dim light, the extra speed and visibility of a dot really holds little advantage for me. The precision offered with 4x or 5x at ranges beyond 100 yds on smaller targets is a decided plus over dots. Yes, I can hit larger targets with a dot at 100 yds, and beyond, but on a smaller target, say a varmints noggin or a coke can, the magnification offered on a variable is attractive.
Finally, let me mention cost. I can get a perfectly satisfactory, tough as nails low powered variable for $225 or so, and it will not need batteries, ever. I do not believe I can get a dot of similar durability for that price. And it will need batteries, some day.
Though the red dot and all its guises is still quite the rage for an AR pattern rifle, I prefer a low power, variable like 1-4x, or 1.5-5x size, with a standard duplex reticle. Additionally, though 30mm tubes are all the in thing as well, I like a 1" tube, as they are generally a bit more compact and lighter.
Let me add right now that you not need concern yourself with the front sight tower on your rifle. Simple mount your conventional scope with one of the various ring sets or mounts that raise the scope off the rail a bit. An example of this mount is the Burris PEPR mount, or the Nikon (paired) P-series rings. Additionally, if your scope is tidy enough (another reason for 1" tubes) you can mount a simple BUIS rear under the ocular (rear) bell. In the odd event your tidy low powered variable fails, you can remove it with either the quick detach system for your base, or in the case of the P-series, with a hex key. I keep the correct hex key taped to my rifle. You may see a wee bit of the sight tower in your field of view on the lowest power setting of the scope, but not enough to distract or disturb aim. On the top end, the tower will likely not be visible at all.
A dot is very fast at close range, but I feel I do not give up much speed with a low power conventional scope. As I am not doing entries in dim light, the extra speed and visibility of a dot really holds little advantage for me. The precision offered with 4x or 5x at ranges beyond 100 yds on smaller targets is a decided plus over dots. Yes, I can hit larger targets with a dot at 100 yds, and beyond, but on a smaller target, say a varmints noggin or a coke can, the magnification offered on a variable is attractive.
Finally, let me mention cost. I can get a perfectly satisfactory, tough as nails low powered variable for $225 or so, and it will not need batteries, ever. I do not believe I can get a dot of similar durability for that price. And it will need batteries, some day.
Bamaranger, thanks for the comments, especially concerning the front sight post. My old Bushmaster is the Model X15-E2s, and the front sight post contains the gasport, and is non-removable, for practical purposes. It sticks right up there proudly!! The rear sight is in the handle, and I can use the stock iron sights through the handle mount. I would like to put on one of the Leupold FX-II's on, but I want to keep the ability to have BUIS's. I may just have to learn to love the present mounting system. I really appreciate yours and everyone's comments and suggestions.
bamaranger
New member
front sight tower
Yes, my sole AR has a fixed front sight tower with gas block , just like yours. The upper receiver also has the standard slotted rail, to which a carry handle containing irons could be attached.
What I am suggesting you try is ditch the carry handle, mount a low power variable as described earlier, and assemble so that an affordable BUIS could be fitted at the same time. The BUIS is used if the scope/mount system were removed due to failure of same.
Mounting a scope on top of a carry is not a recommended practice these days, though it was the only option before rails. Yeah, I guess it could work, but it would look goofy, and you'd need some arrangement for a high cheek weld as well, more goofiness.
Try it, you'll not be sorry.
Yes, my sole AR has a fixed front sight tower with gas block , just like yours. The upper receiver also has the standard slotted rail, to which a carry handle containing irons could be attached.
What I am suggesting you try is ditch the carry handle, mount a low power variable as described earlier, and assemble so that an affordable BUIS could be fitted at the same time. The BUIS is used if the scope/mount system were removed due to failure of same.
Mounting a scope on top of a carry is not a recommended practice these days, though it was the only option before rails. Yeah, I guess it could work, but it would look goofy, and you'd need some arrangement for a high cheek weld as well, more goofiness.
Try it, you'll not be sorry.
bamaranger
New member
clarification
Just to be clear, a back up REAR sight only.
And a scope on top of the carry handle.....verbotten.
Just to be clear, a back up REAR sight only.
And a scope on top of the carry handle.....verbotten.
spacemanspiff
New member
There are optic options that can cowitness the iron sights.
bamaranger
New member
co witness
Yes, of course there are. But NOT through the lenses of a low power variable conventional rifle scope, which is what I was suggesting to the OP.
Yes, of course there are. But NOT through the lenses of a low power variable conventional rifle scope, which is what I was suggesting to the OP.
PlatinumCore16
New member
I will give another plus for the prizm scopes. I had the 3x ACSS from Primary Arms and I still have a 5x from them. I liked both, but the 3x is really nice for closer shots using both eyes and still gives enough magnification to make 100+yd shots much easier. The 5x is too much magnification to use with both eyes open, at least for me. Though it does very well shooting at 400+yds. Both nice scopes for their respective uses.
More than likely the front sight block will not cause any problems.
The correct height bases/rings (suggest Warne one-piece base/ring) will set it up high enough to use.
Scope depends on what you want to spend. I will leave high end to others. Low end, I can help.
I am a leupold guy. If you want a little range, their VX-Freedom 2-7x33 is nice. If you want lower power and lighter, VX-Freedom 1.5-5x20.
Good luck.
The correct height bases/rings (suggest Warne one-piece base/ring) will set it up high enough to use.
Scope depends on what you want to spend. I will leave high end to others. Low end, I can help.
I am a leupold guy. If you want a little range, their VX-Freedom 2-7x33 is nice. If you want lower power and lighter, VX-Freedom 1.5-5x20.
Good luck.
Maybe you can try Arken Optics FFP rifle scope SH-4 4-14X44.
This is what I have on my DPMS Oracle. I really like this little unit!
LUCID OPTICS P7 4X Weapons Optic
https://www.lucidoptics.com/p74x.php
LUCID OPTICS P7 4X Weapons Optic
https://www.lucidoptics.com/p74x.php
MTT TL said:
Does it need to be variable, or is a fixed power within that range acceptable?
I have several 2.5x20 shotgun scopes that are less than 8 inches, but not by a lot. They have great depth of field and eye relief. Barska makes one. https://www.opticsplanet.com/barska-2-5x20-compact-contour-30-30-reticle-scope.html
I don't have a Primary Arms 2.5 prismatic, but it seems like a similar idea in a smaller package. https://www.primaryarms.com/primary...-scope-with-patented-cqb-acss-reticle-pac2-5x
The Bushnell Lil P is small, but is billed as a true 1x. A small amount of magnification plus excellent clarity adds more range for me than the magnification alone would suggest. A TA44 is small, but costs more than my first car.
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For my purpose it needs to be variable down to 1X. This has less to do with desire and more to do with an arbitrary requirement that must be met.
I actually have one of those Barska's on my 11/87 slug gun and it works way better than it's price tag would indicate.
My previous solution was an EO Tech with flip aside magnifier but it is now too large.